Italy - Finnegan Elder, 19 & Gabriel Hjorth, 18, US students arrested, police murder, 26 July 2019

Discussion in 'Trials' started by FrostOwl, Jul 27, 2019.

  1. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Well-Known Member

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    Exactly! The policeman was not attacking him, he was either walking away or on the floor. I’m absolutely furious this violent killer is even attempting to present a defence. Arrogance in the extreme.
     


  2. FrostOwl

    FrostOwl Well-Known Member

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    Wasn't there somewhere mentioned that FE claimed that officer Rega tried to strangle him/was standing very close in front of him, and that was when FE stabbed him? If that was happening, then FE could have stabbed Rega in the back, by pulling the knife towards himself, with Rega between the knife and FE. If Rega was standing further away from FE and was stabbed in the back, then FE would have had to push the knife in a forward motion. I would think that the shape of the knife wounds shows whether the knife was pulled or pushed when the stabbing was done. There might even be signs of both pulling and pushing types of wounds, as in the stabbing continued after the initial attack, if it began with Rega standing between FE and the knife. If something like that was happening, Rega would most likely have staggered away from FE after the first blows, and if FE continued with the attack after that, then he used too much aggression than neccessary (I don't know the English term for that), as he and NH would have been able to get away, there were no need for 11 stab wounds, that makes it look as a frenzied attack.

    If it was pulled, then Rega must have been standing very close to FE, up in the face, and it could perhaps be interpreted by FE as if he was being attacked, and as it was an act of self-defense, judging what FE:s lawyers claim.
     
    Last edited: Sep 14, 2019
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  3. Elainera

    Elainera Well-Known Member

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    Says in the article posted above by YesorNo that Elder (who admitted killing Rega) dropped the petition to be released.

    GNH's petition hearing will be tomorrow, 16 Sep.
     
  4. CoverMeCagney

    CoverMeCagney Well-Known Member

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    Oh good, thanks. Now, what to do with GNH?

    Did he know Elder had a knife? He says not
    Did he know the police were police? They were plain clothed I think
    Did he think he was punching a dealer? Stupid, but not as stupid as punching a cop.
    How many times did he punch him?
    How involved was he in the ensuing cover up?
    Has he offended before or just caught up in an awful and tragic moment?

    It seems like GNH has a better education and prospects than his murderous mate. If his actions were akin to a quick brawl on the street, and if he didn't know Elder was armed, does he deserve a long sentence? If his actions had nothing directly to do with Rega's death, in reality how long does he deserve and how long will he get?

    I'm seeing these two boys as quite different cases. Elder needs to be put away for many years, but I'm just not sure about GNH.
     
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  5. FrostOwl

    FrostOwl Well-Known Member

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    Whether GNH knew if the carabinieri were police or nor could depend on if they introduced themselves as such or not. GNH has an Italian father and grandfather, and have spent many summers in Italy, so regardless if he's fluent in the Italian language or not, he most likely understand probably more than a bit, and he can't claim that he doesn't know what a carabinieri is.
     
  6. Elainera

    Elainera Well-Known Member

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    Somewhere in the first few pages it was quoted that he speaks Italian. It was also said that one of the boys told investigators that the two policemen identified themselves, the other said they didn't. I'm assuming GNH is the one who heard and understood that they identified themselves as officers.

    I don't think it matters much though, and he will be charged with murder as well.
     
  7. Elainera

    Elainera Well-Known Member

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    Looks like the second teen, Gabriel Natale-Hjorth, also withdrew his petition to be released.


    "The lawyers of one of two American teenagers being held in the slaying of an Italian police officer have dropped a request for their client to be released.

    Lawyers for Gabriel Natale-Hjorth, who's in custody for his alleged role in the fatal stabbing of Italian police officer Mario Cerciello Rega, said Monday they need time to study new evidence that emerged recently.

    Lawyer Francesco Petrelli says "it was the only possible decision, as prosecutors told us there are new investigative activities ongoing."

    American teen's lawyers drop bid for his release in Italy
     
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  8. BlackCloud

    BlackCloud Well-Known Member

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    I'm really happy they had to withdrew their petition to be released.
    I hope they spend years in jail before their trial begins and then life behind bars :cool:
     
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  9. FrostOwl

    FrostOwl Well-Known Member

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    Well, judging from these photos posted by GNH I don't see him as being less guilty than FE, he might even have been the one more into, and familiar with, buying (and selling) drugs. https://translate.google.se/?hl=sv#...jorth-armi-droga-e-quella-lite-con-sua-madre/
    Omicidio Cerciello, le chat nel telefono di Natale Hjorth: armi, droga e quella lite con sua madre - Open

    @ Elainera: Calling them boys in post #146, but as they are over 18, shouldn't they be called young adults instead?
     
  10. Legally Bland

    Legally Bland Well-Known Member

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    Text from his mother in the link:
    _________________

    In particular - reads the report - "Hjorth claims to have tried hallucinogenic mushrooms:" I tried some mushrooms (hallucinogens) for the second time in my life and I decided to be honest and tell you ", but the mother presses him pointing out the its total unreliability, given that: "I am talking about the fact that it is bull$$$t that you are not yet selling drugs because you do not have a job and continue to buy things.Expensive things. I lie constantly "".

    (Not sure the last sentence has translated correctly.)
     
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  11. JerseyGirl

    JerseyGirl Staff Member Staff Member Forum Coordinators

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