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GUILTY MT - Diren Dede, 17, shot to death, Missoula, 27 April 2014

Discussion in 'Recently Sentenced and Beyond' started by zwiebel, Apr 29, 2014.

  1. zwiebel

    zwiebel New Member

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    Missoula, Montana man Markus Kaarma has been charged with one count of felony deliberate homicide after he and his wife Janelle Pflager set up a 'trap' after being burglarized and German exchange student Diren Dede, from Hamburg, appears to have been caught in it. The shooting happened Sunday, April 27th.

    The 17 year-old was shot dead after Kaarma and his wife left their garage doors open with a purse inside, and set up sensors that were triggered if anyone entered the garage. Pflager says they had been burglarized twice in the previous three weeks.

    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/art...ge-student-wife-set-trap-burglars-garage.html
     
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  3. AnaTeresa

    AnaTeresa Active Member

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    This is becoming ridiculous.
     
  4. zwiebel

    zwiebel New Member

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    'Homeowner feels right, but did he really fear for life and limb?'
    Article translated via google from German. Comments not viewable.
    http://translate.google.co.uk/trans...=10&client=safari&sa=N&hl=en&biw=1024&bih=644

    Article in orginal German, complete with comments underneath.
    http://www.faz.net/aktuell/gesellsc...er-schuesse-in-die-ungewissheit-12916422.html

    A last photo released of Diren Dede, appearing to show him with a torch in his hand, inside the garage.
    http://www.kulr8.com/story/25392184/exclusive-photo-diren-dede-moments-before-shooting

    'Castle Doctrine' defence.
    http://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-27243115

    'Germany demands justice'
    http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2616976/German-consulate-seeks-justice-slain-student.html
     
  5. newone

    newone 2nd mouse gets the cheese

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    what the heck was the student doing prowling anyway?

    I am less than happy that the homeowner fired fatal shots. As a person who travelled overseas at a young age I am appalled that the ''visitor'' even thought it appropriate to trespass. No excuses. Either it was a shortcircuit in the exchange student's brain or his parents did an abysmal job of raising him.

    I tried to read the comments of the readers and the page would not allow that......''content not available try later'' however I did note one from Rotterdam -- hard to feel sympathy for a delinquent.....((echoes my sentiments))
     
  6. LietKynes

    LietKynes Well-Known Member

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    Burglaries can go the other way very quickly ; imo, with the homeowner ending up hurt or dead.
    In some states, it's considered B&E even if the perp walks into a closed porch, through the outer door.
     
  7. ohiogirl

    ohiogirl New Member

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    Why didn't they just call the police? Waste.
     
  8. LietKynes

    LietKynes Well-Known Member

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    You have a point there.
    There may be more to the story that only Kaarma would know.

    LE should get a look at the footage of Dede in the garage via the monitor.
    I'm still having a problem of what was Dede doing exactly in the garage with a flashlight ? Hardly the actions of an innocent person; imo.

    However, if you chose to fire your gun at a burglar, and he/she dies... you still have a "whole lotta explaining " to do; imo. Laws vary from state to state , and one would think you could defend yourself from a burglar --- but the court may not side with you (the homeowner).

    :moo:
     
  9. Snick1946

    Snick1946 Well-Known Member

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    There are way too many folks out there who seem under the delusion that they can kill with impunity anyone who happens to venture onto their property. Some of them have even made posts to that effect on this board. If he had detained this kid for the police the kid would still be alive and the homeowner would be living his life. No, he just had to kill someone..
     
  10. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    I understand there is a right to self-defense, but this appears to have been entrapment. Deliberately set scene with the purse in hopes to lure someone in.
     
  11. Blondie in Spokane

    Blondie in Spokane Well-Known Member

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  12. cluciano63

    cluciano63 Well-Known Member

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    What's wrong with shooting in the foot or something, if you are bound and determined to use your gun, just because you can...
     
  13. Blondie in Spokane

    Blondie in Spokane Well-Known Member

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  14. al66pine

    al66pine New Member

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    Boy, I'm confused by article (even recognizing dailymail as source).
    Per link, Kaarma, the MT homeowner who allegedly shot the German teen, has ---
    - wife,
    - common law wife and
    - live-in girlfriend.
    I wonder if the reporter is referring to the same woman. IDK.

    RIP Diren Dede and healing and justice for all involved.
     
  15. al66pine

    al66pine New Member

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    Per wiki (FWIW)
    In criminal law, entrapment is a practice whereby a law enforcement agent induces a person to commit a criminal offense that the person would have otherwise been unlikely to commit.[1] It is a type of conduct that is generally frowned upon, and thus in many jurisdictions is a possible defense against criminal liability.

    IIUC, homeowner luring the teen into the garage does not seem to fall into this 'entrapment' concept, as homeowner is not law enf.
    And entrapment is potential defense to a criminal charge.
    The deceased teen is not being criminally charged;
    the homeowner is/may be facing criminal charges.

    Doesn't seem a good idea, imo, for homeowner to have lured teen into garage.
    Once having done so, bad for homeowner to have shot teen, as it appears, imo,
    neither he nor wife/GF had reason to fear for their personal safety, much less actually fearing for their lives.
    Appears, imo, they were protecting property, not their lives.

    JM2cts and I may be wrong.
     
  16. AnaTeresa

    AnaTeresa Active Member

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    Not to speak for jjenny, but the way I took her post was not with regard to the legal definition of entrapment. To me, it was more a description of the set up - clearly, the homeowner was fishing for something like this to happen.
     
  17. newone

    newone 2nd mouse gets the cheese

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    You do have a point but you have to admit the use of bait cars has been very successful in catching car thieves.

    Given that a B & E may be low on the priorities of local LE, the homeowners did set a trap perhaps because they recognized they were ''on their own'' to try and catch the perp for their own piece of mind. I am not condoning what they did but I can understand what may have driven them to take such measures.
     
  18. Sonya610

    Sonya610 Former Member

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    Why don't you ask the experts such as law enforcement why they don't "shoot people in the leg"? They always aim at the torso/head and fire multiple times if they feel the need to fire their weapon. There is a reason they do that and they are MUCH better shots than the average citizen.

    On a side note the homeowner was also using a shotgun which is not known for precision accuracy, the shot spreads out. I would never use my shotgun for home protection because I would be far too concerned about it hitting one of my dogs, for accuracy handguns with lasers and tactical lights are imo best for homeowners that don't spend a lot of time at the range.
     
  19. jjenny

    jjenny Well-Known Member

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    Trying to catch the perp is one thing. I don't think that is what the owner's intention was. From what is reported, this guy allegedly told a witness he was waiting for three night to shoot some f***ing kid.
     
  20. newone

    newone 2nd mouse gets the cheese

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    I hear you and they did a lot more damage than what they were bargaining for - no winners in this round. Sad to say.
     
  21. Blondie in Spokane

    Blondie in Spokane Well-Known Member

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