KS - Layne Mays, 22, Murdered by her brother, Overland Park 14 Jan 2020

Discussion in 'Crimes in the News' started by Jewels53, Jan 16, 2020.

  1. akazia1978

    akazia1978 Well-Known Member

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    It could also be meth. Same symptoms. Also if you take meth while on a ssri, very bad things happen. My ex swung at me with a metal bat in a fit of delusions....police said it was serotonin syndrome.I got out of that with only a broken foot thankfully.
    Also, my fiancee now had a brother, fabulous artist and meth addict who also would attack family during his delusional periods and was pretty dangerous. He perished mysteriously in a house fire five years ago...I have his art in my house, and it's clear when the real mental breakdown started occurring due to use that lasted until his death.
    Maybe he's schizo, maybe it's meth. Time will tell.
     


  2. akazia1978

    akazia1978 Well-Known Member

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    I also just realized kind of ironically, my ex meth addict boyfriends parents were both psychiatrists...
     
  3. Jmh1985

    Jmh1985 Member

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    I posted last night regarding the unfortunate situation that many face who may have mental illness. Many people may say they feel no pity for someone that did such a horrible act of violence to their loved ones... and I have to honestly say that I would have felt the same way prior to directly working with individuals dealing with an acute mental illness. When I was offered a job to work as an RN in a psychiatric unit, I wasn’t quite sure if I had the empathy for it, mostly because I have never encountered anyone (friends/family/myself) that had any pronounced signs of mental illness. Just after the first few shifts, I couldn’t believe how eye opening it was for me and how naive I was to it. Most that I treated had mental health issues that stemmed from chronic drug use unfortunately. I could go on and on... but the sad truth is that mental health and psychiatric disorders do not discriminate and there should be more resources to help those that suffer from it.
     
  4. Dnp2be

    Dnp2be Well-Known Member

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    It is my understanding that Meth works on the dopamine receptors and SSRI’s work on the serotonin receptors. Most antidepressants work on serotonin receptors but there are some that work on dopamine such as Wellbutrin. I’ve had serotonin syndrome before due to antidepressants and taking Tramadol (non narcotic pain medication) for an injury. I never became violent. I just became sick to my stomach, dizzy, and increased heart rate. I also know that using meth while on antidepressants doesn’t always cause people to become violent. Meth use is not good of course but not everyone on meth behaves the same way. Medications and drugs can affect every person differently. This is also why it can take years to find a medication that works for some people.

    Not trying to be rude but I just wanted to clarify because while there’s always a possibility he was on drugs that led to his actions, we cannot generalize a group based on some people’s experiences. I’ve done this unintentionally myself before. We do not know why he did what he did or what caused it at this point.
     
  5. Dnp2be

    Dnp2be Well-Known Member

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    I also wanted to add that it is true that drug use and mental illness seem to go hand in hand with each other. Of course this is not true with all individuals. However, it is my opinion that the drug use is a means to self-medicate. What is hard to determine is what causes what. Did the individual use drugs which triggered the mental illness? Or did the individual start using drugs to help with the symptoms experiences because of the mental illness? Hard to say. And of course, there are those that have mental illness and don’t use drugs and visa versa.
     
  6. Boston Corbett

    Boston Corbett Well-Known Member

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    Baker is indeed a fine school. I have a friend who got his BA there on the road to attaining a Ph. D. in (wait for it) psychology; he does not practice, but heads up a doctoral program in psychology and psychiatry at another excellent (and Methodist) college, also in the Midwest.

    Good point on the dad, though he could not, professionally, at least, diagnose his own son due to self-same professional concerns. They had the money and social set, though, to get him a diagnosis....IF he were willing to go along with obtaining help -- and he would have gotten plenty. One wonders the dynamics of the family unit at the time of the loved one's murder.

    This case reminds me of that of yet another well-regarded psychiatrist, who became schizophrenic just after high school, was in trouble continually since that time, and finally, years later, set the family home on fire. No injuries but a lifetime of collecting and of accumulating and of possessions and -- everything lost.

    I should I know be more sympathetic but as I was not at all to the arsonist, an upper-middle class lout with neck and face tattoos whose parents I imagine still pull strings in the attempt to lessen his prison days, I cannot bring myself to be to the killer here.

    I still can muster no sympathy for him. (Here's a blog, btw, from years ago by the arsonist I spoke of in para.3. Not uninteresting.) I do bow to those of you who do. I just cannot help but think of his poor sister, and those hands of his -- watch the video and know those hands strangled a member of his small family.
     
    Last edited: Feb 16, 2020
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  7. Boston Corbett

    Boston Corbett Well-Known Member

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    Doesn't feel like meth, or drugs, particularly, to me. He indeed may have supplemented his state of delusion by (so-called) self-medicating. Wait, this sounds closer -- I think it will be found he snorted Adderall (just a guess but has that feel) IF drugs played a role at all here.

    Sometimes, there is just meanness, plain old organic hate, familiar to us since the dawn of time.
     
  8. Boston Corbett

    Boston Corbett Well-Known Member

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    Yes, I realize they do not discriminate etc., but still find their actions heinous and ask those who sympathize to give equal weight to the victim and his or her family and friends. Equal? More, of course; more weight for the injured and the dead.
     
  9. JaneEyre

    JaneEyre Mean people suck.

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    I’m confused about how tramadol plays into serotonin syndrome. Can you explain?
     
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  10. bananararma

    bananararma New Member

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    I agree.

    To think that his poor sisters entire LIFE was plagued by his ramblings, lunacy, and probable violence, and then in the end, he kills her?
    <modsnip>

    And while I know I suppose I should feel sorry for the rest of this mans family, I'm finding it hard to do so since it was their job to protect the daughter. But who knows? They may have tried to get him locked up.
     
    Last edited by a moderator: Feb 17, 2020
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  11. flute4peace

    flute4peace Well-Known Member

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    I don't think anyone's giving him the benefit of the doubt, or excusing his behavior.

    I'm a firm believer that there is a distinct difference between explanation and excuse. When something horrible happens, the human being in us tries to find an explanation for what led the person to do such a horrible thing. Mental illness and/or drugs are being discussed as potential explanations for his behavior. And frankly, we don't know if he had any diagnosis or treatment or what the backstory is with his parents/family/issues.

    No explanation *excuses* his behavior. He still did it (assumed), and should still face the appropriate consequences as determined by the court system.
     
  12. oviedo

    oviedo Well-Known Member

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    what a bloody, vicious death - this poor family ..
    JMO
     
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  13. ddean38

    ddean38 Active Member

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    In understanding behavioral pharmacology, drugs do not cause violence in any case. There are predispositions (such as mental illness--more specifically schizophrenia) that can cause a person to be violent when they use drugs. The serotonin syndrome causes similar effects as someone on LSD (which activates serotonin receptors) which include hallucinogens, dissociation, and other effects but never the direct cause of violence. Also, meth and other stimulants affect multiple monamines (such as dopamine, norepinephrine, and serotonin). While many mental illnesses and drug use have similar effects they are not always equal. Many people utilize the dopamine hypothesis of schizophrenia for the equivalence of drug-induced psychosis, while this is not true. The dopamine hypothesis is about the lack of dopamine in the frontal cortex (where inhibition and many cognitive processes occur) producing the negative effects of schizophrenia making the brain produce excess dopamine in the limbic system which causes the positive effects of schizophrenia.

    Overall that means drugs cannot be associated with a person's violence (not a direct cause) but can decrease inhibition (such as drinking). While on the other hand, a mental illness such as schizophrenia has direct relations to decreased social awareness and increased violent behaviors (and much more) due to the distribution of dopamine in the brain.
     
  14. flute4peace

    flute4peace Well-Known Member

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    This is really interesting, thank you for sharing! I do have a question, though. I have a couple of relatives in Law Enforcement, and we see on TV all the time where people are jacked up on Meth or PCP or other drugs, and they are absolutely violent with super-human strength. I'm interested in how that works in to the physiological processes you've talked about above. (Not questioning what you said, just curious and interested in some further/deeper information).

    Thanks!
     
  15. akazia1978

    akazia1978 Well-Known Member

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    All I know is my personal experience with meth addicts, and what the hospital diagnosed my ex with. He was seeing shadow people and thought I was attacking him for some reason. He posted on his facebook my address and to call 911 (I already had, but his friends did also). I will say that when he attacked me, he was extremely hard to get the bat away from, and I am bigger and stronger than him normally (I box). Sober he was a pretty meek and weak (strength wise) individual. I'd be interested in learning how that happens also...I'd also seen it on TV but was still surprised by the reality of it.

    Sometimes I think maybe the fear of the delusions while on meth leads to violent behavior....that and maybe lack of sleep plays a role. Hopefully someone with deeper knowledge on the physiological processes can answer :)
     
  16. ddean38

    ddean38 Active Member

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    This is more about pain reception and inhibition than the direct action of a drug. It's easy to relate this to when someone has been drinking and falls/hurts themselves in some way but don't feel the pain during intoxication, but rather when intoxication ends. Strength is stopped by the pain reception in the nerves endings throughout the body and when on specific drugs the pain reception decreases. This is how the people displaying "superhuman strength" are able to push the boundaries of pain beyond a sober human. This is especially the case for drugs that also increase the release of norepinephrine.
    Norepinephrine is the only known drug to cause a direct increase of strength (which is a neurotransmitter more commonly known as adrenaline). This is the "fight or flight" drug that is produced within the body (and what's in EpiPens) that is released in situations of high levels of stress. In situations where a person has decreased pain reception and has increased levels of NE the person displays unusual amounts of strength. But NE alone will allow a person to behave the same way especially in contexts of life and death such as someone lifting a car to save a loved one.

    I love when people take an interest in the behavioral pharmacology of drugs! Thanks!
     
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  17. flute4peace

    flute4peace Well-Known Member

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    This makes a lot of sense, thank you for explaining. It is fascinating (and also very sad).
     
  18. flute4peace

    flute4peace Well-Known Member

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    I'm so sorry you had to experience that. It must have been frightening and devastating.
     
  19. Jewels53

    Jewels53 Well-Known Member

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    @Niner

    20CR00137 Mays, Parker


    03/03/2020
    SET BOND CONDITION, ALLOWED TO HAVE CONTACT W/ MOTHER-NOT TO DISCUSS THE CASE

    03/19/20 10:30am 8 NO GO PRELIM HEARING

    CASE HISTORY (ROA)
     
  20. sister7

    sister7 Member

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    This piece of info has been added as a remark on his home movie:

    First of all he isn’t on anything some people beat him really bad and it caused him some brain damage .


     
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