Mexico Mexico - David Hartley, 30, Lake Falcon, 30 Sept 2010 #3

[NoeticSoul]

Yes I have read speculation about this on blogs etc. where they have noticed apparent coaching and language similarities with Sigi

As have I, and I've taken and studied my notes. I'm concerned about the Sheriff's agenda and/or involvement, if any. TH certainly seems suddenly well rehearsed on the Mexican drug cartels and US Mexican border issues. IMO, maybe she was even before this "happened".

In the course of my own research and note-taking regarding this 'investigation' (I use that term loosely) which seems to have somehow become a national "Story"... I've discovered and collected a few PREVIOUS (to this "incident") statements that Sheriff Sigi has made which I find concerning in the whole scheme of things. Especially the timeline.

April 2010 - Sheriff Sigi: "America has already been impacted; it's just that Americans don't know it yet. I think that we are going to have some very serious issues in about five to six months if the war in Mexico does not end by then."

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news...-cartels-warn-shut-up-or-heads-will-ro/print/

DH goes missing/murdered 5 months later. Also notice the caption of the photograph accompanying the above April article. Seems the Sheriff was across the border in Reynosa, Mexico (where the Heartly's lived) conducting an investigation.

May 27 2010 - The Sherrif says to ABC News: "It makes me nervous that these things are happening. It irritates me because we can try and do more if the federal government would provide more funding. I dread having to even think of having a fisherman resist, shot in the head, and we can't even go retrieve the body."

http://abcnews.go.com/International...terrorize-texas-lake/story?id=10737629&page=3

Things that make ya go hmmmm... Almost exactly what has seemingly transpired re. DH, no? The only difference being that they were not fishing.

Aug. 2010 Sheriff Sigi says: “The next war we’re going to have is not Iran,” Gonzalez said. “The next war is going to hit us from the southern border.”

http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/blog/Lists/Posts/Post.aspx?ID=179

Precisely the same statements TH keeps preaching during her media "tour".

These are just some of the things that have caught my attention recently. Food for thought, if nothing else.

As always. all but the article quotes are JMOO.

 

[Kimberlyd125]

Thanks Salem.

 

[monkeypants]

I am confused?

Mexican officials: No suspects in Hartley death, despite reports
http://www.themonitor.com/articles/mexican-43489-officials-reports.html
ZAPATA — Mexican officials said Sunday they still had no suspects and no body following the disappearance of a McAllen man widely presumed dead after his wife reported the couple came under attack by “pirates” 10 days earlier on the Mexican side of Falcon Reservoir.

Despite reports Saturday by U.S. and Mexican news outlets that a Tamaulipas official had identified two brothers as the men responsible for David Michael Hartley’s death, Mexican authorities categorically denied on Sunday that they had any suspects.


has something else been reported?? If so I apologize....

 

[kemo]

[Mexico LE's position seems to have changed in that suspects were identified and named. Because Mexico LE has named suspects, this takes the wife, Tiffany off the table. Posting rules about TH are changing from this point forward.


Salem, from everything I can find, the current state of the investigation in Mexico is that it has been SUSPENDED and there are NO SUSPECTS.

Previously, two brother named Ballestamos, who were said to be members of some sort of "Gang" that operated in that area, were named as prime suspects. While I have not seen any indications that they have been "cleared, their names are no longer mentions and they do not appear to be subjects of this investigation.

Please explain the "Rules" as it purtains to this situation.

Thank you.

 

[cmsg2002]

While I understand the rules of WS as it applies to victims, I don't believe with this particular case we can say that DH or TH are victims of anything at this point?? There has been no physical evidence to support that a crime has been committed? So how can TH be declared a victim?

 

[cmsg2002]

What would election day have to do with it?

That was more of me thinking out loud.....but I just don't like how TH has seemed to shift the focus ("moved on") to what I perceive to be a very political situation based on the Sherriff's and Gov. Perry's past and present statements? Maybe its just that her interview for a political campaign just adds to the other issues that don't quite sit right with me.

 

[WellDone]

You hunt with AK47's and AR15's? Really?

Your correct that they did not enter the Mexican side of the lake illegally, but to me, TH going on this border binge has absolutely nothing to do with DH's death. Nothing. If he was killed inside of MX territory, what border issue are we dealing with here?

Per Intermezzo's post above, this looks to me like she/they had done their homework on the Old Guerrero area....which I do not believe that they were in fact there.

On April 30, five people in two different boats were fishing on Falcon Lake and went to the Old Guerrero area, where they were taking photos of the old church. While they were there, a boat with four heavily tattooed men approached the two boats quickly. The men identified themselves as "Federales," but they were not wearing uniforms. The men boarded the boats, demanded cash and asked "where are the drugs?" The fishermen told the men that they had no drugs and were just fishing and taking photos. They ended up giving the men $200 cash and left the area. The pirates followed the two boats, but the U.S. boats were able to outrun them and the men stopped following once the two boats entered U.S. waters"

Also, they were reportedly 7 miles into MX boundaries...her on a jet ski with 70 mph capabilities vs a fishing boat with a max mph of what 30-40 mph....yet they were right behind her and on her tail when she was approaching US soil? Given the "chase" would have been over a few miles at least, how in the world did they manage to stay so close to her.????


-----------------

BBM
You reference "a fishing boat with a max mph of what 30-40 mph....yet they were right behind her and on her tail when she was approaching US soil? Given the "chase" would have been over a few miles at least, how in the world did they manage to stay so close to her.?"


Was the 30-40 miles given as fact in any statement or article that you could provide a link for please because I have a "fishing boat" & have gone 72mph in it.

 

[Salem]

[Mexico LE's position seems to have changed in that suspects were identified and named. Because Mexico LE has named suspects, this takes the wife, Tiffany off the table. Posting rules about TH are changing from this point forward.


Salem, from everything I can find, the current state of the investigation in Mexico is that it has been SUSPENDED and there are NO SUSPECTS.

Previously, two brother named Ballestamos, who were said to be members of some sort of "Gang" that operated in that area, were named as prime suspects. While I have not seen any indications that they have been "cleared, their names are no longer mentions and they do not appear to be subjects of this investigation.

Please explain the "Rules" as it purtains to this situation.

Thank you.

I understand it is a bit confusing. But Mexico identified 2 suspects - takes TH out of the game. Then the lead investigator is killed, supposedly for reasons other than this investigation? Then Mexico says there are NO suspects - BUT Mexico does not continue to say that they still disbelieve TH. So TH is removed from the loop.

If Mexico comes out and says that they do NOT believe a crime and/or shooting took place, after naming suspects, losing their investigator, and rescinding suspects, then we can take another look at this.

The bottom line is that we are a victim friendly forum. TH has suffered the apparent loss of her husband. She has also suffered the knowledge that an investigator that was working on finding her husband, has been killed in a most brutal manner. She is a victim and David's family members are victims. TH is not a suspect at this time. If that changes, then the rules will change again.

Until then, you may discuss inconsistencies in her media appearances, you may discuss that she may be is being used as a political pawn. You may not accuse her or bash her or David's family.

Hope that helps,

Salem

 

[IzzyBlanche]

Did anyone notice on the last video posted on the last thread of TH giving the interview of her view of the problems of US government and how to handle them....and notice the hugh palm? trees? When and where was this interview given? Surely not CO. ????? ETA: Never mind, I see it was done in TX....but when? Was interviewed by Steve Nohrden....running for congress. (NV)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zY50dLc90jc


This is the website of the person whose "support" put that video out there:

http://stevenohrden4congress.com/

She says so many things that are wrong on so many levels that I just don't know where to begin. It makes my head explode.

"We need to take our country back?" From who, pray tell?

 

[oceanblueeyes]

She says so many things that are wrong on so many levels that I just don't know where to begin. It makes my head explode.

"We need to take our country back?" From who, pray tell?

The Mexican cartels who are infiltrating this country.

IMOO

 

[EGirl]

I understand it is a bit confusing. But Mexico identified 2 suspects - takes TH out of the game. Then the lead investigator is killed, supposedly for reasons other than this investigation? Then Mexico says there are NO suspects - BUT Mexico does not continue to say that they still disbelieve TH. So TH is removed from the loop.

If Mexico comes out and says that they do NOT believe a crime and/or shooting took place, after naming suspects, losing their investigator, and rescinding suspects, then we can take another look at this.

The bottom line is that we are a victim friendly forum. TH has suffered the apparent loss of her husband. She has also suffered the knowledge that an investigator that was working on finding her husband, has been killed in a most brutal manner. She is a victim and David's family members are victims. TH is not a suspect at this time. If that changes, then the rules will change again.

Until then, you may discuss inconsistencies in her media appearances, you may discuss that she may be is being used as a political pawn. You may not accuse her or bash her or David's family.

Hope that helps,

Salem

Is there a link to this LEAD investigator? My understanding was that a member of LE that headed up a search was killed. He was not the lead investigator in this case. And, it has been reported that his killing had nothing to do with this case.

Guess I'll have to discuss this case elsewhere, because I don't believe the story that has been put out there.

 

[IzzyBlanche]

The Mexican cartels who are infiltrating this country.

IMOO

I don't think so. Here is the quote in context. It sounds like she wants to take it back from non-Christians.

"We need to go back to what our founding fathers planned for this country. They didn’t plan for it to be a separation. This country was founded on God. And we need to go back to that. All the however many millions of Americans believe in God. And very little don’t. And we need to start taking our country back. And start making it the way it was meant to be."

 

[IzzyBlanche]

And who is telling Tiffany that Mexico is not accepting US help in the drug war? Even the right-wing Washington Times reports otherwise:

The U.S. military is working with Mexico's military and police forces to provide training and equipment, and to help set up an intelligence center, he said.

Adm. Winnefeld said the U.S., rather than simply providing training, is working toward "shared experience, because we really are co-equal partners in this thing."

"Our relationship is on a very good trajectory, military to military," he said, noting meetings last month in Mexico with senior military and defense leaders.

In particular, the Mexicans have asked for Northcom's help in setting up a joint intelligence center, like those formed by the U.S. military in Europe and Asia.

"They'd like to know how we put together fusion cells like we have done overseas that are able to bring all forms of intelligence together and connect it with operations so that they can be much more effective and efficient in the way they take on the cartels," Adm. Winnefeld said.

Source: http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2010/jul/5/northcoms-new-leader-boosts-focus-on-mexico/

 

[monkeypants]

Originally Posted by Salem
I understand it is a bit confusing. But Mexico identified 2 suspects - takes TH out of the game. Then the lead investigator is killed, supposedly for reasons other than this investigation? Then Mexico says there are NO suspects - BUT Mexico does not continue to say that they still disbelieve TH. So TH is removed from the loop.


BBM- you have the order incorrect.....

On October 10th mexican authorities state there are no declared suspects in this case. It is after this declaration that the investigator is murdered. From everything I can find there has been no discussion on whether or not they suspect TH of anything but they did go to US soil to question her for 16 hours which from everything I can find shows that there is a high probability that they do NOT believe her "story" and were interrogating her....

I agree...off to find another place to discuss this case unfortunately because I DO believe it is an open investigation with no named suspects and no CLEARED people either.

 

[Kateyes]

Well, after reading this last page,and Salem's comments I am respectfully going to refrain from any further posting on this case. I do hope and pray for resolution and for any unanswered questions regarding this case to be answered, for the sake of David's family, and the sake of his memory. I don't want to violate TOS so I will be reading only on this particular forum, until LE comes forth with new information.

 

[Tricia]

Anything Salem posts on this forum or any forum is on direction from me.

Do not be angry at Salem. If you have an issue you can email me or PM me.

Salem works hard, doesn't get paid a dime, and is on Websleuths day and night to make sure it runs smoothly for the rest of us.

One thing you must remember about Websleuths; we do not allow accusations against innocent people unless they have been named a suspect or persons of interest.

David Hartley's wife is not a suspect in this case. Nor is there any evidence of wrongdoing on their part other than riding in Mexican waters.

Sincerely,
Tricia Griffith
Owner/Websleuths.com

 

[hollyblue]

I believe this woman and it certainly seems that LE does too. I have no clue what LE knows or what evidence they have uncovered but none of it seems to point at Mrs. Hartley.

I think this is just another example where the public tries a family member in the court of public opinion.

She has been upfront and done everything humanely possible to get her husband's body returned.

I doubt that will ever happen but she certainly has put herself on the line trying hard to see that it happens.

IMO, David would be very proud of his wife and how she continues to want his body returned.

IMO

1. None of the "evidence" (smile, grin, giggle ) points to what she has said either....it's all speculation.

2. From reading the comments posted on various media sites, not just here...there seems to be an overwhelming thought of suspicion on her part and for a very good reason. We can all read and hear was she did, then didn't see, or hear.

3. Except volunteering to clear any suspicions whatsoever. LDT's are more of an investigative technique. If any deception...then LE knows more about what they should be looking at or for. Her story taken at face value w/o continuing investigation is a travesty...if that is what has happened. They may believe her...but what about the facts? Everthing is speculation...no matter which way you interrupt the story.

Maybe it will bust open after the politicos do or do not get the vote they wanted...but at least it ran the gambit of awareness. If not, then I expect the coverage to disappear as quickly as DH and the jet ski.

JMO

 

[Velouria]

Since the site is not allowed here, I don't think we can really discuss it much.
But, she was DEAD WRONG about Somer's mom.

I agree, Kimberly. That site should have a giant "FOR ENTERTAINMENT PURPOSES ONLY" disclaimer. She still claims to have a record of 32 for 33 correct, but of course, left Ms. Thompson out of that figure. Think I'll take my chances and trust my own instincts.

Admittedly, Tiffany's latest political rants have left me scratching my head. Is she not aware that the vast majority of the Mexican population is Christian?

 

[IzzyBlanche]

One thing you must remember about Websleuths; we do not allow accusations against innocent people unless they have been named a suspect or persons of interest.



Sincerely,
Tricia Griffith
Owner/Websleuths.com

I have a question about this and I am posting it here rather than contacting you privately because I feel other posters to this thread would be interested in the answer as well.

As of today, authorities have not named Terri Horman a suspect or person of interest in Kyron's disappearance. Yet I see plenty of postings on that forum that seem to me accusations, even a poll entitled "What is your #1 indicator that Terri IS responsible for Kyron's disappearance?"

Maybe I'm just being dense here, but I don't understand the difference.

And thanks for the great site and everything you do on behalf of victims.

Respectfully,
Izzy Blanche

 

[LaLaw2000]

Thank you, Tricia and Salem.

David, Tiffany, and David's family are the victims here with David being the ultimate victim.