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John Ramsey Fabricated Open Basement Window "Evidence"

Discussion in 'JonBenet Ramsey' started by BlueCrab, Jul 20, 2006.

  1. Miz Adventure

    Miz Adventure New Member

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    Re: The window....

    Trip DeMuth
    : You talked about John Ramsey coming through that window, do you remember any other times that people were in that window?
    Patsy Ramsey: No.
    TD: Did the boys ever play in the window?
    PR: No. I mean, because there was a grate on there for that purpose so nobody falls in there. If you were going in the window you had to lift the grate out. It was pretty heavy.
    TD: Other than when John Ramsey broke into the house whenever, was someone in that window, to your knowledge?
    PR: Never to my knowledge.
    TD: Do you know why the window wasn't fixed?
    PR: No, I don't. Was it not fixed?
    TD: Well, what do you know about that window, the condition of that window on Christmas of '96, have you -
    PR: I just remember a little to-do list that Linda Hoffman had included fixing that pane in that window. Whether (her husband) got to it or not, I don't know because he wasn't able to fix the playroom doors, you know, so he didn't get to everything.
     
  2. UKGuy

    UKGuy Well-Known Member

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    Miz Adventure,
    So says Patsy.

    Detective: We spoke to Linda Pugh and she cannot remember any request to fix a basement window.

    Mrs Ramsey: Well I remember telling her, if she has forgotten that's a shame.

    Come On Down, LOL.
    .
     
  3. Miz Adventure

    Miz Adventure New Member

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    It's possible that LHP was also suffering from a case of 'Ramnesia'.

    I tend to think that JR did break that window in the summer. If he did break it then it seems quite logical that he would have asked Patsy to ask LHP to ask her husband (as a CEO JR was used to delegating - lol) to mend it.

    Then the window was forgotten about.
     
  4. andreww

    andreww Former Member

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    Again, show me one quote from LHP that she didn't know about that window! I've heard a lot of anti Ramsey things from her but not once have I seen her say that window was not broken.
     
  5. UKGuy

    UKGuy Well-Known Member

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    andreww,
    Ah but that is exactly my point. Patsy says LHP had a note, i.e. a todo list.

    Also Patsy says LHP's husband never got round to it or the playroom doors.

    That is: Patsy knows full well what is being asked, and is making it up as she goes along.

    Why? If LHP says she does not have a todo list then that explains why her husband never got round to fixing the window, e.g. lost it. BTW you might expect people with money like the R's would phone for a glazier?

    If she does have a todo list with that item on it Patsy is vindicated.

    We just do not know since AFAIK LHP has never said the window was broken either.

    You would think she would want to back JR up with his version of events?


    .
     
  6. UKGuy

    UKGuy Well-Known Member

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    Miz Adventure,
    Depends on LHP's POV. We just do not know do we? Yet Patsy is backing up JR's version of events with a todo list nobody has seen.

    With the passage of time LHP, was it not six months or so, i.e. a summer breakage, maybe she did forget, so Patsy's story can be confirmed.

    Currently I'm skeptical, its another aspect of the R's version of events that might be fabricated, particularly if BR broke the window.

    The window was broken, but when? I reckon close to JonBenet's death, why? Because there is not the leaves, rubbish and detritus that usually builds up close to where a window is broken, and of course LHP has not backed up either JR's version, or Patsy's.

    Which are two separate accounts

    .
     
  7. EtherealMoonRose

    EtherealMoonRose Member

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    Why would BR have broken the window?
     
  8. Cottonstar

    Cottonstar Well-Known Member

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    It wasn't intentional.


    cottonstar
     
  9. AndHence

    AndHence Active Member

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    The window was almost definitely broken the night of the murder. John doesn't point it out to investigators because he A) doesn't want to be the first person to point it out (too obvious) and/or B) doesn't believe they will buy the staging.

    The only person to corroborate John's story about breaking the window the previous summer is Patsy. LHP is on record as saying she has no recollection of cleaning up any glass from the broken window. This is in direct contradiction to Patsy's story. We know that the Ramseys typically entered through the garage door and that the Barnhills had a set of keys. There is little reason to think John would have needed to break into his own home if he had forgotten his keys.

    Also, let's consider the logic of John/Lou Smit's story. A random intruder with x-ray vision is able to see in the dark of night through a covered window grate (at least a foot and half above the window) that a basement window is cracked. What insane luck! What are the odds? Things get even more absurd if you allow for the story to include the Ramseys FIXING the window John allegedly broke into. In this scenario, the intruder breaks the EXACT same window that John broke to crawl into his house!

    The intruder window story defies all logic and John knows this the very day of the murder. This is why he doesn't mention it to investigators and then later says that it may have been him who broke the window. This is also why the Ramseys emphasized the inside job angle, focusing on people with keys to the house such as LHP. It is only through the the miracle of Lou Smit that John goes along with the broken window as a point of entry for the imaginary intruder. As is common with Ramsey testimony, they muddy the waters to make them appear deep. The mystery of the broken window is actually no mystery at all.
     
  10. kanzz

    kanzz kanzz=kansas

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    I'm having some trouble with thinking that the window was broken that night, simply because I can't figure out how they could have cleaned up the broken glass.

    [​IMG]
     
  11. Rott Mom

    Rott Mom Active Member

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    I'm sorry - how in the world do they explain a huge, intact cobweb?
     
  12. UKGuy

    UKGuy Well-Known Member

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    kanzz,
    Well what do you know? LHP says she never cleaned up any glass, nor does she say the window was broken.

    Hence, no glass means someone did cleanup, and I'm assuming its not Patsy who would have told us, so that leaves JR?

    After six months or so, not all the glass fragments were gone, Fleet White picked one up on his first visit.

    So looks like JR cleaned up, but possibly after BR broke the window, wherever he placed the broken glass which he can claim originated from six months back, who can date glass breakage?

    So JR's version of events is consistent with both him and BR breaking the window, and JR cleaning up?

    So finding a stash of broken glass would not invalidate JR's claims.

    How much glass is there to be removed? Could it have been distributed to various locations in the house where it appears innocuous?

    Definitely no intruder broke the window, JR does not need to break windows to enter his own house, he can phone friends for spare keys, or retrieve the ones under the pots. If the window was broken by him then with his money he can phone a glazier on the spot.

    The big clue is the R's dumping responsibility on LHP and her husband, does this not sound familiar?

    My money on one of the R's breaking the window that morning, it also fits directly into any RDI theory consistently.

    .
     
  13. Miz Adventure

    Miz Adventure New Member

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    There would have been tiny splinters everywhere.

    I'm still of the opinion that JR was actually telling the truth about breaking the window in the summer. There would have been splinters back then so I don't know what happened to them. Could they have been swept up and nobody remembers doing so?

    In any case I don't see the importance of the window. The intruder theory has long since been discounted.
     
  14. EtherealMoonRose

    EtherealMoonRose Member

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    I totally agree.
     
  15. UKGuy

    UKGuy Well-Known Member

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    Miz Adventure,
    Note nobody is saying who cleaned up the broken glass, and why does JR not phone for a glazier?

    Assuming your housekeepers husband will fix the window stretches it for me.

    The window is not that important in as much there is patently no smoking gun here, but if it might have been BR who broke the window then this would explain why JR has a story to tell us about summertime.

    I'll go with BR breaking the window until there is evidence to show otherwise.

    Bear in mind the R's have not backed up their version of events regarding the window, its all hearsay.

    .
     
  16. Miz Adventure

    Miz Adventure New Member

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    What?! JR was too important to bother with trivia. He was the big cheese of a billion dollar company. He was used to delegating. The window was very small and unimportant in his life. His wife could see to it, she was in charge of telling LHP what needed doing.

    Imo
     
  17. EastCoast

    EastCoast Active Member

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    I have been thinking along those same lines lately. Maybe things escalated between BR and JB in the dining room kitchen area and turned ugly.
    Maybe JB tried to run away with BR ensuing. Just a thought, but JB could have tried to put suitcase against wall to unlatch window and escape or
    scream for help and may have even broken it. Either one could have had the mag lite at that time and then BR grabbed it as JB ran toward WC to get away and the head blow happened outside WC door. There surely is something not right with the entire broken window in train room story.
    The paint brushes and rope were probably readily available at the location where the head blow occurred, but my guess would be JR took over from there.
     
  18. HarmonyE.

    HarmonyE. New Member

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    I don't think much about the broken window because I think it's yet another red herring that was later used to concoct nonsense, but I've never understood John's (alleged?*) decision to break that window rather than just call a locksmith. Why did he, a very wealthy man in his 50's, need to get into the house so badly so quickly that he was willing to smash a window and make the difficult maneuvers to get down into the basement? I don't recall what time of day it was, but even if it was the middle of the night, I'm sure an overnight stay at a local Boulder motel wouldn't have put a dent in his purse.

    We're likely never to know the full story, but if I were playing Family Feud and the question "Reasons why you'd break into your house even though you can afford help" came up, first thing that comes to my mind is "Drunk".

    *Burke is a very viable possibility as well.
     
  19. Miz Adventure

    Miz Adventure New Member

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    A few years ago I came home from work early and realized I didn't have my key. I knew I wouldn't be able to open the front door so I went around to the back. This was in the days before cell phones so if I had wanted to call anyone I would have had to go and find a public call box.

    One of the doors inside the back porch had an old fashioned lock. I went into the shed and took a chisel (because I couldn't find a screw driver) and managed to undo all four screws on the lock with it, the lock fell off the door and the door swung open. Voila! I was very pleased with myself.

    If there had been a small window where I could have gained access then I would have broken it.

    The alternative option was to stand outside my own house and wait hours for my husband to get home.
     
  20. AndHence

    AndHence Active Member

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