Kyron Horman Discussion Thread 2020 - 2022

Status
Not open for further replies.

ReadySet

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2015
Messages
2,115
Reaction score
11,205
And let's not forget that a portion of those 90-minutes would involve driving to and from the actual drop-off point. (Or to whatever her purpose was).

She had to drive from the 2nd Fred Meyer (Walker Road) to her intended and planned destination (IMO) and then back to the flower farm to pick up her "helper". Then reach the gym to make herself visible again.

I spent some time a while back on Google maps working out driving times from the purported ping location and also from the Newberry Road area. It worked out to where she seemed to have had about 30 minutes to do whatever it was she did.

There are also statements "out there" saying she may have been spotted in the same areas in the days leading up to June 4th driving her hot red Mustang. Canvassing? Choosing a location? Doing some preliminary work that would save time? Visiting a friend? We don't know.
Yes, thanks; since we don't know where Terri went and she was not able or willing to tell, we have no idea how long to drive to the drop-off point. She had never disappeared anyone before, so she didn't know how long it would take.
 

ReadySet

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 1, 2015
Messages
2,115
Reaction score
11,205
No, polygraphs are bunk. Using them as a screening tool is the height of lunacy, since passing or failing one tells you nothing about whether they tell the truth or not. The people who passed a polygraph include Aldrich Ames and Gary Ridgway. It doesn't matter if the administrator is a "professional" or not.

The non-functionality of polygraphs has been known for a long time. The US Congress Office of Technology Management, the National Academy of Sciences and the American Psychological Association all found them to be unreliable. But some LEAs still believe in them, either because they're deluded or just set in their ways. It doesn't help that there is a 2 billion dollar industry surrounding polygraphs. The only "gray" area is that some LEAs might be aware of the unreliability of polygraphs, but use them as an intimidation tool. At this point, passing or failing becomes irrelevant since police are allowed to lie about it. Of course, that still doesn't make it right, since as with other deceptive techniques such as Reid, it can produce false confessions.
If I reject a screening tool out of hand, and decide that it is never useful in any circumstance with any person, then I don't have to read about or listen to others about that tool. Easy. Done. Much harder to sort and sift the information and find a middle ground.
 

gliving

Woof
Joined
Sep 5, 2003
Messages
7,217
Reaction score
25,613
Regardless of who testified, the state put forth the evidence. The GJ didn't indict.
I know, right!? It's all been discussed before. Lots of unanswered questions on previous threads.


 

Truth Prevails

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
2,529
Reaction score
3,252
Regardless of who testified, the state put forth the evidence. The GJ didn't indict.
And you know this how? It's my understanding that grand juries are "secret" proceedings.

Surely you don't mean that a grand jury was impaneled solely to investigate DeDe's "working for pay while drawing unemployment benefits" scheme?

It speaks to character, but it's just not that important. You know?

Grand juries have been impaneled for the Kyron Horman case. Due to DeDe's involvement with Terri on June 4th, 2010, and moving in with her shortly thereafter, she has attracted the serious attention of law enforcement and they want to know what she knows about Kyron's disappearance. That's the reason for her appearance, if she ever actually appeared, before a grand jury.

The media has reported only once that she had been subpoenaed to testify. That was in July of 2010.
Quote: Spicher appeared before an investigative grand jury in Portland on Monday, according to her attorney, Chad Stavley.

Stavley, who told HLN that he was retained Friday, said Spicher was not asked any questions by the prosecutor but was ordered to return at a future date.



Let's have a look at this quote from 2013:
Quote: DeDe Spicher spoke exclusively to a relatively obscure website, ...
...
According to the website, investigators have "unofficially cleared" Spicher of any involvement in the disappearance of Kyron and Spicher hopes the Multnomah County district attorney will issue a statement publicly clearing her.



It appears as though she is still waiting for her "official" "public" clearance, as I can find no further mention of it. And I spent quite a bit of time on Google. Silly me.

So, do you have a source other than one that won't fly here? Because I don't think there is one. MOO

I would also like to draw attention to the following quote and link:
Quote: Grand jury hearings are closed to the media and to the public. The secret panel can bring criminal charges or help collect information.


That's most likely what they were doing in all the grand juries on Kyron's case--collecting information. All this boasting about private knowledge of grand juries bringing back no true bill is most likely only that, boasting. It never happened. MOO
 

Truth Prevails

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
2,529
Reaction score
3,252
Why are you heaping shame on Law Enforcement?
Kyron Richard Horman has not been seen since June 4th, 2010; 12 years ago. He was 7 years old.

Law enforcement called a press conference. They took center stage and stood with tears in their eyes as they made a solemn pledge to bring home a 7-year-old child who had seemingly disappeared. They spoke directly to the child.

That child was Kyron Richard Horman. 7 years old. Gentle and kind and caring. Smart. A talented artist, and an excellent writer. Obedient. He volunteered his time to feed Bootsie, the cat, in an old shed on the property because the cat wasn't allowed inside. He held his little sister's hand so, so tenderly. He had a best friend. Kyron mattered.

And what did law enforcement do in response to the incredibly moving promise they had made at the press conference? Nothing. They wouldn't even call the main suspect, a suspect. Instead, they allowed evidence to be destroyed, they took her on little drives in the countryside hoping to jog her memory, (didn't work) and they kept "talking politely" to her as she failed one poly, stormed away from a second, and failed a third.

They managed to discover evidence of murder-for-hire plots, but they wrecked that.

They showed her then-husband that they had enough probable cause to arrest her, but they didn't.

Then we had to sit and listen to all their money woes--how much it was costing in overtime, how it was exceeding their budget. Blah, blah, blah.

A 7-year-old child disappeared. Find the money. Find the child. Keep your promise.

What are they doing today? Whatever it is, if it's anything besides offering platitudes, is not enough.

Justice for Kyron.

Shame on law enforcement.


A grand jury was convened. They chose not to indict.
See my previous comment. I sincerely hope you have a link to offer.


LE has done and continues to do their job.
I strongly disagree.


Concerning your reenactment photo, how does she supposedly get KH from the science fair into the truck without anyone noticing?
The re-enactment was done by law enforcement. I simply added the photo to the thread. It does not belong to me. I linked it.

She walked him out as bold as brass. Everyone was used to seeing Kyron with her. All three of them walking together would raise no alarm. A child knowingly under the care of a stepmother is allowed to be taken from the school by that stepmother. Why should anyone have questioned that at the time? I don't even think anyone would have the right to question it. It wasn't memorable in any way, which is what she banked on and it worked.

Desiree has said there are three witnesses who saw them in the school parking lot. She goes no further.

It's my theory du jour that the stepmother continued walking to the access road where a friend had parked the F250 while the stepmother was in Skyline with Kyron. The right side of the vehicle (passenger side) could not be seen except perhaps from one parking space. What they could see, if they could see anything, if they were looking, is extremely debatable.

All she had to do was open the passenger door. One blow. One push. Less than a minute. This woman had been a bodybuilder and boasted, albeit graphically, about how much she could bench press.

He was so tiny that a couple of floor mats from that big truck would have hardly made a bulge if they were used to cover him as he lay on the floor. But I'm sure she came prepared.

What do you think a witness could see, from a fair distance, amongst trees and shrubs and tall grass? If they bothered to look long enough or happened to be looking at just the right moment? And she wasn't blind. If someone could see her, she could see that someone. She would have done nothing, in that case.

So that's my theory, and I'm entitled to it. The more attention it gets, the more I like it. IMHO

But I am going to do the Google maps walking tour. Time, or lack thereof, is my problem.
 

Alleykins

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2016
Messages
5,950
Reaction score
9,168
Postpartum? Do you mean like Andrea Yates?

I'm not overly familiar with the Andrea Yates case, so I can't speak to that. I do know what case you're referring to, though.
But what I do mean by postpartum is the psychological effects of childbirth as opposed the physical recovery from childbirth.
 

minazoe

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
6,042
Reaction score
13,670
I believe Terri is a psychopath and no doubt had been abusing Kyron for some time...they do this..he was a quiet little boy and I'm sure she threatened him. ( you can just see how diminished and pale he looks in his last picture) She probably hated the child and decided to dispose of him like a farm animal that is just too much trouble. My guess is Kyron's father would have had some unfortunate end as well eventually.

She made up a fake doctor appointment...end of story...the "doctor" appointment was his euthanasia...the choice of doctor appointment as her red herring is very telling IMO.

She probably beat him to death. I am sorry to say this...but this woman is one of those secret bullies who gets you alone and then punches you in the stomach for no reason.

I hope they charge her soon as she is a murderer and must be punished. mOO
 

txsleuth70

Well-Known Member
Joined
Mar 13, 2017
Messages
63
Reaction score
504
I'm not overly familiar with the Andrea Yates case, so I can't speak to that. I do know what case you're referring to, though.
But what I do mean by postpartum is the psychological effects of childbirth as opposed the physical recovery from childbirth.
The poster is meaning that Terri's baby was probably too old at that point for Terri to be considered as going through a Post Partum Depressive episode.
 

Alleykins

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 28, 2016
Messages
5,950
Reaction score
9,168
The poster is meaning that Terri's baby was probably too old at that point for Terri to be considered as going through a Post Partum Depressive episode.

Because PPD can appear anywhere from a couple of weeks to 12 months after birth, there’s no average length of time it lasts. A 2014 review of studies suggests that PPD symptoms improve over time, with many cases of depression resolving 3 to 6 months after they begin.

That said, in that same review, it was clear that plenty of participants were still dealing with PPD symptoms well beyond the 6-month mark.

Anywhere from 30 to 50 percent met criteria for PPD 1 year after giving birth, while a little less than half of the people studied were still reporting depressive symptoms 3 years postpartum.
 

Truth Prevails

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
2,529
Reaction score
3,252
The poster is meaning that Terri's baby was probably too old at that point for Terri to be considered as going through a Post Partum Depressive episode.
If I'm the poster you are referring to, your point is appreciated but not exactly what I meant.

Andrea Yates murdered five of her own children; five precious children. Five. She managed to find enough sense to immediately call law enforcement. And then call her husband. She would eventually confess to drowning her innocent sweet children. Ages 7, 5, 3, 2, and 6 months.

She used postpartum depression, postpartum psychosis, and schizophrenia as her excuse.

If Kyron's case ever gets to trial, we might see something similar used as a defense; especially if it gets to the penalty phase.

Right now, in my opinion, it is already being used to drum up sympathy.

But hey, if Jodi Arias could claim herself as an abused woman, why not try something similar here?

Just keep throwing stuff at the wall and see what sticks. But, as Kaine said, "I think we know, we all do".
 

minazoe

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 17, 2008
Messages
6,042
Reaction score
13,670
If I'm the poster you are referring to, your point is appreciated but not exactly what I meant.

Andrea Yates murdered five of her own children; five precious children. Five. She managed to find enough sense to immediately call law enforcement. And then call her husband. She would eventually confess to drowning her innocent sweet children. Ages 7, 5, 3, 2, and 6 months.

She used postpartum depression, postpartum psychosis, and schizophrenia as her excuse.

If Kyron's case ever gets to trial, we might see something similar used as a defense; especially if it gets to the penalty phase.

Right now, in my opinion, it is already being used to drum up sympathy.

But hey, if Jodi Arias could claim herself as an abused woman, why not try something similar here?

Just keep throwing stuff at the wall and see what sticks. But, as Kaine said, "I think we know, we all do".

Jodi Arias turns my blood to ice water... that said this case is one of the saddest cases..everything about it is just so maddening in such an average area, average people on a regular day, a Childs science fair at school..

all planned out..there is no depression excuse for walking a child out of school, murdering him and hiding his body.

she will use the driving amnesia as an excuse to claim she was insane and doesn't remember what she did. mOO
 

osu

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
3,289
Reaction score
30,580
dbm
 
Last edited:

osu

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jul 6, 2011
Messages
3,289
Reaction score
30,580
IF Terri had been suffering from PPD for the 18 months after Kitty was born, IMO she recovered from it pretty quickly after Kyron went *missing*.

Just a couple of days after, Terri was Facebooking telling her friends she was “hitting the gym”. A couple of weeks after that Terri was entertaining her friend DDS at the house for a sleep-over. They were buying bat phones, joking and laughing, eating Nutter Butters and junk food. Terri was bragging about hiring her new and very expensive defense attorney and sending illicit nude pics and sext messages to one of her husband’s best friends.

She was acting just like a giddy schoolgirl without a care in the world. IMO, quite the opposite of someone who is suffering from long-term Postpartum Depression.
 
Last edited:

Truth Prevails

Well-Known Member
Joined
Aug 14, 2008
Messages
2,529
Reaction score
3,252
If you use Google Street View and place yourself at the entrance to the southern parking lot of Skyline School, and face northwestward looking down Skyline Boulevard, I, at least, can see that "hidden patch" perfectly. Not even elevation helps, really, since Skyline Boulevard slopes downwards and the access road is more visible from the parking lot than right below it. This would also have occurred between 8:45 and 9:00, when dozens of parents would get in their cars and drive onto Skyline Boulevard. Everyone turning an immediate right would have a perfect view of the clandestine deed, and Terri would have no real way of seeing them in advance.

It would be an incredibly poor choice of place for a murder.
I'm afraid I have to disagree. Hopefully, my linked screenshots will offer clarification and be allowed to stand.

You say you can see the “hidden patch” perfectly, and so can I. However, do you think we could see the “hidden patch” perfectly if the F250 was slightly pulled over and parked on the narrow access road? I do not.

In fact, the F250 is instrumental in creating the “hidden patch”.

It seems to me that the access road is only visible from the very tip of the entrance/exit to the parking area. Vehicles would be making either their left or right turn onto Skyline Boulevard. Their focus would be on the traffic on the boulevard, not on what was happening in a narrow space between the passenger side of an F250 parked down the access road and the somewhat high embankment to its right. If they could even see what was happening in that “narrow space” or the “hidden patch”. And I highly doubt they could.

We’re talking about busy people driving motor vehicles needing to get to their next destination. I wonder how many were on their cell phones as well. They weren’t interested in what was happening on the access road. There was no reason for them to be. She had caused no disturbance; done nothing to draw attention to herself.

Another point worth noting is whether we believe a perfect place to commit an unspeakable crime exists. I don’t think so. Such an act requires a risk. The perpetrator looks for a familiar, thereby comfortable, location that offers the least amount of risk.

That’s why this area interests me. It fits the criteria. It’s the perfect place to commit an unthinkable act in the briefest amount of time; or for an intermediary to appear (waiting in the F250) who would have the necessary contacts to sell a child.

In the first two images below, I have added the white arrow about where I think the back of Kaine's F250 was (based on the recreation images). It was parked facing the soccer field. If you click on the links you'll have a much larger picture and be able to move around in it a bit. (The arrow won't appear, of course. But that's the only difference).

I used May of 2009 for the screenshots. I think the foliage would have been a little fuller in the month of June.

Kyron Horman Access Road 1.jpg
Google Maps

Kyron Horman Access Road 2.jpg
Google Maps

Below are the photos from law enforcement showing the "generic" F250 parked on the access road for recreation purposes.
Kyron Horman Access Road 3.jpg
Detectives Seek Public Help in Kyron Horman Case - Salem-News.Com
 

Laughing

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 4, 2010
Messages
13,042
Reaction score
44,765
I’m in agreement that Terri is responsible for Kyron’s demise.
Is there a general consensus as to what her motive was?

Oh, heck, jmho just off the top of my head imho allows her to cut ties with Desiree, more $$$ to pamper daughter, allows her to look like a tragic figure, hurts Kaine & Desire but doesn't hurt The Red Squirrel, she no longer needs to invest time & energy in Desire's child & can get back into bodybuilding....

What other ideas occur to you? I wanna hear 'em.

jmho ymmv lrr
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Top