Identified! IN - Gary, WhtFem skeletal in sand dune, Aug'10 - Sylvia Jones

Discussion in 'Identified!' started by Cubby, Aug 31, 2010.

  1. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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  3. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    Another short article:

    http://www.fox28.com/Global/story.asp?S=13071702


    The remains were found Monday evening about 150 feet from U.S. 20 near Gary's Miller Beach neighborhood. The site also is a short drive from an Interstate 80/94 interchange on the city's east side.
     
  4. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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  5. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    While it is far too early to know what gender this UID might be, I am going to put Barbara Glueckert out as a possible match.

    I had spoken to the detective handling Barbara's case some time ago, and while she is believed to be deceased. Her accused but never convicted killer (now deceased) is said to have a MO of drugging and raping women in forest preserve area's. If these remains found in Gary are near a camping area it would not be too far a stretch to consider Barbara - depending on the age of the remains. Barbara went missing in 1976. Her killer was said to have sent a letter to someone stating 'he had to put a girl in the ground'....... and the time he was missing between the last time Barbara was seen, a Sat Night and Monday at 5pm. Gary IN and 90/94 is not far of his possible route and the area she went missing in Huntley IL.

    Barbara's Charley project page:
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/g/glueckert_barbara.html



    I will contact the detective currently handling Barbara's case just to make sure he is aware of these skeletal remains found in Gary

    ETA: While Barbara is listed as missing from Mt Prospect IL, the detective handling her case did tell me it is confirmed she attended the party in Huntley, IL.
     
  6. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Could it be one of the Indiana Dunes three? Indiana Dunes is not far from Gary, Indiana.

    Ann Miller
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/m/miller_ann.html

    Patricia Blough
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/blough_patricia.html

    Renee Bruhl
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/b/bruhl_renee.html

    ETA: Although it doesn't say anything about how long the remains have been there, I have a feeling they are probably not that old, given that it was described as a "shallow grave", and that it was in a "wooded" sand dune area. Skeletal remains probably wouldn't last that long with the moisture and plant root activity.
     
  7. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    Could be Carl. I don't know how far Miller Beach is from the Indiana Dunes. I'm sure not far and it would not be unquestionable to think someone could have moved those girls from on area of the Dunes to another. The Dunes stretch from the NW area of IN to the lower area of MI along the lake. I do not know how far up into MI the dunes stretch, but I have been to the dunes in MI and know they stretch at least 15-20 miles or so north of New Buffalo MI.

    hth
     
  8. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    From the above link:


    The remains were found Monday evening about 150 feet from U.S. 20 near Gary's Miller Beach neighborhood. The site also is a short drive from an Interstate 80/94 interchange on the city's east side.

    US 20 is also not far from the route the perp in Barbara's case would have traveled. He was familiar with the Elgin IL area and 20 runs right into Elgin.....

    These roads are direct routes from the party Barbara attended.

    This is of course, if the remains are determined to be that old.
     
  9. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    True, but we don't know the condition of the remains and whether or not there is a full or partial skeleton.

    Plant root activity is really something I had never thought of..... Hmmm.
    Carl, can you post whatever knowledge you have of how skeletal remains might be affected by plant root activity, other than what kind of comes to mind for myself immediately is that roots may grow through the remains?

    tia
     
  10. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    This is not based on anything that I've read. I am just thinking logically that smaller roots tend to work their way into solid objects over time and break them down. Larger roots, such as those from trees would probably crush skeletal remains. Also in cold climates, the expansion and contraction of moisture as it freezes and thaws would reduce porous material such as bone to dust.

    Again, not a scientifically proven fact, just my own reasoning.
     
  11. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    Some Indiana missing persons listed at NamUs missing not far from Gary, IN.

    Ray Acklin: https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/5153/4/

    Mauro Munoz-Hernandez:
    https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/1112/12/

    Fracisco Huizar:
    https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/1044/21/

    John Taylor:
    https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/1126/23/

    Adora Hogan:
    https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/845/29/

    Benita Spears:
    https://www.findthemissing.org/cases/3841/34/

    Of course the Chicagoland area could be considered too due it's close proximity to Gary.
     
  12. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    Here's another from Gary.
    Margie Jelovcic
    [​IMG]
    http://www.charleyproject.org/cases/j/jelovcic_margie.html
     
  13. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    Another much longer article:

    http://www.myfoxchicago.com/dpp/news/metro/skeleton-found-dune-area-gary-20100831

    From the above link:

    At first, he suspected it was an animal head. He poked at it and realized it was a round skull sticking out of a small, shallow grave, 2 to 3 feet wide and about a foot deep. Next to it lay a jean jacket and a pair of blue jeans.

    Underneath the remains was something that looked like a white shirt.

    <snip>

    "I was figuring out what to do. First thing I did was call my wife. I called her, she kind of freaked out. I'm thinking, 'What if that's my family member and I was wanting for closure?'" he said. "I called dispatch. They thought I was nuts! It's not too often you find a human body ... When I tried to call this in, I didn't know the location. I said, 'I'm in between a gas station and a strip joint.'"

    (above BBM. He sounds like a sleuth! Wanting the family to find closure, calling LE and LE thinking he was nuts! ;) We face that sometimes making contact with LE. )

    Full article at above link.
     
  14. trigger

    trigger Well-Known Member

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    So many missing in IN.

    Shannon Sherrill , Thorntown, IN 6yo 1986

    Margaret " PEGGY " Sherman, Indianapolis, IN 27yo 1995

    Debra Jean Cole Lebanon -Boone County-Indiana 12yo 1981

    And the 3 girls missing from Indiana Dunes State Park, Tremont, IN

    Patricia Blough, Ann Miller and Renee Bruhl. 1966
     
  15. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    Indianapolis is pretty far from where the remains were located. I tried doing a NamUs search with area's near Gary....which is also very close to Chicago so the Chicagoland area could not be excluded either.

    hth
     
  16. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    If there was a Jean Jacket and blue jeans next to the remains, I would say it's probably not Gluekert or any of the Indiana Dunes three. I suspect that pure cotton would not have lasted 35-45 years under those conditions.
     
  17. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    I agree. We should be looking for someone last seen wearing a Jean Jacket and blue jeans.
     
  18. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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  19. CarlK90245

    CarlK90245 UID Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    I just spoke with a detective on the case. He said that the victim is most likely a blonde haired Caucasian female. He was unable to provide any information yet regarding approximate age, height or weight.
     
  20. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    This is very likely Carl.

    I'm having a hard time with the maps but where Huizar went missing from, where his burnt beyond recognition car was found and where these remains were found appear to be within 20 minutes or so of each other.

    Whoops. I posted before seeing your previous post Carl.
     
  21. Cubby

    Cubby fly the W!

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    Carl,

    Under the conditions - buried shallow grave in the dunes - the media article (myfox IIRC) indicated there was no flesh left on the remains. With hair left, blonde, what is your estimate on how long the remains might have been there.

    Thanks for your best guess. You have much more knowledge in this area than anyone else I can think of here in this forum.

    tia
     

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