MD - Freddie Gray dies in police custody #3 *INDICTMENT*

Discussion in 'Crimes in the News' started by shadowraiths, Apr 20, 2015.

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  1. shadowraiths

    shadowraiths LISK Liaison, Verified Forensic Psychology Special Staff Member Moderator

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    [​IMG]

    Baltimore police were conducting a criminal investigation on Sunday into the death of a man injured in their custody. The mayor, meanwhile, vowed to ensure the city held “the right people accountable”.

    Freddie Gray, 25, died on Sunday at a hospital, a week after he was hurt following an arrest. A timeline released earlier in the week by police said Gray was taken by a van from the scene of his arrest to a station, where an ambulance was called to treat him. Civilian video showed him being loaded into the van, but did not show the entire encounter.

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    link
     


  2. tambo

    tambo Active Member

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  3. shadowraiths

    shadowraiths LISK Liaison, Verified Forensic Psychology Special Staff Member Moderator

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    [​IMG]

    Baltimore police: Freddie Gray arrested ‘without force or incident’ before fatal injury
    By Lindsey Bever, Washington Post, April 20 at 12:50 PM

    Now, a court summons gives the first glimpse into Gray’s arrest, a case that has ignited outrage over the past week. According to the document, obtained Monday morning by The Baltimore Sun, authorities say Gray “fled unprovoked upon noticing police presence,” and that officers later found the knife in his right pants pocket. The document reports that Gray “was arrested without force or incident” on April 12.

    [​IMG]

    Article: link

    Court docs: link
     
  4. SugarQueen

    SugarQueen Well-Known Member

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    I think Baltimore's definition of " switchblade" is clear as mud.
    59-22. Switch-blade knives.
    (a) Possession or sale, etc., prohibited.
    It shall be unlawful for any person to sell, carry, or possess any knife with an automatic spring or
    other device for opening and/or closing the blade, commonly known as a switch-blade knife
    ftp://law.resource.org/pub/us/code/md/baltimore.code.article.19.pdf
     
  5. vanlutz

    vanlutz New Member

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    I have a question about one of the charges against a few of the Baltimore officers. Illegal arrest. Which is "I think" the major charge against them. If it's shown it was a legal arrest and they weren't around for the van ride, then they're certainly not guilty of manslaughter. The illegal arrest would be tossed and so would the false imprisonment.

    Ms. Mosby said the knife was not a switchblade and a legal pocket knife. I realize that could very well be the truth, and the cop might have just wanted to nail Mr Gray because of the pursuit or whatever. But, if Mr Gray did not die he'd have gone to trial and the charges would have had to be dropped because the knife is legal. That's just strange.

    I haven't seen a picture of the knife. But, I did look up the statute he was arrested under, it reads "unlawfully carry, possess, and sell a knife commonly known as a switchblade knife, with an automatic spring or other device for opening and/or closing the blade within the limits of Baltimore City"

    My question: what is "Or other device?" that wording could be important in the defense case.

    I want justice for all. I can't imagine the anger if charges are dropped or the prosecution loses because they don't understand what a switchblade is.
     
  6. popsicle

    popsicle faith hope love

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  7. SStarr33

    SStarr33 Inactive

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  8. Harmony 2

    Harmony 2 Administrator

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    Continue discussion here...

    Please alert on any pertinent posts that need to be copied over from the other thread.
     
  9. al66pine

    al66pine Well-Known Member

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    Bringing over this from earlier thread.

    Question: who should have custody & control of knife now?
    Still in LE evd storage? Or state atty's ofc?
    Ea time a person removes knife from evd bag/container, protocol requires him
    to initial & date it, for both removal from and return to container, right?
    Wondering what would happen if knife were to 'go missing' now.

    Seems like -
    - a smart move by def. team to request knife early on.
    - numerous crim chg's would be dismissed if knife is legal.

    IDK if State has to either file response in court by a certain pre-hearing date or
    produce knife to def.Or if State can answer at the hearing.
     
  10. epiphany

    epiphany Well-Known Member

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    Baltimore Police Commissioner Welcomes Review 'With Open Arms'

    Baltimore Police Commissioner Anthony Batts said he welcomes "with open arms" the mayor's request for a review of law enforcement by the U.S. Department of Justice.

    <snip>

    The Baltimore City Fraternal Order of Police also has agreed with the mayor's request.

    "We, too, have issues with many of the current policies and procedures of the department," Kim Deachilla, communications director of the union, wrote in a statement on Wednesday.

    http://www.newsweek.com/baltimore-police-commissioner-welcomes-review-open-arms-329645
     
  11. Ausgirl

    Ausgirl ...

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    Freddie Gray death: Baltimore police 'to face civil rights investigation'

    Announcement could come as early as Friday and follows a request by mayor Stephanie Rawlings-Blake to investigate whether policing is discriminatory or uses excessive force.
    ---
    The civil rights investigation, similar to ones undertaken in cities including Ferguson, Missouri, and Cleveland, will examine the policing patterns and practices of the entire police department.

    It is far broader in scope than a separate Justice Department investigation that aims to determine whether Gray&#8217;s civil rights were violated.

    http://www.theguardian.com/us-news/...ore-police-to-face-civil-rights-investigation
     
  12. shadowraiths

    shadowraiths LISK Liaison, Verified Forensic Psychology Special Staff Member Moderator

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    I spoke with a criminal atty about this, and they said that the law is vague and left up to interpretation of the court. This, btw, is standard. Whether it's a bench trial or jury trial. It is up to the prosecution and defense to argue their case, and depending upon their presentation, the jury makes the final finding.

    They also said the state law generally trumps city laws when a case goes to trial. I was actually surprised by this claim, as it doesn't make sense to me to have city laws that differ from state laws, when they can be trumped by state law.
     
  13. who

    who New Member

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    Does anyone know if Freddie Gray was on probation?
     
  14. popsicle

    popsicle faith hope love

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  15. Ausgirl

    Ausgirl ...

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  16. ohreally

    ohreally Active Member

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    I always understood lower jurisdictions can make laws tougher than higher jurisdictions. They just cannot make them more lenient. If they do make a more lenient law it is the higher jurisdiction law that is upheld. An example of this would be the federal gun laws. Under federal gun laws no permit is required yet under state or local laws they make it stricter by requiring permits. You can be charged in the lower jurisdiction if you do not follow the lower jurisdictions laws and do not get a permit to carry.
     
  17. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    If knife goes missing, then state doesn't have a case on false imprisonment charges. After all, burden of proof is on the state.
    If they lose evidence, the case will be thrown out.
     
  18. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    If Freddie Gray went on trial for the knife then maybe state law could trump city law. But how can officers be charged with false imprisonment if the knife is illegal under city law and Freddie Grey was arrested in the city?
    That makes no sense whatsoever.
     
  19. Ausgirl

    Ausgirl ...

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    Just catching up on the posts from last thread - I appreciate that there are members here with family in LE or are LE themselves, who are feeling this all going to make life harder for police in general, affect their confidence in arresting people, and so on (I can't quote the posts, forgive me).

    I come from the other end of the stick -- a couple of deeply, deeply corrupt police officers inserted themselves into my family life when I was young and caused an unspeakable amount of damage.

    One of these officers, several years before, had beaten a man to death in custody - and it was pretty plain that he did so - was investigated for it and cleared of all wrong-doing. He went on to promotion after promotion.

    I don't want to talk about the damage he also went on to inflict, he and his good friend (who was thrown out of the force later over something else...and now works in a top end government job..). Suffice to say, I know what an impact men like this can have on helpless citizens -- people mind you who are NOT criminals, at all -- and how protected they can be, if the particular system they are in values the protection of its own department over the well being of the people they are employed to protect. Which *should* include protecting people from police who are acting in criminal ways, or misusing their position in the community to assert power over people that they simply should not have.

    I have seen, first-hand, how corrupt, self-serving men operate, using their badges as a shield from all responsibility. It is terrifying to know about their crimes and also know there's no point saying anything - who are you going to call? The police?

    Bringing this back to Freddy Gray... and I simply cannot believe I have seen comments like "I hope he hurt himself"... for goodness sake.... he was, unlike my little family, a criminal. So I get why he doesn't get the sympathy vote from many people. But to me, this is not just Freddy Gray.

    It's about men like Brian Rice, and the people who have for years clearly protected his career in the BPD, despite his terrorism of his ex wife and her hubby, and their kids. I know how that works... and I know that fear and helplessness... who you gonna call? Apparently if you call the police, they do nothing, and then lose the paperwork.

    Not all police, and not all departments operate like this, obviously. But Baltimore clearly, very clearly, by admission of Baltimore's own authorities, *is* such a department, historically.

    And, given that fact (and it is a fact) I think it's just incredible that officers involved would, for example, neglect to report a van stop... or manipulate witness statements to suggest to the media that Gray committed suicide... these are not the actions I would expect from police with nothing to hide.

    So while I feel truly, very bad for all the good cops out there, who must be sick of all the hatred police are getting right now, and while I believe many cops are not treated well on the job to begin with and deserve far better (and more pay....) I have a hard time seeing these six officers as "victims".

    I see them as what they are --- suspects, in a suspicious death. No different to any other suspects in any other suspicious death. Except that they have a whole lot of cops running their PR campaign, etc.
     
  20. katydid23

    katydid23 Well-Known Member

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    IF they were just treated as 'suspects' in a death that would be fine. But they have already been charged with the crime, and without sufficient cause, imo. So that is the problem that I have with it.

    I am sorry that you and your family had to deal with a couple of psychos that terrorized you. That is awful. But I do believe that is a very rare occurrence. Especially in modern times.

    As for Rice, we do not know all of the details. There must have been some extenuating circumstances or mitigating evidence which gave some balance.

    The SA did not charge Rice with murder. So I do not see how his troubles with his temper and ex wife have anything to do with this case.
     
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