It's Getting Old

[deelytful1]

OK.. one more an then I'll stop hogging the thread ;-)
I still really like LancelotLink's post!
Some people are not here to look at every aspect of a case and other's POVs.
They have an agenda and no "award winning" post will ever change their mind! So after a few attempts, one should just throw their hands up in the air, move on to a different poster or opinion and if the posts by a particular person (repetitive, combative, sometimes entirely ridiculous!! :giggle are really getting under your skin? just put them on your ignore list.
YOU are special and your time and opinion is TOO important and valuable. Once you made your point, if someone insists on twisting the point, move on quickly! Apparently (or probably) they are really not looking for an alternate opinion (and perhaps neither are YOU.
Agree to disagree and move on to more productive pastures

 

[The Farm]

Thanks for this thread, Mods!

I have fallen away from this forum because I just have to get over the animosity I felt toward the jurors and the verdict. I did not like the feelings I was having, and the person I had become because of it. I still check in from time to time, though. I was/am here because of little Caylee Marie, but all of this controversy has not been about Caylee in a long time. I was so angry because little Caylee did not have the justice due her as the victim. I have come to realize and know that in the long run justice will be served by a much more important judge than the jury or myself.

When you post somehing clearly as an opinion, and then are challenged to prove why you think what you think, then it is time to just ignore that person. I will still read this forum from time to time and keep up with the forum news, but how many ways can the same things be stated over and over again?

I appreciate all of the MODS for having worked so very hard and diligently during jury selection and trial.

GB you all!

Thank You LALaw as I feel the very same way.

 

[strawberry]

As a member for the past 2 years, posting with a minority opinion, I can state with 100% conviction that minority opinions are not moderated because of a minority opinion. I always try to keep my posts respectful, as free from snark as humanly possible, and as much as possible on the topic of the thread. When I state something as fact, I will usually back the statement up with a link as to why I believe it is a fact. I can also state with 100% conviction that when you post from the minority, you do meet resistance and others rarely agree with your post LOL .

One thing that has changed quite a bit since the trial first began is that before the trial, most posters used links to back up their opinions or statements of fact. As the trial progressed, and the evidence was shown in the trial, links were used less and less, because it was now in evidence as opposed to in the docs. Post verdict, links now are used mostly for pointing to new news stories about this case. However, in the threads, most no longer back up their statements of fact with links. Immediately after the verdict, well, there was quite a bit of leeway given by the moderators (understandably so), due to emotions running very, very high. Thank you mods for your understanding. Emotions have calmed considerably.

As a poster from the minority, I am used to seeing my posts met with resistance. What i am not used to seeing is majority opinion posters disagreeing with each other, and I have seen a whole lot more of that in the past few weeks, than I have in the last 2 years. What is really surprising to me is the uncharacteristic, for lack of a better word, bickering. I have a theory as to why this may be happening:

Before the verdict, things were basically divided into two categories, opinions that leaned towards guilt (majority), opinions that leaned towards not guilty (minority). Now, however, the thread topics are not so cut and dried. JA's book, BRACE, state motion to recover investigative costs, Casey's life after trial, who will make the most money, RK suing LP, RK suing NE, GA and CA in NC, are all subjects that have little to do with whether or not KC is guilty or not guilty, so the majority and minority lines have all but disappeared. Someone who absolutely believes KC is guilty of all charges, may not like the idea of JA writing a book so soon after the verdict. Someone else who believes KC is guilty of all charges may love the idea of JA's new book, and can't understand why anyone would not want to hear what JA had to say. The current threads being discussed are open to a wider spread of opinions, and this has led to many more disagreements than back when it was just G or NG. It was much easier when ya'll could just look for old TDA's posts, skip over it and totally agree with everyone else LOL.

I enjoy WS, and I feel a comraderie with the other posters here. I have read posts that made me laugh, posts that made me cry, and posts that made me laugh so hard I cried.

I have enjoyed many spirited debates the last two years, with a large number of posters. More often than not, the end result was agreeing to disagree, but the discussions were thought provoking and informative. I know for a fact, we can discuss a subject, totally disagree with each other, and still respect one another. It really is as simple as that age old rule "treat others as you would like others to treat you."

I would agree that you are the example of the difference LL cited above between a real post and a bait post. You do have a minority opinion, you are not on my ignore list; I enjoy reading your posts and lo and behold sometimes I agree with them!

 

[Well Done 99]

Ten people are at your house for dinner. Nine, including yourself, are having steak. One doesn't eat meat.
Sure, it may be contrary to your beliefs, you may not understand how a person can live without meat and you may even have to change the plan you had in mind to cook the dinner ... but it should never be difficult to respect the fact that your guest doesn't eat what you eat.
My estimate would be that I disagree with at least something in 50% of posts I read, but that doesn't make them wrong.
Respect is nevertheless due for the time, thought and effort they have put into it. Those same posters might also disagree with my thoughts .... but they'll still be welcome for dinner.

 

[RammerJammer]

Kudos to the Mods here at WS and thanks for starting this thread. I find myself coming here less and less as I feel the horse has been beaten to death on the G/NG verdict and jury issues. It's over and time to move on. I am interested in the future, however...ZFG, KC's probation, Dr. Phil, etc. I, too, have noticed the snark and sniping comments. This is not indicative of pre-trial behavior on this forum. I respect the varying views (yes,thedevilsadvocate...I love reading your posts!) and have ignored the ones who seem to bait, especially during the trial. Let' s all do our part to bring back the higher standard here at WS with respectable, respectFUL comments, while at the same time feeling "at home" and safe. Thank you, MODS!

 

[LambChop]

I enjoy reading a post that may not have the same opinion or view that I hold because it is helpful for me to think about the case or the evidence from another perspective. Healthy discussions are helpful for some of us to work through this. Everything happens for a reason and we can all make changes in our own way or obviously collectively with intending to. lol I've always seen that in WS's and I hope it continues. Thanks for being here. jmo

 

[LambChop]

Ten people are at your house for dinner. Nine, including yourself, are having steak. One doesn't eat meat.
Sure, it may be contrary to your beliefs, you may not understand how a person can live without meat and you may even have to change the plan you had in mind to cook the dinner ... but it should never be difficult to respect the fact that your guest doesn't eat what you eat.
My estimate would be that I disagree with at least something in 50% of posts I read, but that doesn't make them wrong.
Respect is nevertheless due for the time, thought and effort they have put into it. Those same posters might also disagree with my thoughts .... but they'll still be welcome for dinner.

I like steak......did I miss my invitation in the mail?????

 

[Well Done 99]

I like steak......did I miss my invitation in the mail?????

You've got a long way to swim LC!

 

[MissJames]

Well,I'm guilty of replying far too often,when I should just walk away. I cannot stand to watch false info stand as the truth,but as Lancelot said,it's baiting and my best response to it would be no response.
I'll do better. Pinky swear :angel:

:tyou: Mods ,for opening up the subject to discussion.

 

[strawberry]

Well,I'm guilty of replying far too often,when I should just walk away. I cannot stand to watch false info stand as the truth,but as Lancelot said,it's baiting and my best response to it would be no response.
I'll do better. Pinky swear :angel:

:tyou: Mods ,for opening up the subject to discussion.

You're right; that's the hard part. :blowkiss:

 

[MarthaM]

I just have one comment about references to the Ignore List and to posts praising some who have minority opinions.

I hope people might be able to understand that when references are made within a thread to how great the Ignore List is, that's as snarky as coming out and saying something specific about a poster with a minority opinion. When someone makes a comment like 'I just love the Ignore Button' during a discussion, it's as bad as making a snide comment straight out about a poster. Worse, really, because of how vague and coy it is. It leads to a 'Is s/he talking about me?' moment for some of us. I think mentions of the Ignore List feature should be limited to mods' inviting others to use it, not as a ploy by posters. (I'm not talking about mentioning the Ignore feature on this thread, but on regular discussion threads about cases or issues). We already know some people are ignoring us; it doesn't have to be pointed out and celebrated.

Same thing with telling someone who posted a minority opinion that their posts are valuable or so good, while at the same time saying something about 'unlike other posters...'. (Not referring to any one post like that; it happens often enough). Sometimes that makes others who have minority opinions wonder once again, 'Is s/he talking about me?' I don't see why it's necessary to throw in thinly-veiled barbs about the rest of us. Praise what a poster said, say that you appreciate how they phrased their comments, but leave the rest of us out of it.

Those are just my own opinions about some techniques used here, and if they're out of line the mods can delete this post. I can handle that. I'm still new enough that I don't quite have a feel for what's acceptable here and what isn't. I'm just commenting on what I think makes some of us not feel quite so welcome here.

 

[MarthaM]

Oh, and one more thing.

'Baiting'.

I loathe the use of that word in discussions on any message board. I think that the number of posters who say something just to 'bait' someone are few and far between. Most are just posting opinions or responding to something that has been brought up. It's not baiting. There has to be an intent there for it to be considered that, and that's just not there as often as some seem to think it is. 99% of the time, nobody's baiting anybody. Too often, 'baiting' seems to mean simply that someone posted an opposing view the reader doesn't like, or asked a question within a discussion. When someone you agree with does that, it's just discussion. When someone whose opinion you don't like does that, it's called 'baiting'. That doesn't add up, IMO.

 

[Truthwillsetufree]

FWIW and JMO, I love Web Sleuths, the good, the bad and the ugly.
There is no other forum site like WS with such a good reputation and I like that.
The Mods work hard on these threads and I, for one, appreciate it.
I have written a million posts but only hit the post button on a few.
Tricia had posted something a long time ago that has always stuck in my mind...a post on the internet is forever...I try to remember that.

 

[LambChop]

You've got a long way to swim LC!

Yep, and I'm on the wrong coast. lol

 

[LambChop]

Oh, and one more thing.

'Baiting'.

I loathe the use of that word in discussions on any message board. I think that the number of posters who say something just to 'bait' someone are few and far between. Most are just posting opinions or responding to something that has been brought up. It's not baiting. There has to be an intent there for it to be considered that, and that's just not there as often as some seem to think it is. 99% of the time, nobody's baiting anybody. Too often, 'baiting' seems to mean simply that someone posted an opposing view the reader doesn't like, or asked a question within a discussion. When someone you agree with does that, it's just discussion. When someone whose opinion you don't like does that, it's called 'baiting'. That doesn't add up, IMO.

After thousands of posts we have all seen "baiting" on this forum. Trust me. After thousands of posts those who speak of "baiting" are in the know. It's not just a difference of opinion because those are, of course, welcome here because of the fact that they are not disrespectful and informative. There is a difference. jmo

 

[MarthaM]

After thousands of posts we have all seen "baiting" on this forum. Trust me. After thousands of posts those who speak of "baiting" are in the know. It's not just a difference of opinion because those are, of course, welcome here because of the fact that they are not disrespectful and informative. There is a difference. jmo

That may be. But just like the comments about 'ignoring' people, the 'baiting' comments are vague and random and leave a number of us wondering if we're being lumped into that category. Not everyone has been here a long, long time and has that knowledge about just who or what a poster is referring to. It's harmful (and forbidden) to make comments about a specific poster instead of about what they've said, but these reference to posters who are 'baiting' or who are being 'ignored' are every bit as bad. Or worse.

 

[Kimster]

That may be. But just like the comments about 'ignoring' people, the 'baiting' comments are vague and random and leave a number of us wondering if we're being lumped into that category. Not everyone has been here a long, long time and has that knowledge about just who or what a poster is referring to. It's harmful (and forbidden) to make comments about a specific poster instead of about what they've said, but these reference to posters who are 'baiting' or who are being 'ignored' are every bit as bad. Or worse.

Saying you are using your ignore feature in any way is a TOS violation.

"NOTE: Do NOT post a message saying you are doing so, that's a TOS violation by you. Put them on the list and be happy."

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showthread.php?t=91915"]Best Practices Dealing with your fellow posters - Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community[/ame]

Let's move away from the ignore feature conversation lest anyone begins to think they are the target of these comments. :tyou:

 

[NavySubMom]

I think that some of the problem lately at WS in this Caylee Marie topic is that there is not that much going on in this matter of late of real substance, and a lot of the "real" sleuthing came before the trial. I used to LOVE, LOVE to come here to read the detailed and intense picking-apart of the doc dumps, the emails, the potential PT and DT strategies, the pre-trial hearings, and the concrete evidence that may or may not have been used during the trial, and the differing opinions about that. That stuff was amazing. Then during the trial, it was interesting to post and read about what went on during that day, the good, bad and the ugly, talk about some of the key players, etc. Then right after the trial there was a lot of interesting posts about the verdict, the lawyers, the jury, the felon, the judge, etc., with emotions running REAL high, and it was good to post and read about that after 3 long years of watching this beast unfold.

The recent threads that held the most interest to me were the sighting of the felon in Ohio (lots of sleuthing was done to figure out where she was, although I have become a HUGE conspiracy theorist after dealing with the DT and think that a few of the posters "knew" were the felon was and gave good "hints" about that, lol ), the threads about the Caylee Memorial Walk and that foundation where sleuthers here delve into the administration and set-up of that foundation (amazing what information people here can come up with), etc., those type of things. Also, the lawyer thead really helps with concise questions and answers about probation, court costs, and other legal matters.

Now, however, (and I am not saying I am completely innocent of this), there is just not much going on, interest here has waned, so it has come down to OUR OWN OPINION about the PEOPLE THEMSELVES (the felon, JA, JB, CA, GA) in this saga, and people have strong opinions in that regard. I don't mind at all reading differing opinions. I don't, however, enjoy seeing the same poster say the exact same thing 20 times in one thread, posting every few minutes, or one poster commenting on just about every post in a thread saying the exact same thing, or the "drive by" posters who come in and post one sentence every few minutes to obviously derail the thread, those are the posts I would call "baiting". If someone gives an opinion and states exactly "why" that is their opinion, I would can read that and either agree or disagree. I think some of the threads will run their course, but we keep posting the same things (myself included) over and over and over.

I used to come here and spend a few hours reading the "new" threads and posts, now I can the same in about 15 minutes.....

IMO, those who come here solely to disrupt "win" when a thread is closed, or moved to the parking lot, or taken away by the mods and "cleaned up", they have achieved their purpose and I feel they are gloating, they have succeeded in why they come here, so they keep coming back for more. I am going to try not to feed into that from here on out and keep my posts to a minimum.

I am glad for the opportunity to share here on this as I have become totally frushtrated with the recent thread closings, or the thread moved to the parking lot, or the threads taken away and "cleaned-up" by the mods, etc. Again, I know I have participated in some of the problem......but I would like to thank the mods for acknowledging the problem and letting us comment here about it!

 

[Aedrys]

Thanks mods for this thread. I too have found it difficult to be around here. I've had to leave threads and literally walk away from WS at times. I have made use of helpful features I haven't used before too. I feel like this acquittal has made some people feel they have the right to attack those of us who didn't agree with it. There has been such a loss of respect between posters here. It's become more important who won the case than actually having good conversation about why justice was denied for Caylee, and that's been waved like a hateful banner at those of us who support the SA, who we're repeatedly told, lost. It's like this case was a game to some, and really, it wasn't. There was no clear winners or losers here except for Caylee.

Also, I'd rather talk about what happened, not have to take a firm side and stand up for myself. But some would rather not talk, just bait and spread anger. I'm glad you posted this because it was getting pretty bad for awhile there, and I know some of my posts didn't help much. I always tried to be respectful and use language that was respectful and not baitworthy, though. I, too, am tired of the same things being thrown around. I'm tired of the same arguments rehashed over and over. It's pointless. Let's just agree to disagree and please, let us move on. I'd rather have thought provoking posts and good conversation than the constant battle back and forth here. I know I'm going to do my part and not respond to the baiters anymore.

Come on, everyone. This is a great forum. We need to keep it great, not let it devolve into snarkiness and disrespect. Caylee wouldn't want us fighting like this, so we shouldn't.

 

[MissJames]

I think that some of the problem lately at WS in this Caylee Marie topic is that there is not that much going on in this matter of late of real substance, and a lot of the "real" sleuthing came before the trial. I used to LOVE, LOVE to come here to read the detailed and intense picking-apart of the doc dumps, the emails, the potential PT and DT strategies, the pre-trial hearings, and the concrete evidence that may or may not have been used during the trial, and the differing opinions about that. That stuff was amazing. Then during the trial, it was interesting to post and read about what went on during that day, the good, bad and the ugly, talk about some of the key players, etc. Then right after the trial there was a lot of interesting posts about the verdict, the lawyers, the jury, the felon, the judge, etc., with emotions running REAL high, and it was good to post and read about that after 3 long years of watching this beast unfold.

The recent threads that held the most interest to me were the sighting of the felon in Ohio (lots of sleuthing was done to figure out where she was, although I have become a HUGE conspiracy theorist after dealing with the DT and think that a few of the posters "knew" were the felon was and gave good "hints" about that, lol ), the threads about the Caylee Memorial Walk and that foundation where sleuthers here delve into the administration and set-up of that foundation (amazing what information people here can come up with), etc., those type of things. Also, the lawyer thead really helps with concise questions and answers about probation, court costs, and other legal matters.

Now, however, (and I am not saying I am completely innocent of this), there is just not much going on, interest here has waned, so it has come down to OUR OWN OPINION about the PEOPLE THEMSELVES (the felon, JA, JB, CA, GA) in this saga, and people have strong opinions in that regard. I don't mind at all reading differing opinions. I don't, however, enjoy seeing the same poster say the exact same thing 20 times in one thread, posting every few minutes, or one poster commenting on just about every post in a thread saying the exact same thing, or the "drive by" posters who come in and post one sentence every few minutes to obviously derail the thread, those are the posts I would call "baiting". If someone gives an opinion and states exactly "why" that is their opinion, I would can read that and either agree or disagree. I think some of the threads will run their course, but we keep posting the same things (myself included) over and over and over.

IMO, those who come here solely to disrupt "win" when a thread is closed, or moved to the parking lot, or taken away by the mods and "cleaned up", they have achieved their purpose and I feel they are gloating, they have succeeded in why they come here, so they keep coming back for more. I am going to try not to feed into that from here on out and keep my posts to a minimum.

I am glad for the opportunity to share here on this as I have become completely frustrated with the recent thread closings, or the thread moved to the parking lot, or the threads taken away and "cleaned-up" by the mods, etc. Again, I know I have participated in some of the problem......but I would like to thank the mods for acknowledging the problem and letting us comment here about it!

You hit the nail on the head,NavySubMom.

IIRC,shortly after the verdict one of the mods suggested we help out on the cold cases ( I think :waitasec: Y'all know I have a bad memory :crazy: ) .
That's an excellent way to put good sleuthing skills to use.
I'm not good at sleuthing ,not fast enough,so I consider myself a commentator and cheerleader ,LOL.

I don't want to lose my dear WS friends ,but we're limited in this case. The truth is,there are a lot of Caylee's and Casey's out there.
And let's not forget our good friend at WS, who's not only endured the murder of her brother and sister in law,but the trial has been postponed for years ,now.
Caylee brought many of us here and we can honor her by trying to help others . JMO