New for Me

Discussion in 'JonBenet Ramsey' started by RTC, Jan 2, 2011.

  1. RTC

    RTC Member

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    First of all don't judge my spellcheck skills. I never post long comments, but I have to say that I am energized by this forum and justice for JBR. Now after many years of casual reading I have something to throw out. I have never posted a theory but I just dont get the IDI. if the IDI and really did it, One should never rest. your child can be taken while you are asleep and sexually violated under your nose, under your watch, buried in the wine cellar with her favorite nightie, blankie and dolls and you forgive them within a week. it is not possible unless you are the insider.
    this might not be new conversation as I cant keep up with this inspiring group but what if JR covered up JB not from molestion but from neglect? PR cant remember JB last bath, what undies, what she wore..... I know if I found a loved one and they were really messy, what would I do? I am thinking JR cleaned up after PR, for pride and then went into survival mode overdoing it tremendously, which would include national interviews, reward, foundation,book,political office.....
    Dr Buefs statements are very interesting. I didnt realize female children get vaginal exams. JBR had more than I did in that time frame. Pain while urinating is from bladder infections which is most commonly due to fecal stuff mixing with girl junk. I have always read stuff like yeast infections, vaginitis, but sounds like most of her troubles was related to hygiene.
     
  2. DeeDee249

    DeeDee249 New Member

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    Don't let the "vaginal exam" throw you. JB's pediatrician examined her vagina EXTERNALLY. JB did not have an INTERNAL exam, which would have required a speculum, palpation and, for a little girl of 6, anesthetic where the child is asleep. Internal pelvic exams are not routinely done on children of that age, and only certain severe situations would indicate it. JB's doctor claimed to be unaware of any sexual abuse. He would never have done an internal exam for irritation issues, or "bubble bath issues", even a suspected yeast infection wouldn't require an internal exam.

    Welcome to the boards, and hope you'll participate.
     
  3. Agatha_C

    Agatha_C New Member

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    :wagon:
     
  4. TotallyObsessed

    TotallyObsessed New Member

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    Well...I am an avid Casey Anthony websleuth....but am fairly new to JBR. I (because I am extremely bored at this time and trying to fill my spare time with something until the Anthony trial begins) have started reading "A Perfect Town, A Perfect Murder". I must say that I am only about 1/4 into it and have already formed my opinion of who did it. Also, I am astounded at the inadequacy of the police investigation and the infighting therein. I will search this forum to add to my curiosity and sleuthing. Any particular thread to start with??????

    Thanks to all.
     
  5. my_tee_mouse

    my_tee_mouse Done. Put a Fork in Me.

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    Welcome to the dark side, TO. I've always loved your jumping elephant avi. I'll let someone else suggest where to begin reading, but in the meantime, care to share your opinions? Fresh ideas are welcome!
     
  6. TotallyObsessed

    TotallyObsessed New Member

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    Well, all I everr knew about the case I saw on TV. I was really just on the edge of knowing anything about the case. I thought it hard to imagine that the parents had anything to do with it. I always sort of suspected the son had something to do with it.

    Now, I am leaning towards JR as the perp and PR helping to cover up. I am fascinated as to why FW and JR had such a heated argument that their friendship ended in one afternoon. I seriously don't understand how FW could have looked into that room and not seen JBR. It is suspect that JR searched on his own previously, and then the NEXT time the basement was searched JBR's body was found.

    Like I say, I am just now starting to delve into the information in that book, but that is my first impression thus far.

    I am wondering if the information has lead me to that conclusion, or if the book is biased. Opinions?
     
  7. celticthyme

    celticthyme Member

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    Hi TO,
    Welcome over here. I'm with you , started with the CA case and came over here after reading Steve Thomas's book on the case. I'm still reading old threads. I think one good place to start is the Member's Theories threads. Lot of good input there. You will soon discover there are generally posters of 2 minds here, the RDI / Ramseys did It and the IDI /Intruder did it folks. Also there is a poster Super Dave who has written a book about the subject, but it has not been published yet . . he is a veritable encyclopedia of information ... welcome and good hunting . . .
     
  8. my_tee_mouse

    my_tee_mouse Done. Put a Fork in Me.

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    DeeDee's another good "encyclopedia."
     
  9. TotallyObsessed

    TotallyObsessed New Member

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    Reading on the "Theories" thread...some seem ludicrous. Except that I watched a CSI marathon the other night, and one episode was based on a true story of where a newborn was "kidnapped" and later found in the snow yards from the house. Wrapped in a baby blanket and layed on a garbage bag so as not get get wet. A ladder had been placed at the window (second story) to look like somebody escaped with the baby. Turned out - the parents took the fall after kidnapping theories went bust. Then it was discovered the young teen brother had been watching the baby - turned his back for a few minutes while on the phone AND the 3 year old brother played too rough with the newborn - suffocating it accidently. SO - some parents will go to any length to protect other siblings if something accidental happened.
     
  10. celticthyme

    celticthyme Member

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    Dee Dee and Agatha ( you have numbers and specifics, research info ) I find totally amazing!
     
  11. Agatha_C

    Agatha_C New Member

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    Welcome Totally..... :wagon:

    I have to tell you, I love, love, love your avitar (LOL). SunniRN, recently bumped up a thread titled things that are plaguing me, I would start on page one. Looking forward to hearing your thoughts and ideas...
     
  12. my_tee_mouse

    my_tee_mouse Done. Put a Fork in Me.

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    Yeah, Agatha keeps notes and such. I tend to rely on THEIR notes. lol
     
  13. TotallyObsessed

    TotallyObsessed New Member

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    WOW - things that are plaguing me, is a fabulous thread to start with. I would love for someone who is familiar with the investigative part of the Elizabeth Smart case to compare the actions to those parents to the actions of the Rs. For instance, did they just let the sister continue to sleep when they found Elizabeth missing? Did the police immediately question the sister? BR was secreted away ASAP. Those kind of things are what makes LE scratch their heads :waitasec: and say "hmmm, my hinky meter is going off".

    Either the Rs knew that Burke had nothing to contribute...because they knew what happened, or they were trying to protect Burke.
     
  14. SuperDave

    SuperDave Active Member

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    That's me!
     
  15. SunnieRN

    SunnieRN Active Member

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    The CA threads blow me away!! Talk about awesome research!! I am looking forward to your ideas and theories TO and CT!!
     
  16. DeeDee249

    DeeDee249 New Member

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    I feel PMPT is pretty neutral, though some will see it as biased if it doesn't fit into their own theories. If you have about 2 hours to spare, rent the DVD of the book. The Rs felt Schiller was unbiased and gave him access to their home to recreate the sets. The actual R home was used for the exterior shots. It's an interesting movie to watch, with Marg Helgenberger playing Patsy, John Hurt as JR and Ann-Margaret as Patsy's mother Nedra.

    I agree with your assessment of why FW couldn't see JB when he looked into the WC. I do have some reservations about JB's body being moved, because there is only one livor mortis pattern (indicating she was not moved before livor became "fixed"). And the rigor mortis indicates that wherever she was, she had to be lying on her back (livor pattern indicates this as well). So she had to be hidden in an area where she could be lying flat on her back if she was not in the WC. What I think is that she may have been in the WC all along, but further back in the dark room, possibly covered completely with something darker that wouldn't be seen by someone peering into the dark room with the hallway lights in the background. I believe some tests were done in that basement area, and it was determined that there would have been enough light spilling into the dark WC from the hall outside it that FW should have been able to see her if she was there when he looked, even though FW wasn't able to find the lights to the WC. When she was found, her head and legs were uncovered, with the white blanket pulled over her torso area. Both her longjohns and the blanket were light -colored, and should have reflected enough of the hallway light to be seen. There was plenty of time during the almost 2 hours that JR had "disappeared" (from Det. Arndt's sight, anyway) to have moved her closer to the door, so JR could "feign" seeing her immediately as soon as he looked into the room (according to FW, he "saw" her even before he had turned on the lights).
    I am thinking that the discovery of JB, and all that JR said he did in the WC (untying her tightly-bound hands when forensics proved her hands were NOT tied at all and certainly not together- that darn rigor mortis again; untaping her legs, performing CPR, etc.) must be behind the rift between the two men. FW must know that JR never did any of these things, and of course was upset that JR said he had done them.
     
  17. Agatha_C

    Agatha_C New Member

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    Welcome Celtic, :greetings: Thank you so much, but to be honest, Im just a google junkie. There are others such as Dee Dee that set the bar on expertise, you'll learn who they are as you read over the threads. Their knowledge and time given is truly inspiring.
     
  18. Peepers

    Peepers Member

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    I agree with you on PMPT Dee..I have read it 3 times and watched the movie a couple times. I do think its generally a good unbiased account., The only thing I didnt like was in the movie when they had Pasty crying and peeking thru her fingers at Det. Arndt. hahahaha I know Arndt said that happened but it really sounds (and looked ) ridiculous. Im not sure what I think of LA. One of the biggest oddities to me is not that FW didnt see the body in the wine cellar at first, it was dark and I can see if he didnt expect anything there he could have missed it. But the fact that John and FW started their "investigation" in the basement and found her right away is incredible.
     
  19. UKGuy

    UKGuy Well-Known Member

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    DeeDee249,
    I suspect Fleet White thinks someone had access to JonBenet's body after he looked on the first occassion, else why would he have missed it?

    Couple that with John's rethoric regarding his actions when he found JonBenet, especially leading FW directly to the wine-cellar must have made FW profoundly suspicious?

    I reckon Fleet White had realized that the wine-cellar was a staged crime-scene, hence his decision to go back down and check the duct-tape out.

    At this point he knew but could not prove that the parents were involved.


    .
     
  20. SuperDave

    SuperDave Active Member

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    I know my memory isn't what it used to be, Peepers, but I'm pretty sure it was not LA who said that. It was one of the male cops if I'm not mistaken.
     

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