NC - 12-year-old dies at Trails Carolina wilderness therapy camp, Lake Toxaway, February 2024

 
Wish there was a transcript of this discussion
Indeed !
Might be an eye opener.

This 'corrections center' (Not a wilderness camp -- as that implies a place of healing !) has seemingly drawn their own 'burrito' around themselves to cover up exactly what transpired.
If any of them are continued to operate -- they need to be 200 % more transparent.
It's not as if they don't have the funds to set up cameras all over, and allow the parents access to the security cameras online, to check in with their kids and see if it's helping the children at all ?
They needed to do this as I'm guessing it hasn't been an option yet ?
Like in some daycares where there's cameras and the parents can monitor the little ones, remotely ?
Omo.
 
Wouldn't it be more appropriate to allow the kids to sleep each on their own bunk w/sleeping bag and a foam mattress underneath, and then lock the doors at night to prevent them from running off into the wilderness and coming to harm ?
But allow them to sleep comfortably.
They're in a new situation for them and to the troubled kids this is already somewhat traumatic.

They could still have one or more staff who would stay awake at a desk, in case a child had a medical emergency.
Or -- what about a therapy camp, but outpatient only -- as in, at the end of the day they go home so the families can see them ?
Omo.
RBBM: Absolutely not.

No one should EVER be locked into a bivvy, a building, nothing. That is just asking or a tragedy to occur and, in this case, should be criminal. Just think of the horror stories of factories in third world countries, or girl's schools, where the workers or girls were locked into the buildings only to have a fire break out.

Imagine locking the emergency doors at a movie theatre and this happened.

This is why care homes and camps should have staff up, on shift and alert. Even in the Army we always keep at least one person up 24/7 when living in the field on Exercise ... to be the alarm bell in case of fire or other emergency. That we wouldn't do as much for childrenand would rather alarm their zipper or lock them into a cabin should be criminal.
 
RBBM: Absolutely not.

No one should EVER be locked into a bivvy, a building, nothing. That is just asking or a tragedy to occur and, in this case, should be criminal. Just think of the horror stories of factories in third world countries, or girl's schools, where the workers or girls were locked into the buildings only to have a fire break out.

Imagine locking the emergency doors at a movie theatre and this happened.

This is why care homes and camps should have staff up, on shift and alert. Even in the Army we always keep at least one person up 24/7 when living in the field on Exercise ... to be the alarm bell in case of fire or other emergency. That we wouldn't do as much for childrenand would rather alarm their zipper or lock them into a cabin should be criminal.
Ohhh... I didn't even think of that.
Holy cow.

I was mainly implying the kids could move freely inside the bldg., aka use the restroom, or get a snack if hungry at night ?
Yes I see your point, thanks !!
 
My heart is broken for the family of this 12 year old kid. Difficulties or behavioral issues aside, the family loved their son and now faces a life of loss, sadness and possibly guilt.

Since this incident happened in my local community, I have been following all the news stories from the Asheville area media outlets and in my opinion, something is foul and possibly malicious.

The boy was in a "bunk house" where there were approximately 4 other kids staying along with 2 Camp Counselors. He was made to sleep on the floor in a sleeping "bivy" which sounds like it was "secured" from the outside with an alarm device incase the child attempts to leave. Counselors claim the child can leave the bivy if they need to, but in statements to 1st responders, the counselors kept saying they had to open or close the bivy.

Counselors claim they checked on the boy, who had been very agitated since his arrival, at 12 midnight, 3 am and 6 am but at 7:45 am he was unresponsive and cold to the touch, NAKED FROM THE WAIST DOWN, with his pants and underwear piled near his head.

At the time of the incident, the camp would not allow the other kids who were present to be questioned. I assume this is because they are minors and parental consent was required prior to questioning. I cannot find any indication that fellow "campers" have been questioned yet.

Something is just so fishy here.

Was the child naked because they use humiliation and embarrassment as a tactic to break ones "spirit" or was there some form of sexual assault happening? One of the first responders initially suspected that there had been some form of poison ingested. What made him/her think poison?

I did find a story about sexual assault allegations back in 2016 at Trails Carolina.

I think this story is one to follow.
 
My heart is broken for the family of this 12 year old kid. Difficulties or behavioral issues aside, the family loved their son and now faces a life of loss, sadness and possibly guilt.

Since this incident happened in my local community, I have been following all the news stories from the Asheville area media outlets and in my opinion, something is foul and possibly malicious.

The boy was in a "bunk house" where there were approximately 4 other kids staying along with 2 Camp Counselors. He was made to sleep on the floor in a sleeping "bivy" which sounds like it was "secured" from the outside with an alarm device incase the child attempts to leave. Counselors claim the child can leave the bivy if they need to, but in statements to 1st responders, the counselors kept saying they had to open or close the bivy.

Counselors claim they checked on the boy, who had been very agitated since his arrival, at 12 midnight, 3 am and 6 am but at 7:45 am he was unresponsive and cold to the touch, NAKED FROM THE WAIST DOWN, with his pants and underwear piled near his head.

At the time of the incident, the camp would not allow the other kids who were present to be questioned. I assume this is because they are minors and parental consent was required prior to questioning. I cannot find any indication that fellow "campers" have been questioned yet.

Something is just so fishy here.

Was the child naked because they use humiliation and embarrassment as a tactic to break ones "spirit" or was there some form of sexual assault happening? One of the first responders initially suspected that there had been some form of poison ingested. What made him/her think poison?

I did find a story about sexual assault allegations back in 2016 at Trails Carolina.

I think this story is one to follow.
Have also been very concerned about assault occuring...

I'm so sorry that this is all happening so close to home for you, this must be so upsetting :(
Thank you for caring enough to post and for sharing local insights

Welcome to this community, grateful to have you here, despite the circumstances
 
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IMO: Bloom's disdainful dismissal of and arrogant lack of knowledge about how inhuman the kids are treated and punished at Trails and Wilderness Camps in general as he pleads for Trails Carolina to reopen.



Why does he need to defend the camp? Who knows, perhaps as an explanation to curious friends and family who question his decision to send his daughter to a place where inhumane treatment is par for the course. MOO

I found the comment by an ex inmate camper to be far more interesting.
 
IMO: Bloom's disdainful dismissal of and arrogant lack of knowledge about how inhuman the kids are treated and punished at Trails and Wilderness Camps in general as he pleads for Trails Carolina to reopen.



"My daughter spent 82 days at Trails. She was loved, challenged and supported. She was isolated away from social media, school shooter drills, easy access to drugs, and other stressors that prey on children with acute anxiety and other emotional challenges. Today, she is a high school student with excellent grades and much healthier habits. She wants to return to Trails as a therapist."

I would love to hear from his daughter instead of him.

There are other options to get what he listed including moving to a smaller community, homeschooling and actively being in your child's life. Will it be easy? Not at all! Don't want them on socials? Don't get them a phone or laptop without being monitored, give them bark phones, and control wifi. Could this be where you might feel like your child's jailer and a whole job in itself? Yes, however at least I know I am not stuffing my kid in a bivy bag and leaving them tied up in there while having a full-blown anxiety attack. I am also not adding the possible stressor of not being able to eat, sleep, and potentially being sexually assaulted. Some parents might not have the option to have someone home with a child who is homeschooled, but these parents were paying so much already for this camp, so they were spending money regardless.
 
"My daughter spent 82 days at Trails. She was loved, challenged and supported. She was isolated away from social media, school shooter drills, easy access to drugs, and other stressors that prey on children with acute anxiety and other emotional challenges. Today, she is a high school student with excellent grades and much healthier habits. She wants to return to Trails as a therapist."

I would love to hear from his daughter instead of him.

There are other options to get what he listed including moving to a smaller community, homeschooling and actively being in your child's life. Will it be easy? Not at all! Don't want them on socials? Don't get them a phone or laptop without being monitored, give them bark phones, and control wifi. Could this be where you might feel like your child's jailer and a whole job in itself? Yes, however at least I know I am not stuffing my kid in a bivy bag and leaving them tied up in there while having a full-blown anxiety attack. I am also not adding the possible stressor of not being able to eat, sleep, and potentially being sexually assaulted. Some parents might not have the option to have someone home with a child who is homeschooled, but these parents were paying so much already for this camp, so they were spending money regardless.
Emphasis mine.
Excellent comment.
Esp. agreed with the bolded.

IF possible, keep your kids with you, and try to help them at home !
Omo.
 
IMO: Bloom's disdainful dismissal of and arrogant lack of knowledge about how inhuman the kids are treated and punished at Trails and Wilderness Camps in general as he pleads for Trails Carolina to reopen.




Hmm. The comment under the article by an actual attendee holds much more weight with me, and yes, Mr Bloom, I have experienced, and still do, many of the things you mentioned. Would I send my child to Trails or anyplace like it? Over my dead body!.

* @MsMarple beat me to it!.
 
My heart is broken for the family of this 12 year old kid. Difficulties or behavioral issues aside, the family loved their son and now faces a life of loss, sadness and possibly guilt.

Since this incident happened in my local community, I have been following all the news stories from the Asheville area media outlets and in my opinion, something is foul and possibly malicious.

The boy was in a "bunk house" where there were approximately 4 other kids staying along with 2 Camp Counselors. He was made to sleep on the floor in a sleeping "bivy" which sounds like it was "secured" from the outside with an alarm device incase the child attempts to leave. Counselors claim the child can leave the bivy if they need to, but in statements to 1st responders, the counselors kept saying they had to open or close the bivy.

Counselors claim they checked on the boy, who had been very agitated since his arrival, at 12 midnight, 3 am and 6 am but at 7:45 am he was unresponsive and cold to the touch, NAKED FROM THE WAIST DOWN, with his pants and underwear piled near his head.

At the time of the incident, the camp would not allow the other kids who were present to be questioned. I assume this is because they are minors and parental consent was required prior to questioning. I cannot find any indication that fellow "campers" have been questioned yet.

Something is just so fishy here.

Was the child naked because they use humiliation and embarrassment as a tactic to break ones "spirit" or was there some form of sexual assault happening? One of the first responders initially suspected that there had been some form of poison ingested. What made him/her think poison?

I did find a story about sexual assault allegations back in 2016 at Trails Carolina.

I think this story is one to follow.

The boys that were sleeping/sharing the cabin with the deceased 12 yr old were between 10 and 12 yrs.
imo: It has to be a living nightmare for 12 yr olds no less 10 yr olds being sent into these hell hole wilderness camps.
 
IMO: Bloom's disdainful dismissal of and arrogant lack of knowledge about how inhuman the kids are treated and punished at Trails and Wilderness Camps in general as he pleads for Trails Carolina to reopen.



Disgusting. That poor child will never, ever, ever, have another chance at life, these poor excuses for parents have many more "camps" to send their poor children too. I find it cruel comparing the terrible death of this child to the closing of that stupid camp. There are MANY options for treatment, real treatment.
 
In a page-long response to the children’s removal from the camp, Trails Carolina slammed the North Carolina Department of Health and Human Services for taking students with complex mental health diagnoses from its care with such short notice for parents. It said the state forced “18 vulnerable children” to leave “a safe healing space against their parents’ wishes.”

“Parents believe the program is safe and do not want their children’s treatment disrupted by the State, which has continued to make reckless decisions based on false and misleading information from the Transylvania County Sheriff’s Office,” said the statement, which was issued through a public relations firm.

Officials order all children removed from North Carolina wilderness camp where boy died

backreading because I've been offline for the long weekend. Went looking for the entire page long statement from the Trails spin doctors. it is as follows and I am livid at the sheer audacity.

After 5 p.m. EST on Feb. 15, DHHS threatened and intimidated parents by demanding parents travel from all over the country to pick up their children or DHHS would take their children into custody. The children were receiving high-level clinical care for complex mental health diagnoses requiring experienced professionals with full knowledge of critical medications and specialized treatment regimens. Normally, locating alternative programs and matching children for placement takes several weeks. This negligent and reckless move by the State denied parents the opportunity to continue to care for their children in the appropriate manner. 100% of parents did not want their children to leave the program (See What Parents Have to Say).

Parents believe the program is safe and do not want their children’s treatment disrupted by the State, which has continued to make reckless decisions based on false and misleading information from the Transylvania County Sheriff’s Office. Local, experienced, and knowledgeable DSS social workers on-site have indicated in written reports and conversations with program staff that kids are safe, properly supervised and at no risk of harm.

Previously undisclosed by the Sheriff was the illegal and unauthorized removal of four young boys, ages 10-12, on the evening of Feb. 6. The boys were detained at the Sheriff’s Office until 1 a.m. Parents called the Sheriff to prevent the infliction of further trauma on the boys, who had not yet been informed of the tragedy. Parents were lied to as the Sheriff stated he did have not custody of the children, and the children were not on the premises.

We grieve with the family of the student who tragically passed and have promised to do everything we can to determine what happened. Based upon preliminary findings by state agencies, internal investigation, information and conversations with officials, staff, and known experts, everything points to an accidental death. The Transylvania County Sheriff’s Office has maintained a biased approach in what appears to be an attempt to close a program that has successfully treated and helped restore and heal more than 2,700 families’ and saved lives.

The impact of the State’s reckless actions is far-reaching. The 18 vulnerable children forced to leave a safe healing space against their parents' wishes have suffered permanent, serious and unnecessary harm. There are limited places where parents can turn to find the necessary care for severe mental health diagnoses and complex treatment; this is a tragic and unnecessary loss for parents, children, and 75+ staff members who have poured their heart and soul into helping kids.

The Sheriff and DHHS likely did not have the evidence to close the program and take its license through appropriate and generally accepted judicial review. Calling and intimidating parents to pick up their children was an attempt to achieve their nefarious goal while avoiding fair and appropriate due process with full factual disclosures.

Trails Carolina
Trails Carolina responds to officials removing children from camp following recent death
Something tells me that these claims are gonna come back and bite them in the ***.
Like big time.

"The children were receiving high-level clinical care for complex mental health diagnoses requiring experienced professionals with full knowledge of critical medications and specialized treatment regimens."
 

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