MD - Coast Guard Lt. Christopher Paul Hasson, plotted white supremacist mass murder, Feb 2019

Discussion in 'Rampage Killings and Terrorist Attacks' started by Wagtales10, Feb 20, 2019.

  1. marble

    marble Well-Known Member

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    There is no such thing as "self-radicalization". If he was part of a skinhead group 30 years ago, well I can tell you from being in the punk scene that racist tracts/zines and racist Hate music were they way this ideology was spread. There was no "chance" in this. Since then there are many groups whose publications carried on this tradition, like the Council of Conservative Citizens tracts. Once the internet became a thing most organizing and indoctrination happens online. The many factions that make of the "Alt Right" work very hard to bring new members into the fold or radicalize the "merely" bigoted or racist. I'm sorry, but I just don't understand what you mean by "self radicalization". These beliefs come from somewhere and are bolstered by the communities and groups that also hold them.
     
  2. Wagtales10

    Wagtales10 WOOF WOOF WOOF - call them out

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    Self Radicalization is a bad excuse to try to not mention that there is an actual white nationalist and supremacist problem in this country. Instead of looking for those who are spreading this message of violence and hate, we excuse them.

    What was the first thing asked about the boston bombers? "Where were they radicalized". But not here why?

    71% of domestic terrorism in america has been perpetrated by right wing white men and white nationalists/supremacists
    link - Challengers from the Sidelines: Understanding America’s Violent Far-Right – Combating Terrorism Center at West Point
     
  3. human

    human Well-Known Member

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    Exactly. It is so blatant as to what the situation is re why people scream and rant about Muslims or blacks.
     
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  4. Cryptic

    Cryptic Well-Known Member

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    Really?

    FBI agents say there is such a thing as self radicalization:
    Terrorist Plot Foiled “Anyone with a computer can self-radicalize,” added the agent, a veteran counterterrorism investigator.

    So does President Obama. Omar Mateen was considered to of been "self radicalized":
    FBI and Obama confirm Omar Mateen was radicalized on the internet

    Self Radicalization does not mean that the individual completely created an ideology on his own with absolutely no other contact with other humans or human created sources.

    Rather, self radicalization means that the individual sought out the ideology on his own as an adult and then made a conscious choice to participate in it.

    Self Radicalized individuals are not groomed for the role, nor are they heavily dioncostrinated by a third party. Mc Veigh, Mohammad Atah and Adolph Hitler were all self radicalized.
    Self radicalization is not an excuse for anything. Rather, it is a factual description of some individuals

    Individual white nationalist, Jihadis, Maoists, black power activists, and...heck, I don't know.... Earth Firsters can all be self radicalized. Their ideology is not relevant at all.

    Rather, self radicalization simply describe how the individual came to adhere to the ideology (with our without strong guidance or grooming from others).
     
    Last edited: Feb 22, 2019
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  5. johnbelt

    johnbelt Well-Known Member

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    Please Do you not know who makes up the alt-right.I'm ex army early 2000's there's cliques that mingle with their own race only.I imagine officers have a lot of alone time for the stuff he was planning.
     
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  6. johnbelt

    johnbelt Well-Known Member

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    I will vouch for this skrewdriver turns a lot of people racists.I almost fell into the that trap.I lived in a racists town with no black people but in my senior year I saw a skinhead break Geraldo's nose,shaved my head,the klan came to my town of 300 and someone gave me a dub of Voice of Britain and Boots and Braces.Then I joined the Army and realized family and friends were lying to me all them years about minorities.
     
  7. johnbelt

    johnbelt Well-Known Member

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    in that case why even mention he was self radicalized.If Hitler was self radicalized it must be bad.
     
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  8. human

    human Well-Known Member

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    This guy wanted to kill everyone and no one is commenting
     
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  9. johnbelt

    johnbelt Well-Known Member

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    Not everyone just liberals and fake news personalities.That is the way it plays to a chunk of America.I don't even think they are trying to hide it anymore from the elected one down to the lone wolf.Shameful how a criminal publicity stunt is a bigger deal than planned mass murder.
     
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  10. cybervampira

    cybervampira Well-Known Member

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    I said it on the other thread and I‘m saying it here. Why make this about left and right and attack everyone who is not on this thread? And the ones from the other thread ask themselves why you are not acknowledging a hate crime hoax. Doesn’t get us anywhere, does it?

    That’s what’s wrong with this country. There is no dialog, just finger pointing and confirmation bias. And I mean both ”sides“. What kind of discussion culture is that? And how does it help? Is it not possible to express an opinion without knee-jerk reactions?

    I consider myself liberal and I hate, hate, hate what Smollett did. This idiot did nothing but adding fuel to the fire. And of course there’s more media coverage because JS is a celebrity and he gave that GMA interview.

    Now to Hasson: WTF is wrong with him? Y‘all can blame it on the orange one but IMO it takes a special kind of personality to become a domestic terrorist.
     
  11. Elley Mae

    Elley Mae The enemy is here. beware

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    Thank You cybervampera!
     
  12. Elley Mae

    Elley Mae The enemy is here. beware

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    I asked myself, Where is the media on this?
     
  13. Cryptic

    Cryptic Well-Known Member

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    Because the other member speculated as to who had radicalized him.

    I then stated that I believe that he was self radicalized as the FBI uses the term. This means that he chose on his own to accept and adhere to the ideology with out being groomed or being directed by a influential person.
    Yes, . those who self radicalize tend on average to be worse than those radicalized by third parties.

    Those radicalized by third parties via grooming or by other influence have the potential to be less committed as they might not have chosen the ideology on their own and might not continue with it if the influence is removed.

    Those who self radicalize (FBI term) make and independent decision to accept and adhere to the ideology. They don't need grooming or other influence to direct and maintain their participation. Accordingly, they tend to be worse. Of course, exceptions exist.

    Furthermore, self radicalized terrorists like I believe Hasson to be, cannot use the mitigating defense strategy of: My client was groomed from a young age via constant propaganda into accepting "I" ideology He then only committed the crime at the the direct urging of "U", who had an influential position in his life.... .
     
    Last edited: Feb 23, 2019
  14. human

    human Well-Known Member

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    Please someone explain why this is not causing a meltdown for people? He was going to kill everyone.

    I am mystified as there is a case of a girl from Texas who falsely stated she was raped by three black men. It appears she may get no prison time. I have seen little about this.

    I don’t get it.
     
  15. cybervampira

    cybervampira Well-Known Member

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  16. Elley Mae

    Elley Mae The enemy is here. beware

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    Living between baltimore/washington area and the local radio commentators are asking why no news.

    They are keeping quiet on this, I have a feeling the feds are busy.
     
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  17. Elley Mae

    Elley Mae The enemy is here. beware

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  18. human

    human Well-Known Member

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    Big whoop! Look how many comments there are on this. He was going to kill everyone. That is a real crime.
     
  19. Cryptic

    Cryptic Well-Known Member

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    If I remember correctly, conspiracy or intent charges need two elements:

    - Stated intent to commit a crime (in this case terrorism).

    - Takes a step or steps towards fulfilling that intent.

    Though a written “hit list” would seem to meet the first element, a lot of deference is given to the first amendment. Defense attorneys often argue that “hit lists” or other written violent plans by extremists are first amendment protected because the hit list etc. was hypothetical, allegorical, or was written as a form of symbolic protest.

    Likewise, a lot of difference is also given to the second amendment in Virginia. As a result, writing a hit list while maintaining a fire arms collection may, or may not meet the threshold of “taking steps to fulfill an intent” as a defense attorney could argue that the weapons were acquired separate from the hit list and are thus constitutionally protected.

    In short, though the more serious charges could follow, they can be difficult to prove. Thus, the prosecutors might be anticipating defense arguments and decided to go with the lesser charges and then refer to the hit list at sentencing as an aggravating factor.
     
    Last edited: Feb 28, 2019
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  20. human

    human Well-Known Member

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