New Billy the Kid photo said found, though some are dubious; would be only second one

Discussion in 'Up to the Minute' started by wfgodot, Aug 30, 2013.

  1. wfgodot

    wfgodot Former Member

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    Daily Mail:

    Is this Billy the Kid? Historian claims new photograph shows legendary American gunman, making it only the second known image of famous outlaw

    • New Mexico historian Frank Parrish is certain picture shows gunman
    • It is thought the picture was taken when Billy the Kid was 20
    • The only surviving authentic photograph of the outlaw sold for $2million

    the pictures and story at the link

    Well, other than the fact it looks nothing like the Kid in the other picture....maybe. Whattaya think?
     
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  3. amandab

    amandab Well-Known Member

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    I'm no good at photo comparison, but even I can see that the ears are all wrong at the very least.
     
  4. i.b.nora

    i.b.nora I am polka dot

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    I think it looks alot like the known image. Everything, the droopy eyes, the placement and shapes of the eyebrows, how a mouth closes over buck teeth, the ears, everything!!! IMO.
    What a great find if it can be authenticated.
     
  5. Backwoods

    Backwoods New Member

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    Oh, I think it resembles him (the already-known photo of him, at any rate) very much!

    He just looks a little more dressed up and ...cleaner?

    I think it's him.
     
  6. Backwoods

    Backwoods New Member

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    I think the ears match! They're just flying completely free, with no hat to rein them in, LOL.

    And look at the chin -- I really see resemblance there.

    Eyebrows are the one thing (or two things??) that looks really different to me...
     
  7. CanManEh

    CanManEh New Member

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    You know what i find odd is that there is only 0ne now maybe 2 pics or him .I know from watching a recent program on quite a few of the more famous outlaws that one thing that they allways did was take a photo of whoever was shot and put in the pine box they would take a photo for proof so whoever killed the outlaw so he can collect his reward . Also these guys were all the same they new and heard about one another and allways wanted to be the bigger badder outlaw so after a robbery or train heist they would all get photo taken they wanted to be knowen as the famous billy the kid or jesse james . not to mention all the wanted posters , maybe they just disappeared over the years but I would bet money that maybe not today but certinally in the years after these guys were killed there were many photos outthere...
     
  8. wfgodot

    wfgodot Former Member

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    Regarding "where do these things go," I used to have a book - I sold it - about Western outlaws, printed in the first part of last century. After plenty of googling and phone calls, it appeared it was the only copy of that particular book - not in itself an important one; a series of stories and character sketches and several pages of pictures, but no unique information - to be found. Anywhere. And it probably hadn't been that small of a printing when it was published. Things get thrown away, or lost; are ephemeral. People don't think of their value in the far future. Time moves on.
     
  9. i.b.nora

    i.b.nora I am polka dot

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    Billy The Kid did not rob banks and trains. There was never a wanted poster for him, and there was only one notice placed in one newspaper, according to this website which seems 'authentic' to me:

    http://aboutbillythekid.com/fact_vs_myth.htm

    "Fact: There were never any “Wanted” posters on Billy the Kid. The closest thing to a wanted poster was a reward notice the governor put in the Las Vegas Gazette in December of 1880. Which read:"

    BILLY THE KID
    $500 Reward
    I will pay $500 reward to any person or persons
    who will capture William Bonny, alias The Kid, and
    deliver him to any sheriff of New Mexico.
    Satisfactory proofs of identity will be required.


    Also, they didn't put photos on wanted posters in the 1880's. If any illustrations were used they were in the form of engravings. Generally speaking, wanted posters of that era were all typographic done with wood type.
     
  10. CHERIE.T

    CHERIE.T Former Member

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    COOL! The young man in the linked picture looks like one of the Jonas Brothers, imoo.
     
  11. i.b.nora

    i.b.nora I am polka dot

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    Correction: I did find a wanted poster for Frank and Jesse James dated 1881 with a photo of them on it. I am surprised, I need to do a little more research.

    http://brodyharper.wordpress.com/2007/09/30/jesse-james/

    Edited to add CORRECTION to my correction.

    Not that anyone but me cares a whole lot but, I am now 99% sure that the Jesse James wanted poster I linked to is likely a new creation made to look and feel old. It is not a reproduction. More than likely it is an artist's interpretation of a non existant wanted poster that the company who publishes them can sell thousands of copies. I would have to see it in person, up close, but there are similar newly created wanted posters for other famous outlaws using photos at a time photos were not yet used in lithography. It was not printed in 1881, more like 1981.

    And the more I look, and think, and research Billy the Kid, I am convinced that is a second photo of him. If Mr Koch swoops in to buy it, we will know for sure. Although my own personal opinion is it should be in The Smithsonian.
     
  12. matou

    matou #los2188

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    I think it's him. JMO
     
  13. DarkChii

    DarkChii Member

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    As an artist, visually it looks like it could the same guy to me.

    I went ahead and put it in photoshop and you can manipulate the head (I'm talking about just getting head size and angle similar) to the point where a lot (most) matches up (brow, ears, nose, jaw).

    I will say though, that the ears would have to be pinned back by the hat a bit though. Neither one sticks out in the known photo quite as much as in this new one. I don't wear hats usually so I duno. *shrug*
     
  14. i.b.nora

    i.b.nora I am polka dot

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    There are better copies of the original known image here, in different sizes.

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Billy_the_Kid_tintype,_Fort_Sumner,_1879-80.png

    Also, the original image is apparently a mirror image of the subject, meaning the rifle is actually in his left hand, and the holster and gun are actually on his right side. I have seen some people flop it and add sepia tones and generally screw it up.

    The new image, I am thinking might have come from a glass negative. I didn't see where the type of image was indicated, maybe I overlooked it.
     
  15. kline

    kline New Member

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    I do think it is him after looking at the photo.....but what was he doing hanging out with Patrick Swayze?
     
  16. ATasteOfHoney

    ATasteOfHoney Active Member

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    It looks like the same "Kid" in both photos to me.
     
  17. multicat

    multicat New Member

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    His friend is sure cute. :blushing:
     
  18. i.b.nora

    i.b.nora I am polka dot

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    Here is a better copy of the new photo which is also a tintype, as is the other photo.

    http://www.lcsun-news.com/portlet/a...sp?articleId=23884872&siteId=557&startImage=2

    Here is the article that Daily Mail got its story from:

    Newly unveiled photo appears to be Billy the Kid and friend

    By S.Derrickson Moore
    Las Cruces Sun News
    Posted: 08/17/2013 05:20:05 PM MDT


    Photo Caption: Tintype photograph owned by Mesilla Valley man appears to be of Billy the Kid and friend Dan Dedrick

    LAS CRUCES >> "The vintage photo features two young men in clean white shirts and suits. The handsome young man on the left can be positively identified as Dan Dedrick, said New Mexico history expert Frank H. Parrish of Las Cruces. And that's the "clincher" that helps prove the identity of Dedrick's good friend in the photo.

    It's the legendary Billy the Kid, Parrish said.

    Parrish has come forward with images made from a tintype owned by a Mesilla Valley man who wishes to remain anonymous."

    Lots more...

    From: http://www.lcsun-news.com/las_cruces-news/ci_23884872/new-photo-appears-be-billy-kid-and-friend
     
  19. Tulessa

    Tulessa Well-Known Member

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    I've had a lot of training in looking at photographs. I used to be a paranormal investigator. These are definitely not the same person.

    1.Look at the bottom lobes of the ears. Totally different shape.
    2.The guy on the left looks like the top of his head is wider.
    3.Look how close together the eyes are regarding the person on the left.
    4.The brow lines are different, too. And the clean pic nose bridge appears more pinched and less like it had been broken.
    5.The nose is smaller on the left too, and it looks like it has a turned up tip.
    6.Look at the forehead the one on the left is wider.
    7. The eyebrows are absolutely different, and i doubt during that time that he would have been plucking his eyebrows, regardless of how cleaned up he may have been. the photo on the left, both eyebrows are thin and arched. the one on the right, the eyebrows are bushy and more straight across.
    8.In the full pic (left side) there's a guy named, and positively identified as Dan Dedrick. He was one of Billy's closest friends and one of the Regulators. Neither knew the other beforehand.

    Ok I think I shall stop.
     
  20. wfgodot

    wfgodot Former Member

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    At last! Thanks for posting, Tulessa, I was beginning to doubt my capability of telling one from another.

    To my untrained eye it looks nothing like the "real" Kid.
     
  21. Tulessa

    Tulessa Well-Known Member

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