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NE - Eight killed, 4 injured in Westroads Mall shooting, Omaha, 5 Dec 2007

Discussion in 'Rampage Killings and Terrorist Attacks' started by Melly, Dec 5, 2007.

  1. Reannan

    Reannan Seek Brotherhood, Cherish Solitude

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    Thank you Toby. I was blessed to have a nephew who was a TRUE hero for the battle he fought with cancer. This jerk who chose to go on a killing spree in the mall in Omaha, is anything but a hero. I really, really, wonder how Robert Hawkins would have felt if he had spent a few weeks in the Neonatal Intensive Care Unit, or Specialized Intensive Care Unit of ANY hospital in this nation how he would have felt. I apologize in advance to anyone that this offends, but I am loosing patience with these self-absorbed, self-centered, egotistical jerks. This country was founded with individuals who placed their families and their meager belongings in wagon trains and headed west. They buried children, husbands, and wives......all along the way. THEY had something to be depressed about. WTF do THESE people, i.e the Columbine kids, Robert Hawkins, etc. HAVE TO BE DEPRESSED ABOUT? And if they ARE depressed, WHY don't they get off their azz and CARE ABOUT SOMEONE ELSE??? THAT is the secret to not wallowing in self-pity. I KNOW that there are individuals with chemical imbalances who are truly beyond help. My Mother was one of them. She would HAVE PERSONALLY CHOKED THE LIFE OUT OF ROBERT HAWKINS, however!!!! :furious: :furious: :furious: I grow weary of the pathetic mewling about how down-trodden these creeps are by "society". They have more blessings than entire generations in other countries, and they DARE to think their lives are meaningless and empty???? They are the epitome of self-absorbed idiots. May they rot in Hell. How DARE they! They may achieve fame, but it is like the short-lived fame of a bad case of the flu. Society will move on and rise above this. The families of the victims however, will suffer for a long, long, time. Hope the little bastard is proud.....as he fries. :furious:
     
  2. philamena

    philamena Former Member

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    The shootings were a tragedy.
    The shooter evidently was a psychological and emotional wreck.
    But from everything I've read in the past 25 years, smoking pot does not make someone go on a shooting spree and cause them to commit suicide.
     
  3. Marthatex

    Marthatex New Member

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    A lot of kids smoke pot, unfortunately.

    That usually makes you "mellow".

    Pot doesn't make you go on a shooting rampage. Losing your girlfriend and losing your job will; if you're depressed anyway and never been helped. He could be bipolar, or just deeply depressed.

    He was unstable, a wreck; correct. An accident waiting to happen - Just like Cho, who killed the innocent students and professors at Va. Tech.

    Charles Whitman - 1966 - got up and killed his wife, then his mother. Then he went to the tower and shot everyone else he could find. He was an expert marksman.

    He MAY have had a brain tumor, but many of those are benign and harmless.

    He was a deeply depressed and unhappy man; with serious troubles with his father. He may have been having marriage problems.

    I recently had a friend leave her husband; he was distraught and suicidal. I talked to him and said "call us day or night, but if you feel like committing suicide PLEASE call or come over here. He said he would.

    He ultimiately went to a psychiatrist and got anti-depressant drugs. If men have a sudden lifeline cut off like that, they WILL commit suicide. I've seen it happen. It's important that everyone has some kind of lifeline; and he evidently never had any family bonds. (this kid yesterday)
     
  4. Marthatex

    Marthatex New Member

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    Yes. It was a bloodbath also In Austin, Texas in 1966. The hospital was totally unequipped to handle it; nothing like this had ever happened before. The had to put the injured on the floor; and take the injured according to the "worst injured", most of whom were mortally so. These things happen in nice, normally calm towns. Blacksburg, Austin, Denver suburb, Omaha, Utah (?)

    That's a good point about the money already spent on him - I didn't know that; need to read up but he was taken from his parents at age 3. Are you sure that money does not include all his custodial and mental health care.

    In spite of everything, YOU CAN"T MAKE A PERSON TAKE ANTIDEPRESSANT DRUGS; or drugs for biipolar, etc. IF they don't want the help or are embarrassed, the psychiatrists or psychologists can't make them. He was 18.

    Maybe they were poor psych docs for the State; they often are. I don't know but someone made a big error not gettting him into some kind of custodial situation. Had he ever served in juvenile jail?

    Getting attention is part of it - going out in a big way -(Columbine); ;but they're not interested in getting their picture in the news (how would they SEE it when they're dead) - it's not rational, it's ideation and they're are mentally ill. People who go on shooting sprees are mentally ill.

    Timothy McVeigh had a political ideology - that was evil, planned. Even the terrorists of 9-11 weren't mentally ill - they had a politcal/religious ideology and planned to carry it out.

    There's a huge difference. We need to recognize the warning signs - quiet, upset, disturbed, depressed males who can't hold a job, lose a job, etc. They need to be caught early by teachers, juvenile court, psychiatric hospitals, etc. Follow up is necessary.

    Unfortunately all these workers get exhausted, and people fall through the cracks. Parents need to be vigilint, it's too easy to ignore, watch TV, drink a few beers and not talk to the kids.

    http//www.timetotalk.org
     
  5. Taximom

    Taximom Former Member

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    I just heard a 911 call from that shooting. Very heartbreaking. The only thing heard on this one was gunshots.

    :(
     
  6. CarpeDiem

    CarpeDiem Former Member

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    That person must have been so close to the shooter they couldn't talk, that probably saved their life and other's too. Actually, I hope that person did survive.:eek:
     
  7. Taximom

    Taximom Former Member

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    They did not explain on the newscast (FOX news), but your thoughts were exactly what I wondered. Was the person dying or did he/she just not want to talk because the shots were so close? :(

    The dispatcher was like "911, what's your emergency?" pause ho hum gunshots gunshots gunshots "911, what's your emergency?" yawn gunshots gunshots... :rolleyes:

    I don't know if that was from a cellphone, but 911 wouldn't be able to tell where that call was coming from if it was a cellphone, right? Or is that fixed now in all places?

    I've never really heard gunshots before like that.
     
  8. eve

    eve New Member

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    We will definitely be following up. We always do. Thanks everyone for chiming in with concern on this. The shooter at the mall got kicked out of his home - I see this ALL the time, especially in single parent homes where one parent deserts or dies and then the other one finds a new "mate" who doesn't want the pre-existing kid. I just wanted people to know that those of us working with kids like this are very aware of the numbers. Lots of neglected, angry, violent kids out there. They scare me too, even when I care for them. The negatives in their lives have been piling up for SO long by the time they get any sort of help, before I meet them. They hate authority. They hate LE. However, I find if you you try to build a relationship, as a teacher, they are quite receptive, hungry for adult guidance and structure. Many lose their tempers in my class one day and the next are the first in my room to check in.

    Eve
     
  9. Squishified

    Squishified Well-Known Member

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  10. heavenlydaze

    heavenlydaze Music keeps me sane!!!

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    Apparently, the home Hawkins was staying in, that of Deb Maruca, wasn't such great place to be.

    "Harrington's daughter, Shelby, said Hawkins had threatened to kill her two to three weeks ago, after he and some friends accused her of stealing things from Hawkins' car.

    "He said 'I'm going to kill you, I am going to kill your family and I'm going to burn your house down,'" said Shelby Harrington, a junior at Papillion-La Vista South High School.

    "Shelby Harrington said she used to hang out with the boys and their friends when they drank and smoked marijuana at the home of Debora Maruca, who had taken in Hawkins.

    "Every day they were doing something," Shelby Harrington said.

    Thirteen months ago, a 14-year-old girl had to be carried out of the Maruca home unconscious from an overdose of drugs and alcohol, according to Kevin Harrington and the 14-year-old girl's father, who asked not to be named.

    Maruca did not return phone messages Thursday asking for a response. A sign on her door asked visitors to respect the family's privacy."...

    http://www.omaha.com/index.php?u_page=2798&u_sid=10204201
     
  11. southcitymom

    southcitymom New Member

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    Marthatex,

    I do agree we have a lot of room for improvement and I agree that automatic weapons should not be available.

    I disagree with metal detectors everywhere and honestly don't know if I could live in a society like that.
     
  12. crypto6

    crypto6 New Member

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    MT: I agree with your anguish, and let's analyze your statements:

    A legal shotgun and an SKS, AR 15, or AK 47 have >16" barrels and are roughly the same size, except the few models with a smaller stock, which still are quite large. All are similarly bulky to carry.

    Automatic weapons are strictly controlled and require a Class III license. There is no indication the SKS was automatic.

    The SKS would have passed the “assault weapon” ban, which was a sop to those who wanted to control weapons, but knew little about them. The banned weapons had these three: flash suppressor, pistol handgrip, and ability to accept high capacity magazines. This SKS did not appear to have a suppressor by the photo, and was thus not banned at any time and such bans would not have affected its manufacture or sale.

    There is no evidence to prove a decrease in crime due to the ban or an increase in crime due to its expiration. There is some evidence to suggest that the “shall issue” of concealed carry permits in many states is partly responsible for the decrease seen in the late 1990s through mid 2000s.

    Within the spirit of the Constitution, the people have the right to keep and bear arms for the purpose of being a militia against any entity infringing on their freedom, even the US government. If the non-military agents of the government (FBI, ATF, police) have these “assault” weapons it is certain a citizen militia should have them.

    Where we agree is trying to keep weapons of any type out of the hands of crazies. The most chilling statement the killer made is about being famous for his abominations. Since Columbine, a line has been crossed and we can’t seem to stop the escalation of attempts at mass murder, each drawing more media attention than the last.

    Crypto6
     
  13. Reannan

    Reannan Seek Brotherhood, Cherish Solitude

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    Crypto6, I TOTALLY agree with everything you said. I have an SKS, and there is no way in Hades that I would EVER do something like this kid did. Non-gun owners will probably ask....."why do I have an SKS". The answer: I wanted it, and I like shooting it. There are different challenges involved with different weapons, and as a law abiding citizen, I happen to have several different kinds of weapons that I enjoy shooting. I know a LOT of people who are just like me. They are ALL law abiding citizens. And IF.....just IF......we were ever in a situation where we were under attack, without protection from local or national tax-paid protection......these people would all be an asset to our current way of life. I do not intend to hijack this thread with a gun control statement, but I will say this: the right to posess a weapon was given to ME by people who had lived under tyrany, and who had witnessed first hand the threat that NOT having a weapon could bring forth to a society. I have not forgotten their sacrafice, and I will defend my rights to the end of my days.
     
  14. Marthatex

    Marthatex New Member

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    Why not? We don't complain about being safe on airlines do we.

    Metal detectors would not be "everywhere" obviously. They would be at schools, to protect our precious children.

    They would be at malls to protect the masses of people who go there.

    You need bomb sniffing dogs; I'm sure we have them some places. This is a different time, and place now. Let's not kid ourselves. We can't go back to how it was in the '50s, unfortunately.

    I don't mind a little inconvenience to have some peace of mind. It doesn't "take away our rights" - it GIVES us more freedom, as we should be able to live in this free country IMO.

    Glad you agree on automatics - We don't need a "citizens militia" as we did in the 1700s and 1800s. We have army, National guard and police to protect us.

    If we don't "change" appropriate things, then things will never change...

    No change is a bad idea in a progressive, intelligent society IMO.
     
  15. Marthatex

    Marthatex New Member

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    There is just no excuse for this IMO - he should have been reported to police. He had just been let out of custodial care during the last year, with approval of the Dad. Is the most recent thing I read - why didn't he live with his Dad?

    So many boys with serious problems don't have a stable Father figure.

    Overdoses happen alot; but threats on peoples' lives should be taken seriously. People just "hope" these living time bombs won't go off. Sad, and stupid.
     
  16. Marthatex

    Marthatex New Member

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    Beautiful post. If you just have one lifeline, it can help.
     
  17. MeoW333

    MeoW333 New Member

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    Does she have a pocket in the vest for a trauma plate? That would prevent further damage..
     
  18. MeoW333

    MeoW333 New Member

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    I feel for this poor kid who actually got so depressed and low that he felt the only way possible anyone at all would remember him is if he commit suicide while taking a bunch of people out with him. I would say the break up of the American family unit is to blame. This kid had no one at all, all he had was his wish that he would get attention from his shootings. That is quite pathetic and sad. It's just a very sad case.. His mother and father are to blame for this. Why did they kick him out? For, certainly they are the ones responsible for forming his personality during it's formative years. What happened to make things go so wrong for this young man? It's sad, and i pray for everyone...
    In Conn. they use assault rifles to hunt deer. I don't see the point of it. Any Assault weapon is made for war. And War only.
     
  19. txsvicki

    txsvicki Active Member

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    I just read the news report about the suicide note and Hawkins called his victims pieces of sh**. He was hanging around with younger teens and involved in selling drugs, but hard working men and women, one working a second job at the dept. store, were less than nothing in his eyes.
     
  20. southcitymom

    southcitymom New Member

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    Marthatex,

    I don't like the metal detectors at airports either. Metal detectors don't make me feel safer and they don't give me peace of mind - they do the opposite. They engender an attitude that we live in very dangerous times. I don't think we live in very dangerous times. I think we are "safer" (whatever that means to you) today than we have ever been in the past - both individually and as a society. I admit, we still have a ways to go towards complete peace and I'm all about moving towards that goal - but it's not a goal that will happen with metal detectors, IMHO.

    Now, there is an inherent danger when you live in a world with 6 billion other ego-saturated human beings. I understand that, but I am incapable of living my life in fear of that because I'm not afraid of it. Perhaps this is all a perception game. I'm 41-years-old and every year I live here, I see growth and progress (smaller in some areas and larger in others) towards more peace and unity between humans.

    I understand that not everyone has this view of humanity and the world and that's fine. But if this country turns into a country where metal detectors are standard in our schools, churches, malls and other places of congress, my family and I will move somewhere else where that is not the case. Personally, I cannot live happily without a large amount of safety and freedom. Metal detectors wreak of fear and captivity.

    In other words, if my society is so dangerous that it needs metal detectors (and obviously, I don't feel like the US is this dangerous), I need to leave the society instead of living under that type of oppression.

    JMHO.
     

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