Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #146

[PnzrIVausf.G]

If it was a situation where a threat was known in advance, I’d get out of the area as fast as I could and/or call 911.

Would your response/reaction be the same if you knew who was walking towards you?

 

[NeverPersonal]

I agree. According to this article, more than a dozen people thought "Bridge Guy" was Ron Logan. That combined with the cell phone pings is pretty damning, but I can't think of any possible explanation for creating an alibi before the crime was public knowledge that's logical conclusion is not "this is the murderer."

I hope I'm quoting this message correctly. He cannot be the murderer for a few simple reasons. I'd say the most obvious one is the fact that Ron Logan is, as you likely know, deceased, and the police have given several interviews saying things along the lines of, "We're going to get him." You can't "get" a dead guy. It is interesting how there is evidence that kind of leads in Ron's direction, but there are multiple things about this case that seem to lead to one or more!! of the men people have discussed as potential suspects. It is a once-in-a-lifetime kind of case, that is for sure.

 

[MistyWaters]

I wanted to say I am confused regarding the motives of this podcast. HOW is this podcast getting these "leaked" documents? Something is fishy, to me.

I wondered that too. A detailed explanation regarding the source of LEs interview with KAK released before that but nada about RL’s search warrant. Was the source even authenticated?

 

[MistyWaters]

Would your response/reaction be the same if you knew who was walking towards you?

This is why I’m hopeful there was additional audio. The type of verbal reaction to an armed stranger versus somebody unknown would likely be quite different. JMO

 

[NeverPersonal]

I wondered that too. A detailed explanation regarding the source of LEs interview with KAK released before that but nada about RL’s search warrant. Was the source even authenticated?

Right. I wonder what their goal is. They seem to want people to think about this case in a certain way. I think it's interesting. Not a podcast person myself so haven't dove too deep into actually listening, but I've read a lot of transcripts. I wonder who their 'source' is of these documents, because I feel like they expect their audience to just eat up whatever is released without questioning 1) who it comes from, 2) how that source has this sort of information, and 3) if it is even legitimate. As a person who enjoys and respects research, as much of a nerd as that makes me sound lol, I would really like some cited sources. At the same time I understand how that could be a problem, so I realize this is multi-faceted. I wish we could know more.

 

[NeverPersonal]

This is why I’m hopeful there was additional audio. The type of verbal reaction to an armed stranger versus somebody unknown would likely be quite different. JMO

There has been much spoken on the additional audio by Abby's mom herself. Can't remember exactly what she said and I can look for the article or video, but I THINK I remember her saying it is irrelevant and kind of waved her hand at it so to speak.

 

[MistyWaters]

I hope I'm quoting this message correctly. He cannot be the murderer for a few simple reasons. I'd say the most obvious one is the fact that Ron Logan is, as you likely know, deceased, and the police have given several interviews saying things along the lines of, "We're going to get him." You can't "get" a dead guy. It is interesting how there is evidence that kind of leads in Ron's direction, but there are multiple things about this case that seem to lead to one or more!! of the men people have discussed as potential suspects. It is a once-in-a-lifetime kind of case, that is for sure.

Yes, there’d be no reason to LE to make it appear they on the verge of ”getting” a dead guy.

As well RL was released from prison Jan 2018. It’d be far too onerous to find the various quotes by LE buried within these threads referring to the perp walking free while RL was still incarcerated, but that’s how he was indirectly cleared by LE IMO. This one by MP is from Aug 2017. He clearly didn’t suspect RL was a prime suspect either.

“All of it keeps Libby German's grandpa, Mike Patty, up at night.

"I don't sleep much," said Patty, knowing that the man in the sketch is walking the streets. "We have a murderer walking around who took two innocent lives well before their time. He robbed them of this life."…”

Police: Delphi murder victims spoke of man behind them in audio played for family

State police say more audio from Libby German's cell phone was played for the victims' families, including a mention of a man they noticed behind them.

www.wthr.com

 

[MistyWaters]

Right. I wonder what their goal is. They seem to want people to think about this case in a certain way. I think it's interesting. Not a podcast person myself so haven't dove too deep into actually listening, but I've read a lot of transcripts. I wonder who their 'source' is of these documents, because I feel like they expect their audience to just eat up whatever is released without questioning 1) who it comes from, 2) how that source has this sort of information, and 3) if it is even legitimate. As a person who enjoys and respects research, as much of a nerd as that makes me sound lol, I would really like some cited sources. At the same time I understand how that could be a problem, so I realize this is multi-faceted. I wish we could know more.

Highly unusual sequence of events on the surface, given the involvement of both ISP and FBI in the multi-agency task force.

FBI search warrant raises questions about Delphi property owner's arrest

DELPHI, Ind. (WISH) — I-Team 8 broke the news on Tuesday about an FBI search warrant that reveals new details about the Delphi murder scene and what the killer of Abby Williams and Libby German may have taken from the property. I-Team 8 has pieced together new information about Ronald Logan, the...

www.wishtv.com

“…..Investigators believe Logan asked his cousin to lie and tell police he drove Logan to an aquarium store in Lafayette on the afternoon of Feb. 13, 2017.

Police would eventually arrest Logan for violating his probation on charges of DUI and driving on a suspended license. He appeared in court March 13 on that charge.

The next day, March 14, an Indiana State Police spokesperson tweeted “reports connecting Ronald Logan to #DelphiMurders is FALSE. Probation Violation; no connection to murder investigation”

However, in a search warrant filed three days later, March 17, an FBI agent wrote, “I believe there is probable cause to believe that RONALD LOGAN has committed the crime of murder and evidence of that can be found on RONALD LOGAN’S property.”…..

……I-Team 8 sent several detailed questions to Indiana State Police about the case and was told they can’t comment on the case.”

 

[m00c0w]

I wondered that too. A detailed explanation regarding the source of LEs interview with KAK released before that but nada about RL’s search warrant. Was the source even authenticated?

The source of the warrant and affidavit was likely RL himself. There are reports of him having handed it out to some media personalities after the warrant was executed. Someone probably had it and passed it along to Murder Sheets since they were doing so well with the KAK docs.

 

[m00c0w]

Highly unusual sequence of events on the surface, given the involvement of both ISP and FBI in the multi-agency task force.

FBI search warrant raises questions about Delphi property owner's arrest

DELPHI, Ind. (WISH) — I-Team 8 broke the news on Tuesday about an FBI search warrant that reveals new details about the Delphi murder scene and what the killer of Abby Williams and Libby German may have taken from the property. I-Team 8 has pieced together new information about Ronald Logan, the...

www.wishtv.com

“…..Investigators believe Logan asked his cousin to lie and tell police he drove Logan to an aquarium store in Lafayette on the afternoon of Feb. 13, 2017.

Police would eventually arrest Logan for violating his probation on charges of DUI and driving on a suspended license. He appeared in court March 13 on that charge.

The next day, March 14, an Indiana State Police spokesperson tweeted “reports connecting Ronald Logan to #DelphiMurders is FALSE. Probation Violation; no connection to murder investigation”

However, in a search warrant filed three days later, March 17, an FBI agent wrote, “I believe there is probable cause to believe that RONALD LOGAN has committed the crime of murder and evidence of that can be found on RONALD LOGAN’S property.”…..

……I-Team 8 sent several detailed questions to Indiana State Police about the case and was told they can’t comment on the case.”

The simplest explanation here is the ISP tweet is being taken out of context 5 years later. RL was arrested, and there was a media circus with rumors that he was arrested because of the Delphi case. The ISP tweet was to directly address those rumors and say he was arrested because of the probation stuff, not murder-related stuff. Not to say he had no connection to the murder, period. Keep in mind, this was back when tweets were only 160 characters.

JMO

 

[Cryptic]

I absolutely don't think Ron Logan did this. It's almost humorous of that FBI agent to suggest that a 77 year old man could be capable of single-handedly killing two girls and then bringing them to a secondary location, staging a scene, and getting away from the scene without anyone seeing him.

I dont think the public at large would find it humorous at all if the FBI failed to investigate via search warrants a 77 year old man who:

- Created a false alibi in advance.
- Lived close to the crime scene.
- Seemed to have a resemblance to the suspected individual as the video depicted him.
- Was said to have a pattern of moderate aggression towards women in his "orbit".

Though I dont think RL was the perpetrator either for the reasons you state, I would still want to search his property given the totality of the above points.

 

[wary]

I agree. According to this article, more than a dozen people thought "Bridge Guy" was Ron Logan. That combined with the cell phone pings is pretty damning, but I can't think of any possible explanation for creating an alibi before the crime was public knowledge that's logical conclusion is not "this is the murderer."

MOO

Okay, I’m going to play devil’s advocate.

1: Considering how fuzzy the BG pictures are, the fact that a dozen people thought it might be RL doesn’t mean much.

2: Considering that the murders were committed on or near RL’s property, the fact that his phone pinged where he lived doesn’t mean much.

3: My understanding is that he tried to create that alibi at about 9:00 am. That’s, as I understand it, about 16 hours after the girls were reported missing. He must have been completely aware by then that there was a serious search going on, and since he definitely had been doing something that would get him put in jail, (driving,) it seems believable that he’d expect someone searching for the girls to come by and ask him questions that he wouldn’t want to answer truthfully. His guilty knowledge may simply have been—he was driving when he wasn’t allowed to be.

MOO

 

[Cryptic]

1: Considering how fuzzy the BG pictures are, the fact that a dozen people thought it might be RL doesn’t mean much.

2: Considering that the murders were committed on or near RL’s property, the fact that his phone pinged where he lived doesn’t mean much.

3: My understanding is that he tried to create that alibi at about 9:00 am. That’s, as I understand it, about 16 hours after the girls were reported missing. He must have been completely aware by then that there was a serious search going on, and since he definitely had been doing something that would get him put in jail, (driving,)...

Well said.

The video resembles RL and..... also resembles a vast legion of upper middle aged or elderly semi rural mid western males. And, as you said, people's phones will ping where they live.

Likewise, I suspect that RL had a long and distinguished history of covering for his string of misdemeanor level mis-deeds with a variety of poorly thought out lies, spins and half truths. As a result, the advance alibi lie could be totally in character for him.

Even still, I would have gotten the search warrant just to clear him and move on.

At the end of the day, most members of the mid western male legion did not lie about their activities, dont live close by and dont have accusations of aggressive behavior towards women.

 

[sandy_80]

so he just killed them on his land and had all night to bury them/ hide them but didnt cause he hoped no one would notice
when you pick a poi and common sense doesn't agree on all aspects

 

[NeverPersonal]

I dont think the public at large would find it humorous at all if the FBI failed to investigate via search warrants a 77 year old man who:

- Created a false alibi in advance.
- Lived close to the crime scene.
- Seemed to have a resemblance to the suspected individual as the video depicted him.
- Was said to have a pattern of moderate aggression towards women in his "orbit".

Though I dont think RL was the perpetrator either for the reasons you state, I would still want to search his property given the totality of the above points.

All I meant by my comment is that it is nonsensical.
His false alibi had to do with violating his parole. He lived AT the crime scene. You'd have to be a real special kind of stupid to commit a crime of this caliber quite literally in your own backyard.
The resemblance thing is phooey. There are many, many men who we could say "resemble" the extremely pixelated image that we all know as BG. Unfortunately, I am sure that many men in the area show aggression to women. The real focus would need to be if they show aggression to women, have a fascination with violence, and tend to focus on younger girls.

 

[steeltowngirl]

I wondered that too. A detailed explanation regarding the source of LEs interview with KAK released before that but nada about RL’s search warrant. Was the source even authenticated?

This article said it was authenticated. I still wonder about how it was obtained.

The Murder Sheet Podcast first published the documents, and I-Team 8 has confirmed with a police source that the document is authentic.

FBI agent: Bodies 'moved and staged' in Delphi murders, suspect took clothing

DELPHI, Ind. (WISH) — Investigators believe the bodies of Abby Williams and Libby German were “moved and staged” at the Delphi murder scene, according to court documents obtained by I-Team 8. READ: See the court documents The revelation is included in a nine-page request for a search warrant...

www.wishtv.com

 

[Peppery]

Im very grateful that LE goes where the facts take them, instead of deciding someone is too old or too stupid to commit a crime. Thank goodness old guys never commit stupid crimes, right?!! I don't think RL is BG, but I'm sure glad that he was investigated as intently as it appears.

 

[Falling Down]

I believe Libby thought something was off when BG came walking across the bridge which is why she video-tapped him. This would have been especially true if she was expecting to see Anthony Shots. When BG made it across the bridge, he probably threatened them with a weapon, and forced them to go down the hill. He had the element of surprise on them and the girls were likely so terrified that they cooperated with him. This would explain why the girls didn't call 911 or put up a fight.

I understand that on certain SM platforms "stories" on them can be set to auto delete within a given period of time, or perhaps upon signing out of the platform. Perhaps even by a user, too.

Which make me wonder why ISP are so intent on getting people to come forward about the a_shots account. I think they may be trying to piece together some stuff, but need the public's help. I'd have assumed that there would be a digital record of some sort or another when it comes to popular SM platforms, one which could be easily searchable by LE in a case, but apparently that's not always an option.

JMO

 

[NeverPersonal]

Im very grateful that LE goes where the facts take them, instead of deciding someone is too old or too stupid to commit a crime. Thank goodness old guys never commit stupid crimes, right?!! I don't think RL is BG, but I'm sure glad that he was investigated as intently as it appears.

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion. I'm glad they're investigating everyone too, but this is old news. I realize some papers came out, but he's dead and is clearly not the murderer, so why the focus? This podcast puts focus on specific things that I'm not sure I understand.

 

[Sillybilly]

His false alibi had to do with violating his parole.

<rsbm>

Maybe I'm missing something, but RL was at the transfer station in the morning, and at the fish store around 5:00ish. Why was his false alibi only for the timeframe in which the girls were believed to have been killed instead of coinciding with the times he actually went to the transfer station earlier in the day and the fish store later in the day?