Found Deceased IN - Abigail (Abby) Williams, 13, & Liberty (Libby) German, 14, The Delphi Murders 13 Feb 2017 #90

[Tillicum]

I'm still catching up but has anyone thought LE suspects a reporter?

 

[Medstudies]

Apologies for banging on about the use of the term us - 'guys, down the hill'.
I can't get my head around a sexual predator using the cross-gender term of 'guys' to his potential female victims. If he's a sexual predator, imo he'd be fixated on the endgame, not being Joe-cool. Imo, he would be much more likely to use a female tag - eg 'girls'.

Sexual predators are not known to cross gender in their preference of victim... unless of course the seduction is not sexually motivated and became more complex as time passed..

First , I’m not caught up.

Second, I’m not sure I really want to even say this: maybe he wasn’t a sexual predator? What if the killer had this warped perception of the girls friendship which is why he killed them?

(MOO. Just speculation. Looking for another angle. And obviously, I have no way of knowing, no reason to think this. And the girls are innocent and deserve to be safe, loved, and they deserve justice)

 

[holtzmann]

What evidence would lead them to say that THIS IS THE MURDERER.. and not just this is the suspect?

And from a sketch?

This new claim of information, along with the introduction of the related vehicle seen near the hill that day, seem to be the key points introduced in the presser, at least to me.

There has been a lot of talk about the differences between the two sketches, but I feel like that's less important now. It seems possible that there were two separate narratives/accounts that orchestrated the different sketches.

To me, it comes back to — what new information did LE gain access to that leads them to such certainty regarding this new sketch, the car, and the definite claim of murderer vs. suspect?

Edit: Regarding "guys," especially among younger generations, I don't think the connotations of gender are quite so pronounced or observed. Speaking for myself (31, F), "guys" can apply to groups of all genders, the same way one might say "y'all." The thought of assigning gender importance to it usually doesn't even occur to me.

 

[perfectingpink]

Me neither.

About the new sketch, what was/is the reason for holding it back for 2 years.?

I have been thinking about this and the only thing I can come up with is the most recent sketch was strictly from an eyewitnesses memory and since eyewitness accounts can be quite unreliable, LE thought combining what they believe BG looks like (based off of the grainy video) with the eyewitness account was a better representation. I suppose after that tactic did not work, they decided maybe the eyewitness sketch would.

 

[sun16]

My understanding, from what Libby’s sister has shared, is that she (Libby’s sister) dropped the girls off at a walking trail where other kids had been walking and hanging out all day. I do wonder where BG entered the picture, and if he targeted Libby and Abby directly. Or, if Libby and Abby just happened to be the two people who this BG ended up choosing to kill. Maybe Libby and Abby were just separated from the pack far enough at one point for him to target them. If BG was simply looking for ... whomever, this could have happened to any of those kids who were out there that day. If the BG targeted Libby and Abby directly for a specific reason, that seems important to me. Is there more to it? It does make me feel like it was known locally that kids went to this location (much like we all do to various locations across the country). This is no one’s fault, other than BG. WHO IS THIS MAN AND WHERE ARE YOU?...TICK TOCK.

 

[Justice101]

The oddities of the news conference:
1) Suspect is between 18 and 40??? That's a big range.
2) Sketch looks completely different.
3) "Abandoned" car. Normal description of a car that is now gone would be "parked" car. That seemed odd. Abandoned means you have it in your possession or it sat there for days. But if it was really abandoned, LE would have that license plate the day the girls were found and they could find the owner or borrower quickly.
4) He may be in this room.. Very angry look at other LE and media. What's that mean? I think it means they have no earthly idea who it is. I wonder if the killer has sent LE a letter taunting them.. saying he is watching them from close by or something.
5) Video of the man walking. Yeh, it's stabilized but why wait to give that out now? My guess is they were trying to justify the news conference and needed another thing to throw in.
6) Referencing the book "The Shack". That was very odd and awkward. To me, this had to be a targeted message to the killer that LE is onto them and possibly watching them. Maybe they found evidence the girls were in shed.. or that the DNA of the perp was on this same exact book title found in the road next to the abandoned car, whatever? There is a reason for the reference to this book. He also said the person may have only a small shred of decency...to give them a chance to come forward and come clean.

Any other thoughts on what was odd?

 

[mompalm]

The vehicle, what if someone in the community was well known for frequently leaving their vehicle in that abandoned lot? Sure folks aren’t going to remember where they saw a certain vehicle over 2 years later , but a lot of people will remember if a certain vehicle was repeatedly parked there. It also wouldn’t cause much suspicion among locals for that vehicle to be there, even the day the girls went missing, because it’s not out of place. Sure a few folks might have mentioned it to see if the person could be a witness, but I’m guessing his alibi provided a valid explanation for why it was there.

I agree, the BG may be someone who often or periodically has business along the path, so it wouldn't be unusual for him or his vehicle to be there. For example someone with local authority such as Dept of Natural Resources, park ranger, Animal Control, etc.

Perhaps similar to the BTK killer, position of authority hiding in plain sight.

 

[MistyWaters]

Apologies first for asking what may have already been addressed here but I just don't remember.

Did Abby have a phone? So much is made of Libby's phone and Derick trying to reach Libby by phone and the video Libby captured on her phone of BG but I've not heard of anyone trying to reach Abby by phone. Thanks in advance.

Whether Abby had a cellphone has never been specifically stated by either LE or her mother, that I’ve ever noticed. So either she didn’t or the information has been withheld. I’ve long wondered about this same unanswered question too and in one of LE press conferences long ago it sounded to me like the plural “the girls’ cellphones” was spoken but that’s the only possible but vague inference I recall.

 

[rpgman]

ok I'm confused....we can't discount the first sketch bc that looks like the guy in the video but that sketch is now secondary, but the guy in the video is the same guy in the new sketch? And, we can't discount the video bc of his gait? So, are both the same guy?

Do I have that right?

 

[Howcanppldosuch]

Having walked across railroad trestles like this one, I believe the odd gait simply reflects that the guy was having to step from tie to tie. If you step wrong, your foot goes between ties and you can take a bad fall.

I agree the gait isn’t the identifying mannerism. I am interested in how he holds his hands, in pocket, fingers tucked in belt, hands behind back, etc. it is almost as if he has hands behind back and walking looking down in search of something. I realize he is watching his step but how he does it is what I notice.

 

[lisette]

Maybe someone reported seeing a person in or around the vehicle and a sketch was done ...But for some reason it was discounted until recently...Maybe someone became suspicious of someone and reported it and it led them back to this sketch.

 

[CSIDreamer]

I have three daughters. I use it for both sexes. Bad habit.

Shoot, I even address our female dogs as "guys listen to me!". In Indiana it basically has no gender attached.

 

[ab01]

This.
Teachers often call their students “guys”.
It implies a casual non-threatening relationship, and to be honest, used when a teacher who sees/knows many students can’t quite remember names at a given moment. A teacher would say “Ok guys, let’s all sit down and turn to page 27.”

A teacher would have been off on the school holiday that terrible day in February 2017 just like Abby & Libby were. Were Delphi schools off yesterday, Easter Monday? Schools in my area were out. If Delphi schools were out, the presser could have been strategically scheduled for a school holiday after inviting the public to attend. That would allow a teacher to attend. If the families were told the perp could have been a local teacher, that would be shocking and upsetting to them.

I am a teacher, and as much as this theory troubles me, it is preferable to me than the thought of a family member or LE being involved.

I thought the students were off but I'm almost positive it was on the school calendar that the teachers had an inservice work day?.....Am I not remembering this correctly? Anybody else remember this from the first couple threads

 

[sunsetbeach]

Apologies first for asking what may have already been addressed here but I just don't remember.

Did Abby have a phone? So much is made of Libby's phone and Derick trying to reach Libby by phone and the video Libby captured on her phone of BG but I've not heard of anyone trying to reach Abby by phone. Thanks in advance.

No, Abby didn’t have a phone that day.

 

[Timekeeper65]

People who don’t use the term “guys”, what do you say? — It’s an odd thing to fixate on, as far as the information new to us today. The alternative terms do sound more old fashioned in comparison and based on that, it makes sense when establishing an age range for the person who killed these girls.

@PeriwinkleE - I was born in the Midwest but moved south at a very young age. In return visits to my hometown I was always amazed at the term “guys”...which was used when addressing male or female. In the south we use the term “ya’ll”. Likewise my northern relatives were amazed at the use of the word “ya’ll”. I can remember being teased about it. Reckon I didn’t live up north long enough for “guys” to be part of my vocabulary.

Hey ya’ll!!

 

[LunaticFringe]

I am very confused this morning after finding out last night from a news article that the new sketch released at the news conference was drawn on February 17, 2017! It states further that it was drawn from a description from a person “that saw something that the person felt needed to be reported”.
Why was this not reported then? Did they dismiss it for some reason? Lose it until someone reminded them about it recently? Was it originally reported as related to the murders or related to something else and they just now put it together? The families have a myriad of reasons to be upset but maybe this is why they were reported yesterday as seemingly angry.
The fact this two year old sketch was released at the same time as information about a vehicle from two years ago I don’t think is a coincident.
My opinion is someone contacted them recently with information that reminded them of this previous sketch and verified somehow that this was the direction they needed to take, and it changed everything.
The most important thing is LE said, without wavering, without qualification, the guy in the new sketch is the man who killed the girls.

I watched the newest Gray Hughes video this morning.I know that he keeps in touch with Liberty's Grandmother.He said that they knew about the newest composite.Apparently the info about the parked car at the old welfare building was the only thing they didn't know about.I hope it was okay to post this.

 

[Aus94]

I think the reference to the shack was very specific - it’s such a random reference to make. I was wondering whether it was a movie they perhaps showed in a class / church group. It seems targeted. My guess is they’ve narrowed it down, but it’s purely circumstantial.

As for the “guys” - I think there’s a reason they added that too. It sounds casual, not menacing and I wonder if it might almost click for someone who knows the perp who might have an inkling that it’s him, but couldn’t imagine him being so violent.

 

[FinePrint]

The oddities of the news conference:
1) Suspect is between 18 and 40??? That's a big range.
2) Sketch looks completely different.
3) "Abandoned" car. Normal description of a car that is now gone would be "parked" car. That seemed odd. Abandoned means you have it in your possession or it sat there for days. But if it was really abandoned, LE would have that license plate the day the girls were found and they could find the owner or borrower quickly.
4) He may be in this room.. Very angry look at other LE and media. What's that mean? I think it means they have no earthly idea who it is. I wonder if the killer has sent LE a letter taunting them.. saying he is watching them from close by or something.
5) Video of the man walking. Yeh, it's stabilized but why wait to give that out now? My guess is they were trying to justify the news conference and needed another thing to throw in.
6) Referencing the book "The Shack". That was very odd and awkward. To me, this had to be a targeted message to the killer that LE is onto them and possibly watching them. Maybe they found evidence the girls were in shed.. or that the DNA of the perp was on this same exact book title found in the road next to the abandoned car, whatever? There is a reason for the reference to this book. He also said the person may have only a small shred of decency...to give them a chance to come forward and come clean.

Any other thoughts on what was odd?

Yeah, when he said he may appear to be younger than he is......

 

[kc1023]

HLN was still on my TV when I flipped it on this morning. They are running A&L clips periodically and the host said that they ID'd everyone at the press conference yesterday, had them sign in or something. I didn't catch it word for word but that was the gist of it. No link, live TV. I'll leave it on in case she says it again. They must have seriously believed BG would take the bait and show up. Wow.

 

[newyooper]

They were off for an unused snow day, so my guess is that teachers and all school employees would also be free from school that day.

I tend to agree that it is likely a young teacher or coach. That's what the person in the sketch looks like to me being more clean shaven I guess. It could also explain why it was someone with ties to Delphi who may no longer be in the area. This person was a teacher at the school and then got a job elsewhere and has since moved from Delphi.

Yes, or a kid who grew up in the area and went away to a local college (Purdue?) and was home that week. I'd be looking at religious families who have a college aged son.