Known rope in the house

[BlueCrab]

In the autopsy photo, I think the blanched area on the lower part of the neck shows where the cord was positioned when the garotte was yanked the first time. The blanched area seems to be the same width as the cord. The red areas surrounding the blanched area appear to be petechial hemmorhages. I agree the rope could have been used, but I see no indication of it. For some reason, I can't see the scalloped pattern others of you do.

Ivy, I tend to agree with much of what you say in this post. The circumferential blanched area at the bottom of the neck may have been from the 1/4" white nylon cord, but it could also have been from the 1/2" manila rope. In other words, maybe both the cord and the rope had been wrapped around her neck, perhaps simultaneously and for different reasons.

The lower circumferential injury on the neck is of particular interest. There had obviously been a cord or rope wrapped around the neck at that point because the petechial hemorrhages are there just above the injury. But the important thing is the white area where the cord or rope had been.

Blanching like that wouldn't have occurred unless the cord or rope had been left tight around the neck before and after death, preventing blood to enter that area of the skin and thus blanching it white compared to the surrounding skin.

It could mean that the thicker rope had been used to hang JonBenet by the neck, but had been removed from the neck later after cutting her down. The smaller cord with the ligature on one end and a wooden handle on the other end, IMO, had been used for another purpose -- EA.

Just my opinion.

BlueCrab

 

[BlueCrab]

Ivy,

I don't see the scalloped marks on this picture either. There are other views that show the patterned marks, but they were barely able to be seen. Nevertheless, the marks are there because I saw them about 2 years ago and, IMO, could fit the 3-strand twisted 1/2" manila rope found in JAR's room.

Just my opinion.

 

[lannie]

Ivy,

I don't see the scalloped marks on this picture either. There are other views that show the patterned marks, but they were barely able to be seen. Nevertheless, the marks are there because I saw them about 2 years ago and, IMO, could fit the 3-strand twisted 1/2" manila rope found in JAR's room.

Just my opinion.

I can see them , poor little thing,they sure were into killing her ,this can't be called a gentle death.

 

[Ivy]

BlueCrab, I don't notice the patterned marks in this photo either, but I do notice that the large, red triangular mark appears to lie exactly between the garotte cord and the place where the lower cord would have been.

The lower righthand side of the triangular mark is straight across at the bottom and doesn't extend below where the lower cord would have been, which I think might mean that at some point in time, there were indeed two cords around JonBenet's neck, instead of just one cord that was yanked twice.

 

[Toth]

So your contention is that rope rather than JonBenet's fingernails made those marks and that rope rather than a human being made the non-Ramsey male dna under those fingernails that did not scratch her neck as she clawed fruitlessly at the garotte or fruitlessly at her attacker.

 

[Jayelles]

So your contention is that rope rather than JonBenet's fingernails made those marks and that rope rather than a human being made the non-Ramsey male dna under those fingernails that did not scratch her neck as she clawed fruitlessly at the garotte or fruitlessly at her attacker.

I'm not sure who you are directing this question to. However, I do think you are twisting what is being said on this thread. Why_Nutt posted the rope picture as a suggestion that Patsy was being less than truthful when she said she'd never seen rope like that before. I don't think anyone is suggesting that the rope was used to strangle her.

The photo of the fingernail marks has been posted before and there was considerable discussion about it. Learneth thee not?

The question which was left was - why were the fingernail marks on her neck UNDER the cord and why were they pointing at a diagonal angle? Surely if she was clawing at the cord, they would have been above and below the cord with up to four fingernails pointing downwards and one thumb nail pointing upwards.

 

[Ivy]

Say WHAT, Toth? Oh well, never mind.

 

[Shylock]

Toth, stick with the facts would you please. There was NOTHING under her fingernails to indicate she scratched herself or anyone else. No skin or blood whatsoever.

 

[Shylock]

BlueCrab, I don't notice the patterned marks in this photo either,

Ivy, you can see the marks in that photo you posted. There are three dash lines under the garrote cord, on a slight angle upward, just left of the center of her neck. They each look about an inch long, spaced slightly over a quarter-inch apart.
They are not that clear on that "straight on"photo. There is a side photo around someplace that shows them much more clearly. In the side photo you can also see they are not straight but have a curve to them.

 

[Britt]

And why would the killer stage both a kidnapping and a murder scene?

Murder = because JonBenet was dead.

Kidnapping = because the perp had to invent an intruder and a motive.

 

[Jayelles]

I sent you the photo - did you receive it?

 

[Toth]

There was NOTHING under her fingernails to indicate she scratched herself or anyone else. No skin or blood whatsoever.

So you are telling us that the dna came from the 'thin air' that was under her fingernails?

 

[Toth]

Kidnapping = because the perp had to invent an intruder and a motive.

How about a kidnapping note solely to add to his intense enjoyment of the night's activities. He really liked the prolonged death but he liked also the prolonged agony he was inflicting on the parents waiting for a call that would never come. Nicely, Nicely couldn't have up with a better 'added touch' than that one!

 

[Imon128]

So you are telling us that the dna came from the 'thin air' that was under her fingernails?

The DNA didn't have to come from flesh, did it? From the medical evidence I've read, JonBenet didn't show signs of struggle with the perp.

 

[why_nutt]

I sent you the photo - did you receive it?

Yes, I did. Here is a comparison of the two ropes:

http://s92053900.onlinehome.us/ropecomparison.html

 

[Jayelles]

Cheers! You can see there's a considerable difference in the diameters. The upholstery/pillow trim comes in different diameters. This one is 1/4 inch. It also comes in 1/2 and 3/4 inch. I haven't seen in it in 1 inch diameter though.

 

[Toth]

The DNA didn't have to come from flesh, did it?

Perhaps you think the dna came from the intruder's tears? It sure didn't come from any rope.

 

[BlueCrab]

From the photos of JonBenet's circumferential neck abrasions, I tend to believe that TWO separate cords or ropes had been around her neck -- and probably both at the same time.

The braided white 1/4" nylon cord imbedded deeply into the skin on the upper neck was NOT likely the cord that strangled JonBenet because there are very few petechial hemorrhages visible above and below the cord. Thus, it was apparently tightened after death.

But on the lower circumferential injury on the neck, the one with the scalloped patterns, there are considerable petechial hemorrhages just above where apparently a rope had been (at the blanched area). In my opinion JonBenet was strangled to death by the rope that had been at this area of the neck, and it looks likely to have been a heavier 1/2" twisted strand manila rope such as the type found in JAR's bedroom. The scalloped patterns would have been abrasions from the twisted strands of the manila rope.

It appears to me that the braided 1/4" white nylon cord had been used in erotic asphyxiation and wasn't extremely tightened as shown until after death.

And it appears to me that a 1/2" twisted 3-strand manila rope could have been around the lower part of JonBenet's neck and was used to kill her, perhaps by hanging.

Just my opinion.

BlueCrab

 

[Shylock]

So you are telling us that the dna came from the 'thin air' that was under her fingernails?

Isn't that what the experts said, Toth? Or didn't you read the part about them saying the DNA might not even exist, and might just be "stutter effect" from the testing process?

 

[Imon128]

Perhaps you think the dna came from the intruder's tears? It sure didn't come from any rope.

I sincerely doubt that the supposed intruder would have had tears. From the note, if we are to believe an intruder, the perp would have been only too happy to do JB in, unless you think they are tears of joy?

I don't see the connection to the rope and tears, but I know you'll make the connection. So far, we only have Patsy's fibers in that rope.