Deceased/Not Found MD - Heather Grogg, 33, & Danielle Tyler, 18, Carroll County, 6 April 2020 *arrest*

Discussion in 'Missing Persons Discussion' started by stattlich1, Apr 24, 2020.

  1. CuriousQuiet1

    CuriousQuiet1 Well-Known Member

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    I don't know for sure what time JR was taken to the car but I'm guessing after midnight, so combined with the pandemic probably not many passers-by. Also as you can see in mompalm's post last week you can drive a car up very close to the back or side doors and not go out the front, toward the street.

    Deceased/Not Found - MD - Heather Grogg, 33, & Danielle Tyler, 18, Carroll County, 6 April 2020 *arrest*
     


  2. CuriousQuiet1

    CuriousQuiet1 Well-Known Member

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    RSBM

    I just remembered JR had 2 Facebook pages. One of them said he worked the night shift at Evapco. Maybe he stopped by to visit HG on his way to work that night? If he was working the night shift it might be common for them to not see each other until afternoon because Diana would be out of the house early getting the kids to school before she went to work. I'm thinking she didn't notice the work clothes were still at home until she noticed something was odd and started looking around carefully.

    I'm not sure how COVID would have altered all that. Were Carroll County schools closed before March 17? Was Evapco still operating then? Was JR still working at Evapco?
     
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  3. Venom

    Venom Well-Known Member

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    I searched and it looks like the schools closed March 13. She might have been home teleworking, depending on her type of work. Evapco looklike they do air conditioning, I couldn't find anything about them closing. I live about 40 minutes from the area (different state) and businesses were allowed to stay open if they were essential, maybe Maryland businesses were as well.
     
  4. Mayjunejuly

    Mayjunejuly Well-Known Member

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    I’m not sure which company he worked for when he died, but wherever he was working it was open (per linked article) as DR said she expected him to be at work ( he had work clothing, meaning he was typically working so it was likely an essential business. If that evapco company is an AC/HVAC company it was likely still working. My husband is a electrician and his company was considered essential throughout the pandemic. I’m sure AC /HVaC is also essential.

    also while re-reading this article-
    ‘Inseparable’: Widow of murder victim Jonathan Riddle remembers him as fun-loving, family-oriented


    I’m starting to feel DR knew what JR was going to do [JR going to use meth with HG ] because DR told LE when she reported him missing/when she was talking to detectives after LE found JR’s body, that he [JR] had gone to HG’s home to visit before he disappeared/was killed..... see quote below from linked article , where DR tells LE that JR went to see HG the night he died.

    “He was the sweetest person. He would give the shirt off his back for anyone," Diana Riddle said in an interview Monday. “I just can’t imagine that anyone would have any sort of issue with him that would warrant this.” To the best of her knowledge, Diana said, her husband did not know any of those accused of killing him. He did know Heather Grogg, she said. Police wrote in the criminal complaint that Jonathan Riddle had gone to see Grogg the night of March 17.”

    She starts off saying that JR is good guy and I’m sure he was. She then hints that she wants ppl to remember JR for the man he was not “the way he died”, maybe due to his drug use, she didn’t want people focusing on that aspect. As in DR Could have felt that if she came right out to admitting she knew he used maybe that would taint his reputation and image—- even if he was a great guy ! I mean I’m just saying I understand that once the media gets ahold of stories they can rip people apart and if they highlight his addiction it could be sort of victims shaming in a way? Idk I just thought that was interesting. Anyways at the end it says she knew he was at HGs and I’m going to guess DR knew why JR would be seeing HG (to use drugs) and as a another user mentioned, he likely didn’t have access to the family bank account /DRs account. I’m sure she kept her finances aside to ensure bills were paid, and her children were taken care of. She had to, as a mother her first priority will be her kids. But sadly I’m guessing she might have given him the 40$! So why not call her?! In one of my last posts I suggested JR did not call DR because he didn’t want her to know he was using or possibly due to JR being at HGs home. however, after re-reading this article I’m thinking DR knew where and what JR was doing but thought he went and everything was good or was holding out hope. But regardless of what DR thought during this time why didn’t JR call her and say I’m so sorry but I’m going to die without 40$ please send me it! Or get me it!

    Idk I’m just spit balling and now I’m even more confused about the motives and everything for this! It’s either over something as simple as $40 worth of meth stolen..... or something far more sinister idk
     
  5. Steph8angels

    Steph8angels Eye in the Sky

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    @Mayjunejuly
    I agree 1000%
    JMO
    With your post
    I always thought JR being murdered had another motive.
    If he would of got the 40.00 to pay them, I still think they would of killed him anyway.

    Has there been any updates on memorials for DT and HG yet?
    Any updates on their remains at all?
    So much murder for 40.00
    They spent that much in gas..... Back and forth and leading the girls to their deaths.

    Just seems we are missing a piece to this case for additional murders.
    Senseless and pain EVIL.......
     
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  6. pizzaman12

    pizzaman12 Well-Known Member

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    In my opinion, it's just a bunch of meth heads doing meth head things. Are their actions extreme in this specific case? Yes, of course they are.

    Not to sound crass but having multiple siblings wrapped up in similar worlds, I just don't think any of the above is all that uncommon sadly. I've tried to stay away from this case but I love the work @Knox is putting in even though I can't bring myself to participate too much
     
    Last edited: Jul 20, 2020
  7. abstr

    abstr Well-Known Member

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    I had to go pick something up near Westminster yesterday so I went into town and by Main Street Mews. I was at the light long enough to be able to count in and see where 11 would be. There is a grill on the stoop, so I think it is occupied. Of course I have no idea by whom. As I have stated before, I would not feel comfortable driving into the complex as it is quite small and a dead end parking lot.
    I think this is going to be protracted (due to Covid and how many agencies, states and counties are involved) and I think the public will never know the entire story.
    All JMO
     
  8. Pleeang

    Pleeang Well-Known Member

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    Update:: New article Spirit Jefferson Newspaper Just a few highlights from article.
    Falling Waters man charged for role in murder
    • By Tim Cook

    MARTINSBURG – Norman Arthur Bradford Jr. admitted he was there in the field by an old cemetery in Berkeley County when Heather Grogg was murdered, shot three times for knowing too much.

    The pistol used in her murder was allegedly taken from his mechanic’s shed.

    Holz said Bradford and Merrell came to know each other while the younger man attempted to join a motorcycle gang that used a Falling Waters clubhouse. “They hit it off,” Holz said of the two. “They kind of had a mentorship relationship.”


    Before that, he lived, as a “camper,” on the same Falling Waters property where the motorcycle gang clubhouse was located, Holz said. That clubhouse, a “gutted out trailer,” the detective said, was where Grogg and Danielle Tyler, 18, of Taneytown, Maryland, were lured and murdered on April 7.

    Grogg was shot three times, once in the back of the head at close range. Residents near the cemetery where she was shot reported to police that they heard gunshots that same night, Holz said.


    During seven preliminary court hearings in what became a triple murder case, Holz has not named — and so far has not been required to name during court hearings — the cooperating witnesses, saying those people could be endangered if they were identified.

    The status of two juveniles who were involved in the events surrounding Riddle’s death and its coverup has not been publicly disclosed.


    Bradford allegedly told Holz that Grogg’s body was probably burned in a fire pit behind the clubhouse trailer, a claim not yet confirmed by FBI crime lab tests. What are suspected to be human bone fragments were found in the fire pit.

    Police believe Tyler’s body may have been burned in the same fire pit. The bone fragments found are being analyzed at an FBI laboratory in Quantico, Virginia, Holz said.

    In previous testimony, Holz also mentioned a second fire pit at a residence across from where the clubhouse trailer is located.

    An investigation into all three murders continues. A pistol investigators believe was “possibly” used to kill Grogg was just recovered Sunday, July 12. The handgun was found stuffed in a sock and tossed into the Shenandoah River, at a location Holz did not disclose in court.

    Revealing a new detail in the case, Holz said what appeared to be two shallow graves were found behind the clubhouse trailer. Two bracelets that police believe belonged to Tyler were left on one.
     
  9. CuriousQuiet1

    CuriousQuiet1 Well-Known Member

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    Thanks Pleeang, I was starting to wonder if we would hear anything new about this case. The gun is interesting. An informant must have given them the location otherwise there would be no reason to link it to HGs murder. I wonder what use it will be in court? They can't match the gun to any ballistics that we know about. Can't say it was a murder weapon if there is no autopsy because there is no body to autopsy. I guess it is part of the circumstantial evidence, if LE can prove that was Bradford's gun it looks bad for him. Also I guess it corroborates the informant's story so a judge and jury would be more inclined to believe the informant.
     
  10. Pleeang

    Pleeang Well-Known Member

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    I wonder if it is possible to still have DNA on the gun? That would change things ?!
     
  11. MimosaMornings

    MimosaMornings Well- Known Member

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    Evapco does commercial work such as cooling towers. Service tech would be daytime work perhaps some overtime. If he worked in the plant on the manufacturing side, perhaps he worked second or third shift. JMO
     
  12. CuriousQuiet1

    CuriousQuiet1 Well-Known Member

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    JR's Facebook page that was posted here when this thread started said he worked night shift at Evapco. They have a manufacturing site in Westminster/Taneytown. The latest Spirit of Jefferson article that was just posted said he was a carpenter so maybe the Evapco information is old? Working night shift is the most logical reason I could think of why his wife didn't report him missing when he did not come home the night of Match 17. If he worked nights and she worked days she would not expect to see him until the afternoon. Just a guess and MOO.
     
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  13. Mayjunejuly

    Mayjunejuly Well-Known Member

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    I think a lot of “evidence “ is going to be circumstantial and evidence provided by informants... which could get tricky .... as dumb as the guys are as criminals they were smart in certain points for destroying any physical evidence.....
     
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  14. Steph8angels

    Steph8angels Eye in the Sky

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    @Mayjunejuly
    I agree
    JMO- I think the actual people charged with murder, awaiting trial were taking advise from much wiser and older criminals on how to get rid of evidence especially deceased victims, ie' witnesses.

    Justice is slow but will happen.....
    Thoughts to the victims family especially those who lost so much with no answers to this nightmare.
     
  15. CuriousQuiet1

    CuriousQuiet1 Well-Known Member

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  16. Venom

    Venom Well-Known Member

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    So do I. I just did a search last night to see if there was anything new, nothing came up.
     
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  17. CuriousQuiet1

    CuriousQuiet1 Well-Known Member

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    I drove by the Mews today and you are so right, the front and the side entrances are all in clear view of Main Street and Washington Rd. I thought the side was sheltered from the view from Main Street but you were onto it, the side lot is wide open. This was clearly a team effort, it would take at least 2 people to carry JR and someone else watching out/signalling for when it was clear to move him.
     
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  18. mompalm

    mompalm Well-Known Member

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    It looks to me like there are entrances in the back of the building. I don't know if those are separate units, or basements of the units that face the parking lot. If they did take JR out the back, they may not have been spotted?

    JMO
     
  19. allyoucantleavebehind

    allyoucantleavebehind Well-Known Member

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    Moo completely but this case give me chills and reminds me so much of people I knew who got involved in cycles of motorcycle gangs, meth, and neo-nazi networks. Do we have any shared tattoos among them? Any images?

    heartbreaking how network this has swallowed so many lives...
     
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  20. allyoucantleavebehind

    allyoucantleavebehind Well-Known Member

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    I agree with both of you that older people were involved as advisors. :( Googling the specific motorcycle gangs and white nationalist groups in that area.
     

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