- Feb 21, 2013
- Reaction score
Superb sleuthing and insight!
Superb sleuthing and insight!
Re: the snippets of the article EileenHawkeye posted.
(Whether it's true or not) I find it interesting that in both examples the Ramseys gave for Patsy going and speaking to mothers of murdered children, both children were killed by other children.
If there really is a voice from BR that asks "what did you find?"
that reaks of serious suspicion and major problems for BR
if he comes into the room and see his parents in a panic then how would he know that something had to be "found" wouldnt the more normal question be
"what is going on?" or "whats wrong"
"what did you find?" was more of a rhetorical in the sense of
"oh crap, I know what you MUST have found and yet im going to play dumb and ask huhh,, ahhhh i know what i did and you know what i did but lets pretend you know i didnt do anything.
know what i mean
In this house, there are only two doors, and the windows don't open. The owners want it that way.
Downstairs, renovation is creating rooms that flow into each other through wide archways, so it's easy to see from one to the next. Upstairs, there is no hallway. The bedrooms - there are three - are separated by a small landing.
``There are no hiding places in this house,'' Patsy Ramsey says.
He used a stun gun on the child while she slept and took her to the basement, where he put a garotte around her neck and assaulted her. Then something went wrong, the Ramseys say. She must have regained consciousness and screamed - a scream heard by a neighbor - and was strangled. A powerful blow to her head ensured that she was dead.
Investigators have at least six strong leads with powerful circumstantial evidence, John said. ``If the police would investigate the leads they have half as thoroughly as they've investigated us . . .''
``The year before that, I had said I could not stand the indignity of being charged with murder,'' John said. ``It would be more than I could endure. So over the course of the year, basically, our attorneys' job was to get me ready to endure that. We were fully prepared, mentally.''
``The system hasn't worked so far. We can't expect it's going to work now,'' their attorneys told them. ``But we'll tell you this with 100 percent certainty: You will not be convicted. We will win at trial. That is not even in question.''
``Anybody who's ever had a child, and thinks that, has to have rocks in their heads,'' Patsy said. ``I mean, I love my husband. But I adore, passionately, my children. And if he ever laid a hand on them, I'd knock his block off. People just don't use their common sense.''
But both Ramseys agree it would be more tempting to cover up for your child than for your spouse.
``The love of a child is unconditional,'' John said. ``So that presents a much bigger dilemma, if you love that child unconditionally, and yet they've done this horrible thing. But if you love that child, you've got to get help for that child. It's a tougher question to think through.''
``I never met the leadership. They refused to meet with us. Never met (former Detective Commander John) Eller, never met (former Chief Tom) Koby, never met (current Chief Mark) Beckner. But from the outside, I see a bunch of young, inexperienced but eager people who were very poorly led. They did a tragic job as a result.''
``Because we didn't know where to go,'' John said. ``We were in a daze. All we were told was, `Leave the house. Get out of here.' ''
``If we were treated any better than anybody else, then . . . '' John said.
``I'd hate to be treated any worse,'' Patsy said.
I believe that Patsy smacked her head against something in a rage... JR helped coverup because of the previous sexual abuse that he (JR) committed. I do not believe that BR had anything to do with it
mubblefubbles;10152212]It really is this simple. I've been a PDI since early 1997. I have occasionally veered into the BDI (with parental coverup) but the problem with this is there is zero evidence that Burke did anything. And - he was only 9 years old, and I do not think he could have done such a serious crime without going off the rails in his teenage and early adult years - and by all appearances he was a well-adjusted youth and did well in school, and graduated from college. Also, I think if Burke did it, his conscious would have gotten to him and he would have told SOMEONE - a close friend, a best friend, a counselor, etc, and I believe that this would have somehow leaked out. I cannot believe that Burke could have kept such a dark secret (even if it was an accidental head blow followed by a parental coverup) - such a juicy secret - for 17 years.
And - I do not believe the evidence suggests that John did the murder. The PDI theory sort of along the lines of Steve Thomas' theory - is basically a pretty straightforward theory and explains what really happened that night. I think people over-think what happened and come up with bizarre theories in this case, when it is pretty obvious that it was PDI with a small but possible chance of BDI (with joint parental coverup). I am confident though that John did not commit this murder. JDI theories have never even remotely made a bit of sense to me
I'm hesitant to vote because it doesn't look like my option is there. I am of the opinion that Patsy caught John and JonBenet in a sexual act, chaos ensued, and Patsy caused the head injury. She and John probably weighed their options, decided that they couldn't talk to anyone about their situation, so then John strangled her with the garotte ("beheaded her") thus getting his hands dirty too.
I have always thought that Burke was innocent as I have never heard that a 9yo boy could be a psychopath and like previous posters have said, he could not have done so well at school and in society ever since. If he had been the one who had sexually molested her, he would now probably be a sex addict or pedophile. Such acts would have been stored in his subconscious mind and the effects would come out sooner or later with or without a conscience and affect his behaviour.
IMO the perpetrators were adults. There was IMO no evidence of DNA by anyone besides Patsy and John. I realise that it is difficult to believe that a parent would do this to a child and the other parent would help to cover it up but it does happen much too often.
I am also of the opinion that Patsy caught John in a sexual act with JBR. Perhaps it had been going on for some time especially if Patsy had ignored it before and had not wanted to be available for her husband's pleasure - hence one of the reasons to sexualise your daughter if you do not want sex with your husband.
However, when a child starts school at the age of 6yo, there is a big chance that she will tell her teachers something and expose it. Maybe Patsy had asked him to stop doing it, he agreed but could not help himself and kept doing it.
So on this night, Patsy caught him doing it again and she exploded in anger thinking that JBR might tell her teachers or others. Hence the need to cover up the sexual abuse before JBR has a chance to expose it to anyone. IMO this is the reason why JBR had to die and what happened later was all about covering up the sexual abuse. In other words, the only way to cover it up was to murder JBR and blame it on an intruder. This scenario is a more common scenario in society than many of the others stated here.
If the scenario you describe were the case, one would think that PR would choose to confront it at a time after the vacation they were taking the next day. Also, IMO JR would be much more concerned about the exposure than PR, so I could see JR killing her to cover up the sexual abuse, and then blaming it on an intruder.
It isn't plausible that JR committed this crime. Patsy wrote the note, and if JDI then she decided to cover up for John - and I think this is a fantastical idea. JDI theorists believe that Patsy would cover for John in order to maintain her status and her lifestyle. But, Patsy would have done great during a divorce, getting half of John's considerable assets plus child/spousal support.
Patsy did the crime (a rage/accident killing IMO), and John felt compelled to cover for Patsy because Patsy "had something" on John (she knew about the molesting, and she was always a risk to reveal this molesting if John ever dared think about telling the police the truth about Patsy doing the crime).
JDI is more plausible than IDI, but that isn't saying much. If I could break down a percentage of likelihood, it would be 90% PDI, 9% BDI and .99% JDI and .01% IDI The odds that John did it are very slim, but the odds of an intruder doing it are absolutely astronomical.
I can't rule Burke out completely - but he was 9 years old and has been very well-adjusted after this crime. I actually think Burke thinks his parents are innocent of any wrongdoing and that it really was an intruder. If Burke thought his parents did this, I can imagine him being more than willing to talk about it, especially since so many out there suspect him of doing the crime. In this case an innocent Burke who believes his parents (one, the other or both) killed his sister would be at some level angry that there are those calling him a killer. He'd talk.
I know there is history of sexual abuse but did any history of physical abuse ever come up? I went to find a recent picture of Burke on google images and a picture of JBR modeling came up and there was a large black and blue bruise on her inner left bicep. Was curious if this was ever brought up before?
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