NV NV - Steven T. Koecher, 30, Henderson, 13 Dec 2009 - # 8

Discussion in '2000's Missing' started by Salem, Mar 16, 2010.

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  1. Salem

    Salem Former Member

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    Please continue here.


    Thread 7



    Salem
     
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  3. RubyRed

    RubyRed "Keep on Truckin"

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    http://law.freeadvice.com/government...ing_person.htm

    the SSN issue

    Wasting tax dollars to find him ? I am wondering if they need to talk to someone else. We all know how gov can be. LE might even sign a letter for them, considering they are wasting their time too if he is alive and well. If I were them I would try again, Be persistent. go to a supervisor. Could a PI find out if his ssn has been used?
    __________________
     
  4. Fairy1

    Fairy1 Divided We Fall

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    Thank you, Salem!
     
  5. Fairy1

    Fairy1 Divided We Fall

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  6. laytonian

    laytonian New Member

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    The "freeadvice" site's worth what you pay. Here's the actual Social Security rules:

    http://www.ssa.gov/foia/html/ltrfwding.htm

    Notice that it's a "one chance" thing....and since it takes awhile for quarterly SS deposits to be made, it's going to be awhile before it would even show anything. Do it too soon, and you lose your chance forever. I'd say it'd more likely be a viable option 6-9 months from now.

    --------------------

    New thread started?
    WHY do we have to have a new thread again?
    Now I have to change my browser favorites, it makes searching for specific posts practically impossible through (now 8) threads, and there's no explanation why this is such a good idea. :furious:
     
  7. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    Reposting from old thread:

    But on the other hand, if he left because he was fed up with trying to fit in his family's box, why would he tell them? He might figure they would be so disapproving, they'd throw him out anyway, or he might just not care any more. Or maybe be afraid if they knew, they'd come after him.
     
  8. laytonian

    laytonian New Member

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    They can't throw you out, if you never moved back.

    What's the old saying? Success is the best revenge?

    Here's a thought I've never mentioned: Steven's car. Whatever kind of flex/alt fuel it is (we don't know for sure), the car is "green friendly". That's not exactly the choice of a super-conservative, especially in Utah.

    Yet there's Steven, driving a car that's more climate-friendly than most. Unless you like that type of car, you generally avoid buying something like that.
     
  9. RubyRed

    RubyRed "Keep on Truckin"

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    Can a PI find out info on ssn being used? Will the family take the offer of the PI?
     
  10. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    I didn't mean literally thrown out, I meant cut off from the family. So if he figured they're going to cut ties anyway, he may have decided to break away first. Sort of like the joke about "You can't fire me, I quit!"

    I don't think that's what happened, but it's possible.
     
  11. laytonian

    laytonian New Member

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    Without knowing where the person is working, you still have to go through tthe SS Administration. Even a subpoena or search warrant might not be possible, because there'd have to be darned good legal reason for it.

    (We really don't want the SS database to be easily cracked by PIs, hackers, etc...nor do we want our personal information available that easily.)

    Employers make their SS payments quarterly, meaning it'd be a few months before was obtainable from the system. AND if the results were zilch, you've wasted your one chance. I think it's a last-ditch communication means...and since it's one-way, you wouldn't know if it worked, if they didn't respond.
     
  12. Fairy1

    Fairy1 Divided We Fall

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    I really don't think LE needs a subpoena or search warrant to check SS activity. I think it's pretty standard with missing persons cases.

    My first post relating to this was lost at the end of the last thread, but this would be one of the first things LE would check - and I would hope check continuously in an active investigation. If someone harmed Steven and stole his identity, this would be a primary source of information.
     
  13. Pondering Mind

    Pondering Mind here a ponder, there a ponder...everywhere a ponde

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    I'm just not sure how much luck LE would have without a subpoena or search warrant. I'll have to tell a quick story to explain why I believe that way though, lol..

    10 years ago my ex was WAY behind in child support and had left the state because of an arrest warrant for non payment among other reasons. Needless to say I couldn't find him and had no clue where to look. Family Court in SC wouldn't look for him out of state (they will look IF you receive AFDC or help from the state which I did not) even though he should have been easy to find since he draws a SS disability check. (he's not disabled, he's an addict and a con :sick:) Anyway I have several friends in LE and one of them ran my ex's SS# for me which he really wasn't supposed to do but could do without getting into trouble because the x did have an active arrest warrant. Even doing that, my detective friend only came up with an address in my x's hometown in the same state and was convinced that's where he was. I even called LE there to inform them where he was and that there was a warrant for his arrest. The x NEVER was @ that addy though, he had gotten some mail there at one time, but that was it. Turns out, I found out a few years ago that he was in W Virginia all that time, but nobody could follow that disability check that would have led right to him..go figure :waitasec:..I still don't understand why these agencies couldn't work in concert with one another. Never did get the C/S either, lol. I ended up waiving it so the x could come back to SC, my youngest child was 19 by that time and was in ICU with a fluke case of pneumonia and collapsed lung and his Dr's weren't sure if he was going to live. I sure didn't want money to be the reason the x was not able to come see him, I couldn't have lived with that myself. Thank God my son did make it, his dad did move back to a different city in SC, but NEVER did come see or even call him. A$$HOLE.....:snooty:..

    Back to Stephen (sorry to get so far off track :blushing:) I'm afraid since apparently there is no evidence of a crime, the fact that Steven is a grown man and it's not against the law to disappear, that there's not much that LE can legally do without a court order anyway. The above is just my experience and maybe there is some 'loophole' that would allow LE to get around the red tape that is sometimes involved.
     
  14. carbuff

    carbuff Well-Known Member

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    I agree. Privacy regulations keep social security information under tight control and you can't use it just to find people -- the only person who is supposed to have access to the information is the person who owns the number.
     
  15. laytonian

    laytonian New Member

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    I disagree with much respect. It wouldn't do a bit of good to check "first thing" and continuously....because SS deposits are not continuous.

    SS deposits are made by employers quarterly (with a deadline a few weeks later) and then must go through the system. Even IF someone was using his SS, and the employer was legitimately handling SS contributions/deposits, they would not be attainable (at least) until May 1st.
    Checking SS "first thing" when Steven disappeared, would have told nothing.

    Then....what would you you find out? That he was employed by a certain employer (under that employer's TIN) sometime during Jan 1 2010 and Mar 31, 2010. It doesn't tell you where he is. The person's address would be considered private information.

    Ask your HR people.

    I'm kinda sorry I brought it up; I know why I did - but contacting for letter-forwarding is a one-time thing. Checking deposits is far after-the-fact.

    Anyway, IF Steven is out there and employed, don't you think he's being paid under the table? It kinda sounds like that's how he was paid by TH - in an independent contractor situation where TH has no responsibility for SS or any other taxes. Under an IE, the employee has to file "self employed" quarterly (SS contributions for employer and employee, quarterly estimated income tax, etc, etc). Betcha Steven did none of that.

    I'm glad they make it hard. Otherwise, anyone could go in and find everyone's SS records and other private info, and post it on the 'net.
     
  16. RubyRed

    RubyRed "Keep on Truckin"

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    When do you think they will have the results of the HD sighting?
     
  17. laytonian

    laytonian New Member

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    Mr Koecher went down to look at tips (plural).
    Apparently no ID from any of them.
     
  18. RubyRed

    RubyRed "Keep on Truckin"

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    The BB one didn't have a good video camera, is that right?
     
  19. laytonian

    laytonian New Member

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    According to what Steven's dad told someone, who passed it on to Naegle, that's "the word".

    I think the main point is: Steven's dad went down to look at some tapes/tips, and came away empty-handed again.

    I was going to post a comment to the last Davis County Clipper story, but my registration has become invalid over there. :furious: (It recognizes my handle, but is rejecting ALL of my email addresses required to get a new password.)

    That's a fine kettle of fish.

    If anyone else wants to register and ask if the Best Buy and Home Depot sightings are the same or different, feel free to. Just don't post a URL to our timeline, I guess. (I can't think of what other infraction I may have committed.)
     
  20. Mia

    Mia New Member

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    I did not realize it was so difficult to track someone's SSN information. So in theory, Steven could be using his SSN right now, and there's no way LE/the family could find out about it? Very interesting, although to be honest I don't think he's using his SSN, wherever he is.

    Great news about the sightings at Home Depot and Best Buy. Interesting coincidence that both sightings are independent of each other, in different cities (right? one in Las Vegas and the other in Sacramento?) but both are in parking lots of big box stores. Even if this isn't Steven, which it probably isn't, at least some people in the region are actively looking for him! I never understood why Steven's case hasn't gotten much attention; it's fascinating to us so it must have the potential to interest others. Or are we just strange? Yet Susan Powell's story has gone nation-wide, is on GMA and other national morning news programs daily, etc - even though, sadly, it's pretty obvious what happened to SP and I don't think getting the word out in the Midwest and on the east coast about her disappearance is going to help find her. I think we all know what happened there.

    All that being said, I've been pestering a few of my friends with details of Steven's case, and they keep insisting that he took off, most likely with someone else. I find their perspectives interesting because not having been 'obsessed' with this case for months, they are perhaps able to look at the original information more clearly and objectively. If Steven did run off, which I think there's a good chance he did based on all the information you all had been discussing at the end of the last thread - his lack of close friends, his image of himself as a 'misfit', his introversion in an extroverted, community/group-oriented state, etc - I don't think he would have contacted his family by now. It doesn't sound like he was all that close to them, and in fact in seems he was a bit annoyed with them, particularly his parents. It seems to me that they had a very clear image of what they wanted and expected Steven's life to be like by this point in his life, and I think Steven felt he was letting them down, and also that what would really make him happy (guitar, perhaps not marrying but remaining single) would clash with their values/expectations. For this reason, I think that if Steven did run off, which I truly hope he did, we shouldn't expect him to 'write home' anytime soon. Maybe one day, when he matures and feels like he's found his place in the world and has gained a measure of self-acceptance/confidence, he may reappear or send a letter, but until then, IF he ran off, I think he is out there 'finding himself' and experimenting with a way of life that wouldn't have been accepted in the LDS/Utah community.

    Whatever happened to Steven, I still just wish he had had even just one person in his life who was honestly able to tell him, "You're just fine the way you are" or "Give yourself a little more credit". I feel something as simple as this could have made a big difference in how things turned out for him. In all honesty, I don't think Steven DID fit in in Utah/the LDS community. That's probably why he missed Brazil so much - perhaps he felt more accepted and appreciated there. If Steven did run off, I think it was probably for the best. He needed to go some place (hey, like here in NYC for example!) where one is surrounded by different cultures and ways of life, and where he would feel free to explore spiritually, sexually, musically, socially, etc.

    ETA: Hey, did Naegle say whether the family is accepting the services of that PI who offered to do some work on Steven pro bono???
     
  21. Mia

    Mia New Member

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    Oh, and thank you to all who shared stories re the drug running done by innocents. I seriously had no idea that happened, but apparently it does? I guess I underestimated the number of very naive adults that are out there, i.e., people who would agree to deliver something for someone for a large amount of money - not knowing the person or anything about them - and NOT suspecting there is something illegal going on. Simply amazing. I wonder what happens if they are caught. Does LE buy their claim of ignorance? Or they get prosecuted to the full extent of the law?
     
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