NC - MacDonald family murders at Fort Bragg, 1970 - Jeffrey MacDonald innocent?

[rashomon]

Fifty years ago today, on February 17, 1970, the brutally murdered bodies of Colette, Kimberley and Kristen MacDonald were found in their own home.
Killed by the one who should have loved and protected them: the husband and father, Jeffrey MacDonald, who, to this day, is still in denial over what he did to them. A narcissistic murderer who will never admit the truth.
I hope he'll rot in prison, which he deserves.

 

[Zella]

I don't think he's in denial so much as he is just a pathological liar who is trying to save face.

MacDonald probably creeps me out more than just about any other murderer I've read about. I couldn't finish Fatal Vision because the chapters from his perspective were so off-putting.

 

[rashomon]

I don't think he's in denial so much as he is just a pathological liar who is trying to save face.

Jeffrey MacDonald is a pathological liar, no doubt about it. He knows that he murdered his family.

 

[Zella]

Jeffrey MacDonald is a pathological liar, no doubt about it. He knows that he murdered his family.

Agreed 100%!

 

[borndem]

Fifty years ago today, on February 17, 1970, the brutally murdered bodies of Colette, Kimberley and Kristen MacDonald were found in their own home.
Killed by the one who should have loved and protected them: the husband and father, Jeffrey MacDonald, who, to this day, is still in denial over what he did to them. A narcissistic murderer who will never admit the truth.
I hope he'll rot in prison, which he deserves.

bbm
Yes. X 3.

Can you imagine the kind of grandmother Colette would have been? My heart still aches for what she endured -- the months before he killed her and her beautiful girls along with the son whom she was carrying, and the night that lying, selfish man dimmed and put out the bright lights who were his family.

 

[Betty P]

Local newspaper is doing a series of articles

The Jeffrey MacDonald case: A timeline

Jeffrey MacDonald case intrigues 50 years later

Jeffrey MacDonald in the media

One detail that always baffled me was the hippie woman in abig floppy hat with a candle. Even now, having read so many cases here in WS and in the news, there's never been another case of an intruder/killer carrying a lit candle into a dark home, then not dropping it during a violent struggle with the victim and two men. In a small apartment living room. Also never read of a case where a woman went sneaking into a murder scene wearing a large hat. Those details were like something out of a bad "B" movie.

 

[borndem]

Local newspaper is doing a series of articles

The Jeffrey MacDonald case: A timeline

Jeffrey MacDonald case intrigues 50 years later

Jeffrey MacDonald in the media

One detail that always baffled me was the hippie woman in abig floppy hat with a candle. Even now, having read so many cases here in WS and in the news, there's never been another case of an intruder/killer carrying a lit candle into a dark home, then not dropping it during a violent struggle with the victim and two men. In a small apartment living room. Also never read of a case where a woman went sneaking into a murder scene wearing a large hat. Those details were like something out of a bad "B" movie.

About MacD's story -- he didn't have enuff time to really concoct something better -- poor guy, ya know, he had worked 3 shifts; according to the list of things he did that day, he "may have taken" an Eskatrol, a combination of amphetamine and tranquilizer, to lose weight for boxing matches. He was sick & tired of being husband and daddy, and he just went off that night -- wet bed, naggy wife (according to him) -- and blah, blah, blah.
He may well have seen a woman in a floppy hat and boots somewhere, sometime -- Ft. Bragg/Fayetteville was full of hippies, dealers, and other alternate-lifestyle types, as was any town in the USA -- and MacD didn't like it...
If he'd had more time...
Grrrr.

 

[Betty P]

About MacD's story -- he didn't have enuff time to really concoct something better -- poor guy, ya know, he had worked 3 shifts; according to the list of things he did that day, he "may have taken" an Eskatrol, a combination of amphetamine and tranquilizer, to lose weight for boxing matches. He was sick & tired of being husband and daddy, and he just went off that night -- wet bed, naggy wife (according to him) -- and blah, blah, blah.
He may well have seen a woman in a floppy hat and boots somewhere, sometime -- Ft. Bragg/Fayetteville was full of hippies, dealers, and other alternate-lifestyle types, as was any town in the USA -- and MacD didn't like it...
If he'd had more time...
Grrrr.

JMO (and there's so much I've forgotten about this case) MacD knew that Helen woman because he may have been selling them drugs for extra cash. Hospitals probably didn't have as much security in place back then to control prescription drugs. My theory only, but others may have suspected the same.

Every time I hear MacD say he woke up when the "hippies" came in the room and said "Acid is groovy, kill the pigs", I do this , because that's so obviously made-up. The whole "hippies on acid with a candle, chanting" story is all the proof I need that he's guilty. He only came up with that story because there's no motive for a group of total strangers to go into someone's home and kill a young woman and her small children in total darkness, in the middle of the night. There's also no way a group of "hippies" as such, would take money from someone to do the same.

The Manson Family was an extreme exception to hippie behavior back in the day. They were a cult, isolated, sometimes deprived of food and water, conditioned and brainwashed by Manson. The investigators were right when they looked at the magazine article about the Manson Family that MacD was reading and surmised that was the source of his story.

Christ Watts brutal murders of his wife and little girls should remind people that some fathers are capable of these atrocities, when they desire a new life, freedom and no family financial burden.

 

[Satch]

I never thought that MacDonald went home to kill his family that night. I think that Collette and he got into a big fight about his extramarital affairs and she threatened to leave him. (I also believe that this began after Kim wet the bed.) Anger turned to screams and the range that sent Jeff off, was Collette hitting him in the face with the hairbrush. Something like "Getting hit by a woman" would turn him from anger to rage. He got that club, intending to hurt Collette badly with it. Kim awoke to the screams and range, and that horrifying blow intended for Collette hit Kim in the skull, as she entered the room.

Her injuries were so severe at MacDonald had to kill her and Collette. For awhile, I think that he might have thought about leaving and not doing anything to Kristen, but than realizing that she would be old enough to testify against him, he was forced to kill her. Now, he COULD have pulled a John List by fleeing (later captured under an alias identity) or a William Bradford Bishop (never found after killing his family although there were rumors of several sightings over the years.) But perhaps JM would think that by fleeing, that would also be an admission of guilt. He was able to use the Hippie Story and relate it to the time, place, and culture associated with the Manson Killings, and it probably would have worked for him, IF Freddy Kassab had not worked so hard to re-open the case and work night and day to find out the real story.

If only he had messed up that living room and made it look more like a struggle. But the problem was MacDonald always believed that he was better and brighter than anybody else. And he had to be #1 at anything. I think that he thought that if he went with the Manson Murder type story, local LE would be too incompetent to ever convict him.

Satch

 

[Betty P]

But the problem was MacDonald always believed that he was better and brighter than anybody else. And he had to be #1 at anything. I think that he thought that if he went with the Manson Murder type story, local LE would be too incompetent to ever convict him.

The classic problem for so many narcissistic murderers. His was the first real case I read about where the personality profile, motives and crime were so textbook accurate. He almost got away with it a couple of times. You're theory about accidentally injuring Kim is refreshing my memory of this case now. In spite of the mistakes LE made in this case, they did a good job on much of it, including their attempts to reconstruct what happened with very low-tech tools. I was just looking back at some of the old crime scene photos and cringe at what appear to be obvious examples of LE moving evidence around in the kitchen, etc. But they protected and made good use of the most important evidence.

It's hard to imagine, those little girls (and baby boy) would be in their early 50's today. They were such darling little kids and Colette seemed to be a very good mom. She was a bright, well educated woman who probably could have been a doctor, lawyer or other professional. She probably would have divorced him eventually, as women in the 70's grew less tolerant of cheating husbands. MacD was basically behaving like a "meth head" that night, IIRC he had been taking a lot of a meth-type drug. His arrogance and narcissism remind me of a guy I grew up with who eventually got away with murdering his poor wife.

 

[Zella]

One of JM's other issues is hoping people would accept the narrative that the attackers would so ferociously attack a petite pregnant woman and small children but barely touch the adult male Green Beret in the house who, ostensibly, would be more of a threat. That is a big difference from, say, the Manson Murders, where everyone was viciously murdered but I know Frykowski especially put up a hell of a fight, which triggered even more violence toward him to subdue him.

My dad was stationed at Fort Bragg when Fatal Vision was released. This was some 10 years after the murders. He told me he didn't remember meeting anyone who knew MacDonald, but he said that it seemed like everyone on base was reading the book and so many people were driving by the duplex where it happened to gawk that MPs were stationed there to turn them back.

 

[Thepoet]

Fifty years ago today, on February 17, 1970, the brutally murdered bodies of Colette, Kimberley and Kristen MacDonald were found in their own home.
Killed by the one who should have loved and protected them: the husband and father, Jeffrey MacDonald, who, to this day, is still in denial over what he did to them. A narcissistic murderer who will never admit the truth.
I hope he'll rot in prison, which he deserves.

Agree. and Colette was pregnant with a son.

 

[Thepoet]

I never thought that MacDonald went home to kill his family that night. I think that Collette and he got into a big fight about his extramarital affairs and she threatened to leave him. (I also believe that this began after Kim wet the bed.) Anger turned to screams and the range that sent Jeff off, was Collette hitting him in the face with the hairbrush. Something like "Getting hit by a woman" would turn him from anger to rage. He got that club, intending to hurt Collette badly with it. Kim awoke to the screams and range, and that horrifying blow intended for Collette hit Kim in the skull, as she entered the room.

Her injuries were so severe at MacDonald had to kill her and Collette. For awhile, I think that he might have thought about leaving and not doing anything to Kristen, but than realizing that she would be old enough to testify against him, he was forced to kill her. Now, he COULD have pulled a John List by fleeing (later captured under an alias identity) or a William Bradford Bishop (never found after killing his family although there were rumors of several sightings over the years.) But perhaps JM would think that by fleeing, that would also be an admission of guilt. He was able to use the Hippie Story and relate it to the time, place, and culture associated with the Manson Killings, and it probably would have worked for him, IF Freddy Kassab had not worked so hard to re-open the case and work night and day to find out the real story.

If only he had messed up that living room and made it look more like a struggle. But the problem was MacDonald always believed that he was better and brighter than anybody else. And he had to be #1 at anything. I think that he thought that if he went with the Manson Murder type story, local LE would be too incompetent to ever convict him.

Satch

You were correct when you said Kimberly wet the bed. MacDonald claimed, and still claims, it was Kristin, but it has been proven the urine in the bed cane from Kimberly (different blood types). Why would he lie about it? For some reason he didn’t want Kimberly to be in the master bedroom, but brain serum on the wall and door frame, from the vicious head wound, proves she was there. I’ve read a number of theories, including child abuse.

MacDonald couldn’t flee because he saw himself as the “ Golden Boy”, the best, and he had to maintain that image. His narcissism would not allow him to leave, and IMO, keeps him from admitting the truth. It will probably also keep him from receiving a parole, because to receive a parole he must admit the crime and show remorse!

By the way, all the “50 year” articles contain errors, inaccuracies, and/or mis-statements.

 

[borndem]

You were correct when you said Kimberly wet the bed. MacDonald claimed, and still claims, it was Kristin, but it has been proven the urine in the bed cane from Kimberly (different blood types). Why would he lie about it? For some reason he didn’t want Kimberly to be in the master bedroom, but brain serum on the wall and door frame, from the vicious head wound, proves she was there. I’ve read a number of theories, including child abuse.

MacDonald couldn’t flee because he saw himself as the “ Golden Boy”, the best, and he had to maintain that image. His narcissism would not allow him to leave, and IMO, keeps him from admitting the truth. It will probably also keep him from receiving a parole, because to receive a parole he must admit the crime and show remorse!

By the way, all the “50 year” articles contain errors, inaccuracies, and/or mis-statements.

Yes, indeed it was Kimberly's urine in the bed -- and I agree that MacD said it was Kristen's, possibly because he and Colette had fought about it before; or he didn't want a trace of her in their bedroom, as you said, @Thepoet (what? no thought of blood type? he, a physician, didn't know the blood types of his own family? He was quite crazed by then, of course -- logic was obviously not in his head by then, only high-paced panic. And now, Kim's horrible injury put the scenario into a whole new problem, ergo the Manson defense. The smartest one in the world has lost his little brain cells to utter panic.

 

[Thepoet]

Yes, indeed it was Kimberly's urine in the bed -- and I agree that MacD said it was Kristen's, possibly because he and Colette had fought about it before; or he didn't want a trace of her in their bedroom, as you said, @Thepoet (what? no thought of blood type? he, a physician, didn't know the blood types of his own family? He was quite crazed by then, of course -- logic was obviously not in his head by then, only high-paced panic. And now, Kim's horrible injury put the scenario into a whole new problem, ergo the Manson defense. The smartest one in the world has lost his little brain cells to utter panic.

Yes, well said. Bravo! The brightest guy in the room was really just a dim bulb!

Brilliant physician?

1. Didn’t know his family’s blood types!
2. Didn’t know you don’t remove an object impaling someone (claimed he removed knife from Colette’s chest-probably unsure if his fingerprints were on the handle and/or blade)!
3. Didn’t know CPR must be done on hard, flat surface (claimed he performed CPR on children on beds)!
4. Trained physician and emergency room surgeon and yet he never turned on a light to see what he was doing (he knew what HE had done) or called to neighbors for help!
5. Described symptoms from nicked lung as if it was a major injury and he was dying. Several medical personnel described his injuries as minor and one stated that MacDonald “could have walked into emergency room on his own!” The wound to his chest was described as “a clean, precise incision, like a surgeon would make!” (not from an ice pick) He drank Cold Duck with friends the next day!
6. Didn’t (still doesn’t) know that a person suffers memory loss from a concussion. Concussion includes; ”loss of memory(amnesia) and confusion. The amnesia usually involves forgetting the event that caused the concussion”. MacDonald was (according to his own testimony) hit several times and knocked unconscious and yet, when he regained consciousness he remembered everything and has never wavered!

Yep, brilliant Doctor! Or, as you said horrible murderer crazed by panic!

 

[mickey2942]

What I have found interesting about McDonald, is the fact that at this point in time, I wonder if he has convinced himself, in some delusional way, that he did not kill his family.

He continues to portray himself as an innocent victim, wrongly convicted of crimes that he did not commit.

 

[borndem]

What I have found interesting about McDonald, is the fact that at this point in time, I wonder if he has convinced himself, in some delusional way, that he did not kill his family.

He continues to portray himself as an innocent victim, wrongly convicted of crimes that he did not commit.

bbm
I've wondered the same thing for years, @mickey2942, and IMO I think, in some kind of superficial, thinly-veiled way, that he has convinced himself that he didn't do it, and those (fairy-tale) "hippies" did over-kill his family, and left him with a wound that only needed a band-aid. Yes.

 

[wendybtn]

Fifty years ago today, on February 17, 1970, the brutally murdered bodies of Colette, Kimberley and Kristen MacDonald were found in their own home.
Killed by the one who should have loved and protected them: the husband and father, Jeffrey MacDonald, who, to this day, is still in denial over what he did to them. A narcissistic murderer who will never admit the truth.

Fifty years?? How is that possible?? I have read so much about this case and researched and watched interviews over the decades, I will have a hard time disbelieving his guilt at this point.
I hope he'll rot in prison, which he deserves.

 

[wendybtn]

bbm
I've wondered the same thing for years, @mickey2942, and IMO I think, in some kind of superficial, thinly-veiled way, that he has convinced himself that he didn't do it, and those (fairy-tale) "hippies" did over-kill his family, and left him with a wound that only needed a band-aid. Yes.

The version I still believe includes his use of some sort of stimulant drugs (legal or otherwise), and I think between the fog of the years and the fog of any drugs, he may not believe he killed them.

 

[Thepoet]

What I have found interesting about McDonald, is the fact that at this point in time, I wonder if he has convinced himself, in some delusional way, that he did not kill his family.

He continues to portray himself as an innocent victim, wrongly convicted of crimes that he did not commit.

I believe that MacDonald continues to portray himself as an innocent victim, wrongly convicted of crimes that he did not commit, because he sees himself as so much smarter than everyone else and always thought his story would be/should be accepted. He has also always seen himself as the “Golden Boy” and he is incapable of doing or saying anything that would compromise (in his mind) that image. That is why he will never get a parole; he will never admit his guilt or express remorse.

MacDonald didn’t just murder his family, he viciously attacked them and brutally beat and stabbed them! Pregnant Colette had both of her arms broken. Kimberly was struck so hard her face was displaced and brain serum was left on the Master bedroom wall and door frame. MacDonald lifted up little Kristin, laid her across his lap, and stabbed her until she was dead! Kristin was premeditated and her death was needed to eliminate a witness, and complete the story of murderous hippies, to protect himself and his image. There was so much more brutality and carnage, but it’s so hard to think about and describe. I do not believe that MacDonald could forget such an evil rampage and selfishness! But he will continue to proclaim his innocence because it is all he has left! He is a selfish, horrible monster who is exactly where he belongs!