Mystery couple murdered in South Carolina, 1976 - #4

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:+:MrTT:+:

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...the initials on the ring.......belong to a company, or perhaps the person/company whom made the ring.....only name i thought of was John Paul.....more french sounding and spelling for the first name.........the description of there skin had me thinking of the country of Peru.......all just MOO


...Im not sure how to post pics here.....but here are a couple of links if they work to a site showing similiar rings with intials inside them......and they each seem to have 3 intials on the inside of them....but cannot see it clearly...........

http://www.amazon.com/14Kt-Yellow-B...0006JMSGO/ref=pd_sbs_jw_1/180-4649766-7859445

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0009SOGN0...IS6ZLB&tag=shopzilla_rev_1322-20&linkCode=asn


addon......and sapphire is the birthstone of September......so perhaps he was borned in September?
 

Mysterylover

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Population in the Unites States in l976 was: 214,659,000

Murders in the United States in 1976 was: 18,780
 

WildHeart

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There were 331 murders in South Carolina in 1976. 352 in 2007. Sorry but I don't have the specific numbers for how many were in Sumter County. Wait, found this link: http://www.disastercenter.com/southcar/crime/12107.htm While it does not provide crime data for 1976, it does from 1980 forward. In 1980, Sumter County had 8 murders, in 2005, the last year for which they list data.

And re taser costs: the average law enforcement taser runs anywhere from $600-$800. I'm sure they aren't "gold-plated" but they do have to heavy duty to stand up to the abuse they get in the field. And then there's the cost of additional probes. And things like holsters, training, and oh yes, shipping, handling, taxes, etc. These agencies can't just pull a figure out of thin air and get their city/county council or the state to pay for it. There are things called procurement procedures they have to abide by and on large purchases, multiple bids are required, and if it's a sole source provider, then contracts are usually negotiated at a flat rate which gives price breaks to an agency or an affiliate agency.
 

elliottness

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I contacted someone at the Canadian Medical Hall of Fame about Dr. Fortier and this is the response I received:

"Unfortunately I do not know anything about Dr. Fortier’s family. While he was inducted into our Hall of Fame in 1998, it was before I, or any of my current colleagues, started working here. I therefore do not even know who represented him at the dinner to accept the award on his behalf. I am very sorry I can’t be of more help and wish you the best of luck in unraveling the mystery."
 

justthinkin

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...Im not sure how to post pics here.....but here are a couple of links if they work to a site showing similiar rings with intials inside them......and they each seem to have 3 intials on the inside of them....but cannot see it clearly...........

http://www.amazon.com/14Kt-Yellow-B...0006JMSGO/ref=pd_sbs_jw_1/180-4649766-7859445

http://www.amazon.com/dp/B0009SOGN0...IS6ZLB&tag=shopzilla_rev_1322-20&linkCode=asn


addon......and sapphire is the birthstone of September......so perhaps he was borned in September?

Man, you've got some good eyes! I don't see anything. By the px, those are 14kt gold rings so maybe that's the "initials" you're seeing.
 

justthinkin

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If I was in the middle of having the kind of dental work that Jock Doe was having done, I wouldn't be driving halfway across the country if he came from the far northwest or Canada. Do we know if he had any temporary fillings or temporary crowns or if half the work was done, and the other half left as is?

I'll see if my dentist can offer any info from the teeth x-rays. I'm sure he'd be happy to help us with this.
 

Mysterylover

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There were 331 murders in South Carolina in 1976. 352 in 2007. Sorry but I don't have the specific numbers for how many were in Sumter County. Wait, found this link: http://www.disastercenter.com/southcar/crime/12107.htm While it does not provide crime data for 1976, it does from 1980 forward. In 1980, Sumter County had 8 murders, in 2005, the last year for which they list data.

And re taser costs: the average law enforcement taser runs anywhere from $600-$800. I'm sure they aren't "gold-plated" but they do have to heavy duty to stand up to the abuse they get in the field. And then there's the cost of additional probes.
And things like holsters, training, and oh yes, shipping, handling, taxes, etc. These agencies can't just pull a figure out of thin air and get their city/county council or the state to pay for it. There are things called procurement procedures they have to abide by and on large purchases, multiple bids are required, and if it's a sole source provider, then contracts are usually negotiated at a flat rate which gives price breaks to an agency or an affiliate agency.

Wildheart, Thanks for the clarification...
I was assuming, and you know what they say about ASSUMING, that LE already had the holsters and training from having their older stun guns.
I was assuming their older stun guns were only being replaced, stun guns have been around quite awhile in my town. I appreciate you taking the time to explain it...:)
 

Mysterylover

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JaneInOz...good find! I'm inclined to believe this is our 'Jock", both have teeth missing and Jock had a appendectomy scar??...while Joseph Arcand had a Hernia scar...easily mistaken for a appendix scar.....what are the odds?
––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––––
Notice, "our S.C.Jock" does have some missing teeth, and a 'bridge where some missing teeth were.
and a 4” (10 cm) appendectomy scar and two 2” (5 cm) scars on his right shoulder.
'Jock' had very elaborate and expensive dental work with bridges and crowns.
Jock had an acrylic or porcelain crown on the left front tooth and fillings in most upper teeth.
He also had some missing teeth in top and bottom but noticeable in top back left. He was missing his lower wisdom teeth.

Notice: Most appendectomy scars in past years was 2 1/2 inches long... NOT 4 inches? This leads me to suspect Jock's 4" scar was NOT an appendix scar.
Approximately two-thirds of all people who experience
appendicitis are women, and about two-thirds of
all people who get appendicitis are between the ages of
15 and 44. However, this condition can affect any
person, at any age.
 

Mysterylover

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Guys, I have brought this over from several newspaper articles Mayfairlight was nice enough to find for us.
This is describing our Jock's mouth and teeth which I feel is major in identifying him..

Sumter dentist that checked Jocks mouth and teeth say He was in the process of having a "complete mouth restoration", with several Thousand Dollars $$
worth of root canals, tooth caps and bridge work.
The Dentist say the job was about half finished..

With Jock's mouth/teeth restoration only half complete, would Jock not been returning to have the job completed?
A Dentist, that did this excellent work, should remember this young man with his neat shoulder length hair...and question WHY Jock didn't return.

Our Mystery couple was buried on a Sunday in a Methodist Cemetery in Oswego, a small town north of Sumter..
__________________
 

elliottness

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Guys, I have brought this over from several newspaper articles Mayfairlight was nice enough to find for us.
This is describing our Jock's mouth and teeth which I feel is major in identifying him..

Sumter dentist that checked Jocks mouth and teeth say He was in the process of having a "complete mouth restoration", with several Thousand Dollars $$
worth of root canals, tooth caps and bridge work.
The Dentist say the job was about half finished..

With Jock's mouth/teeth restoration only half complete, would Jock not been returning to have the job completed?
A Dentist, that did this excellent work, should remember this young man with his neat shoulder length hair...and question WHY Jock didn't return.

Our Mystery couple was buried on a Sunday in a Methodist Cemetery in Oswego, a small town north of Sumter..
__________________
This tells me that Jock was pretty well-off. Dental work is expensive now and even in 1976 it was pretty costly for the time. This was not a poor man who was getting that kind of extensive dental work. Great research!
 

MaryLiz

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Links to 2 articles from The Item that I had in my files and also that are posted on the other threads here on WS on the Mystery Couple. The first one from 2007 suggests that I-95 was a major drug route in 1976, which has been discussed on here that they could have been running drugs. The second one from 2005 has an interesting bit about a foreign attorney who offered to help with the case and then abruptly cut off all contact, which I've always wondered what happened with him. Most of the info in the articles has been mentioned before but still make for interesting reading.


http://www.theitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070809/ITNEWS01/108090148

http://www.theitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050809/NEWS01/108090046
 

Mysterylover

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Links to 2 articles from The Item that I had in my files and also that are posted on the other threads here on WS on the Mystery Couple. The first one from 2007 suggests that I-95 was a major drug route in 1976, which has been discussed on here that they could have been running drugs.

The second one from 2005 has an interesting bit about a foreign attorney who offered to help with the case and then abruptly cut off all contact, which I've always wondered what happened with him.
Most of the info in the articles has been mentioned before but still make for interesting reading.




http://www.theitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20070809/ITNEWS01/108090148

http://www.theitem.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20050809/NEWS01/108090046

Cambria, I only heard about this mysterious case in late 2008...
I'm very interested in knowing WHY this beautiful young couple was murdered and never identified in 30 years..

What you had to say about the foreign attorney, I had never heard or read and find it very interesting...as I read it, another 'red flag' popped-up!

There's a lot more to this story than a poor, broke, shaggy couple hitch-hiking or running drugs up I-95..

I think the 'clue' is Jock was 'somebody' in a 'witness protection program' OR 'someone very importants son'...possibly a prince, count or mafia...and we can only guess what else....
the girl had just had a Manicure and Pedicure, and was wearing clean, wedge heel sandals. Their hair was, clean and groomed...I feel they were definitely in a

residence/ at a party/at the KOA or in a vehicle when murdered that Sunday night ...imo
Why didn't someone remember giving this beautiful young girl that recent manicure and pedicure? That had to cost money in 1976..

Why would the attorney offer to help and then stop abruptly if Someone here in the U.S./S.C. had not talked to the foreign attorney and told him "something" to cause him to 'back off' & abruptly cut off all contact about the murdered couple....who knows this mystery couples parents could have been told 'something' too, years ago..:rose:

I can't believe someone with a lot of 'clout' in S.C. doesn't know the story behind these murders, after all Lonnie Henry was allowed to walk free after being arrested for drunk driving and carrying a concealed weapon with the serial numbers filed off, that was proven by the FBI to be a murder weapon...a FELONY!

I'll repeat myself, someone with 'clout' had to be responsible for 'pulling the strings' on this case..from the very beginning..Wouldn't it be nice to find out 'who' talked to the foreign attorney?
Quote:
"The second one from 2005 has an interesting bit about a foreign attorney who offered to help with the case and then abruptly cut off all contact"...
our same questions remain, WHY?
 

MaryLiz

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ML, I had totally forgotten about that attorney until I read the article again today. I remembered when I first read it, it jumped right out at me. I wish it was possible to find out where the attorney was from. I wondered at the time if the attorney received a threat from either the country he was from or from where ever the 2 Does were from, but it's plausible he could have a received a threat from someone in the US. If a foreign attorney offered to help, that suggests to me that they were from somewhere other than the USA. I've gone over it a million times and thought they could have been from South America, France, Spain or even the USA. But I always go back to Canada, not just because of the story Jock supposedly told David Batson, but the fact that it was never mentioned that he had a foreign accent. I agree, there are more questions in this case than answers. :waitasec: But I thought that foreign attorney thing was strange also.
 

Mysterylover

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Lets look outside the box to other things off I-95 other than the drug traffic, after 30 yrs. that theory seemed to hit a dead end.

Putting what few facts I have read together, leads me to believe this couple was very wealthy or from a wealthy family.

I suspect someone learned a lot about his couple while they stayed Twice at the KOA for at least 2 weeks.
I suspect it was the KOA guy, David, while playing pool..and he later told 'someone' about this couple.

I'm thinking HOW did the couple get to S.C. and get around in S.C and FLa??..

We've been missing something in this case, and I
feel it's because no one has looked at it in a broad enough way, thus the following, makes sense to me.

I-95 exit 36 A south on ROUTE 341

NOTICE where the couple was murdered, in Sumter County, South Carolina dirt road between Interstate I-95 and SC 341.

Take Notice I-95 exit 36A on 341 Goes TO,

The Port of Brunswick, one of the nation's most productive ports on the Atlantic coast.
Tourism constitutes the largest industry in Brunswick County.
The headquarters facility of the Federal Law Enforcement Training center.

Brunswick & The Golden Isles of Georgia ..
St. Simons Island – Sea Island – Little St. Simons Island – Jekyll Island - Sapelo Island

Have some of the richest people in the world, listed on the Fortune 500, owning homes and Yacht's there..
What IF our Jock or Jane Doe was from one of these very rich families and had a big Yacht anchored at one of the marina's or in one of the Inlets?

My second thought is: The couple could have "SAILED' into the U.S. on their yacht or large sailing boat, and had it anchored at a Marina on the coast or in an Inlet.

I've known several wealthy people, from France & other countries, that did this exact thing..around that time.

BIG, big money reason for hiding their identity and a cover-up!

think about this:
A Young couple on their $500,000. or 1 Mil.$$+ Sail boat/ racing yacht/or yacht, disappear, while sailing their yacht, at a unknown location, time and country.
The couples families suspect the yacht possibly sank in the Bermuda Triangle, as there is no trace or them...end of search!...

after a while some of these S.C. 'players' come up with a Million dollar yacht for Sale...

Oh yes, by the way if asked, 'they' inherited this yacht, hot car or wind-fall cash from a rich uncle that died....an excuse that was never checked into!

a cover-up worth the effort and money.$$$$..imo
 

runr

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The thing that sticks out to me about this is that 14K gold is an American material. In Europe, even today, anything less than 18K is not considered to be "real gold." I do not know anything about South America, though.
 

Mysterylover

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The thing that sticks out to me about this is that 14K gold is an American material.
In Europe, even today, anything less than 18K is not considered to be "real gold." I do not know anything about South America, though.

runr: Good point! What about Canada? Jock was wearing very nice jewelry for a young person in 1976.
Would someone camping in a tent, be wearing nice jewelry like this?

Jock wore a Bulova Accutron yellow gold watch, serial number H918803 on his left wrist and a 14 karat gold ring with a gray linde star stone and the initials JPF engraved inside...:Crown:
 

runr

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Go easy on me here, i am not a super-sleuther and I did not notice if this had already been checked...

Has anyone searched any of the genealogy sites online lately for people named Fortier from Canada? There might be a cousin or something who didn't know the family drama of the 1970's who is "looking" for JPF to fill their family tree, and have info but not even realize it.

I know that my mom is suddenly very interested in these types of topics, and is "looking" for 2nd cousins of hers that she never really knew and didn't know anything about their family drama, just that the cousins kindof faded off the radar sometime in the 60's. (Turns out, no drama in our family, just poor communication, but you know what I mean?)
 

MadeaBecBec

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Mmmmmm... What if JPF stands for the Jewis Peace Fellowship? The KKK could've offed this couple for that reason alone, and wouldn't lose any sleep over it........
Just sayin'.......

Did you all realize that the Star Linde Sapphire is a synthetic stone, still a bit more expensive for most back in the day, however the stone itself has a meaning of joyful devotion to God, so it could be a symbol of religion that Jock Doe was wearing.....
And JPF is the signature of a Navajo Indian artist that makes jewelry(among other art) wasn't the female wearing "Indian" style jewelry? Maybe they bought it (the ring) from a reservation when she bought her jewelry, IDK!
Just my brain thinking of different scenarios.

Did anyone ever know or say for sure what this couple stayed in at the KOA?
 

justthinkin

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Go easy on me here, i am not a super-sleuther and I did not notice if this had already been checked...

Has anyone searched any of the genealogy sites online lately for people named Fortier from Canada? There might be a cousin or something who didn't know the family drama of the 1970's who is "looking" for JPF to fill their family tree, and have info but not even realize it.

I know that my mom is suddenly very interested in these types of topics, and is "looking" for 2nd cousins of hers that she never really knew and didn't know anything about their family drama, just that the cousins kindof faded off the radar sometime in the 60's. (Turns out, no drama in our family, just poor communication, but you know what I mean?)

Yes, I searched. That turned up nothing.
 
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