GUILTY NY - DM, 6, & FM, 12, Huevelton, 13 August 2014 - #2

[Inthedetails]

Monday, Aug 18 article: Searching the house, gathering forensic evidence.
http://www.ogd.com/article/20140818/DCO/140818959

 

[ellabella]

Can we please remember that while there have been cases with criminals who used fetlife, there have also been cases where the criminals used Websleuths? I'd bet there are many many Fetlife users who also use websleuths(myself proudly included). Doesn't make us criminals, mentally unstable, or in need of help.

 

[Inthedetails]

I should say, also that many people on fetlife use it quite intensively, so if you're lucky you can see a lot of online activity, but I can't see anything for Nicole aside from her name, age, kink, and avatar. There doesn't appear to be too much of an organized "scene" around Hermon NY but it's entirely possible that the locals could have gathered at Steve Howells' place for parties if he had sufficient privacy. The finding of many toys and tools by police suggests this to me.

Just had an awful thought. In an article, a neighbor mentioned quite a bit of activity at the house on the abduction day. I assumed it was just the couple in preparation and/or panic moving around the property, but perhaps by "activity" he meant visitors??

 

[Judas]

Ellabella: Please don't get defensive. In this case, at least one of the perps is mounting a defense based in her own activity in the scene. That makes it relevant here.

 

[ellabella]

I wasn't being defensive, nor was I stating it was irrelevant. However since we shouldn't attribute criminal leanings to sexual abuse I'm childhood I'm not sure why the minute someone has an "alternative lifestyle" they are instantly more suspect or deserving of comments like "brain bleach". There are good decent people there that don't deserve to be ridiculed. If the comments were only directed towards the accused, this wouldn't be an issue. But it is. Every time.

 

[human]

I do not think they have done this before. They let the girls go. So unless there are other instances of strangers being let go, this is a first.

I think it is highly likely they have done things with their entourage.

We see this with child *advertiser censored*.

The victims are in the circle of people around the perps.

I think they decided to expand.

Just like often a peeper goes on to rape.

 

[blue22]

I wasn't being defensive, nor was I stating it was irrelevant. However since we shouldn't attribute criminal leanings to sexual abuse I'm childhood I'm not sure why the minute someone has an "alternative lifestyle" they are instantly more suspect or deserving of comments like "brain bleach". There are good decent people there that don't deserve to be ridiculed. If the comments were only directed towards the accused, this wouldn't be an issue. But it is. Every time.

Have I missed something? (genuine question!) As I've gone through this thread, I've not seen disgusted discussion about that community.

 

[Inthedetails]

I do not think they have done this before. They let the girls go. So unless there are other instances of strangers being let go, this is a first.

I think it is highly likely they have done things with their entourage.

We see this with child *advertiser censored*.

The victims are in the circle of people around the perps.

I think they decided to expand.

Just like often a peeper goes on to rape.

There is a case of the victims being let go. Read upthread a few posts and you'll see a link to a case in PA where a kindergarten girl was abducted from school and then released in a park one day later.

 

[ellabella]

I'm curious why others think they were released? I do t think it was some sort of conscious moral thing as much as cowardice. Although I, grateful for it. What does everyone else think?

 

[Inthedetails]

I'm curious why others think they were released? I do t think it was some sort of conscious moral thing as much as cowardice. Although I, grateful for it. What does everyone else think?

I don't think they wanted to kill anyone, so they didn't.

They did want to get some sexual pleasure from the abduction scenario so that's what they limited themselves to, imo. (And perhaps they wanted to make money off this scene as well, though who knows at this point.)

I'm guessing that the whole entire scenario - from cruising for opportunities to dropping off the girls in a safe place - was the turn-on.

JMO.

 

[blue22]

I'm curious why others think they were released? I do t think it was some sort of conscious moral thing as much as cowardice. Although I, grateful for it. What does everyone else think?

I don't think they knew what to do. They wanted the sexual thrill, but killing was not in their agenda. It would be let them go, or kill them. They could not travel with them and not be caught. I think they hoped that the girls not speaking English and a community that is isolated from our criminal system...would help them not get caught.

I don't think it was moral, at all. They didn't want to get caught with them, and they thought they probably wouldn't without them. JMO.

 

[ellabella]

I don't think they wanted to kill anyone, so they didn't.

They did want to get some sexual pleasure from the abduction scenario so that's what they limited themselves to, imo. (And perhaps they wanted to make money off this scene as well, though who knows at this point.)

I'm guessing that the whole entire scenario - from cruising for opportunities to dropping off the girls in a safe place - was the turn-on.

JMO.

Very good point, I hadn't actually thought of that. I assumed they chickened out of the who ething(being sexual abuse/rape, etc). I didn't consider that thenabduction was their intended thing not just a means to an end.

 

[PoirotryInMotion]

Just had an awful thought. In an article, a neighbor mentioned quite a bit of activity at the house on the abduction day. I assumed it was just the couple in preparation and/or panic moving around the property, but perhaps by "activity" he meant visitors??

I read that article but in the same paragraph it was talking about the gathering of forensic evidence the past 24 hours, and how he couldn't believe that was going on right next door to him. So I think it was in reference to the LE activity--because he also said all was quiet and they didn't notice anything unusual re his neighbors during the 24-hour period the girls were in captivity.

 

[Ontario Mom]

Answering my own quesion: here's an update of sorts, on the PA abduction-and-release case
http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...Remain-in-Child-Abduction-Case-246216101.html

Ironically, her civil trial starts today

 

[Inthedetails]

I read that article but in the same paragraph it was talking about the gathering of forensic evidence the past 24 hours, and how he couldn't believe that was going on right next door to him. So I think it was in reference to the LE activity--because he also said all was quiet and they didn't notice anything unusual re his neighbors during the 24-hour period the girls were in captivity.

Thank you for the clarification! I was remembering it incorrectly and should've checked first.

 

[forthelost]

For the user who was asking about where I got my stats about mothers being most likely to kill their children, I got them from the 2011 Child Maltreatment report. (There isn't a more recent one, sorry.)

And while I do think there is some evidence that abusers were abused in the past, the vast majority of people who were abused don't grow up to commit abuse themselves.

 

[gitana1]

Answering my own quesion: here's an update of sorts, on the PA abduction-and-release case
http://www.nbcphiladelphia.com/news...Remain-in-Child-Abduction-Case-246216101.html

I vaguely remember that when it happened. Was she ever tried?

I'm curious why others think they were released? I do t think it was some sort of conscious moral thing as much as cowardice. Although I, grateful for it. What does everyone else think?

Fear. They didn't want to get caught and the media attention on the case spooked them, IMO.

 

[SCHMAE]

So when she says she was his ' slave' , she may not be lying . That gives the impression that he forced her to do his bidding. But she may have been cleverly telling the truth and hoping for the misunderstanding, right?
Shame on this woman. If she is truly innocent and forced to obey him , then the girls need not testify at all and her own testimony should 100% seal the door shut on the man, right? True victims tell the truth 100% of the time, not bits and pieces. So we'll see what she has to offer up .

 

[SCHMAE]

I vaguely remember that when it happened. Was she ever tried?



Fear. They didn't want to get caught and the media attention on the case spooked them, IMO.

Actually I think that trial in PA starts today !

 

[dotr]

Commotion at the house on day of abduction might mean a cleanup, setting a 'stage', disguising recognizable furnishings, bringing in film equipment, moving livestock, pets..