Found Deceased NY - Jennifer Ramsaran, 36, Chenango County, 11 Dec 2012 - # 5

Discussion in 'Located Persons Discussion' started by imamaze, Jan 19, 2013.

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  1. imamaze

    imamaze Former Member

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    [​IMG]
    http://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf/2012/12/authorities_say_missing_woman.html
    Authorities say missing woman was on her way to shop at Destiny USA
    Syracuse, NY – Authorities are looking for a Chenango County woman who has been missing since Tuesday when she told her husband she was driving to Syracuse to shop at Destiny USA.
    She was driving a maroon 2006 Chrysler Town and Country minivan with a New York license plate of EFA1962.
    Deputies said Ramsaran may have changed her hair color and style before she left. Her cell phone was found Wednesday on State Route 23 in the Town of Plymouth.
    Deputies ask that anyone with information about Ramsaran call them at 607-334-2000 and push option 1.
    [​IMG]
    https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?...99051391.74183.212865135400495&type=1&theater
    Facebook missing page

    Social Networks
    Regarding Facebook, MySpace, Twitter, and other social networking or blog websites: Links may be used to direct posters to view something on a social networking page. But postings on social networking sites are not considered fact; they are rumor. Copying and pasting, or taking screen caps, directly from these pages is not allowed. Paraphrasing is okay. (Exception: If the Twitter or Facebook post belongs to a verified news station, it may be copied. But a link should still be provided.)
    Also, social networking pages may only be linked if they are directly related to a case, i.e. the victim or suspect. We don't want to post to someone's mother, brother, employer, milkman, or postal carrier just because they know the main player. We also NEVER link to minor's pages (unless they are the victim). And be sure that the page actually belongs to the person being discussed. Do not link to someone if you are not 100% sure it is the correct person. And if a social networking is set to private and you get in the back way, you may not post what you find. Private means private!
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    Rumors are not allowed, if you can't link to it then please don't post it here. Main stream media and law enforcement are acceptable at this time.

    Thread #1

    Thread #2

    Thread #3

    Thread #4


    Finding Jennifer

    Help Find Jennifer Facebook


    Ramsaran, Jennifer
    Lavanda Dolce
    rickblaine - verified insider
    Jilllian - verified insider

    case map



    Please continue here...
     
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  3. imamaze

    imamaze Former Member

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    A few things to remember...

    We are a victim friendly forum. This includes Jennifer as well as the rest of her family. It doesn't mean we can't discuss what is known thru the media or law enforcement and ask questions about any inconsistencies. It does mean we will not outright accuse someone or make up a scenerio not based on the facts we know at this time.

    Everyone here has a right to post their thoughts and opinions about this case without being attacked for it. This means they are not being told their opinion is 'not logical' , 'its not facing reality', etc. We are not going to accuse members here of being manipulative and we are not going to tell each other how to post or what to post. If you feel a post is against our terms of service then alert on it. Please don't respond to the the post you are alerting. It may mean you will get timed out as well.

    Be kind to each other and when posting make sure its how you expect to be treated as well. We are not on separate teams, we all want Jennifer to be found and brought home to her family. We do have insiders on this case, they may or may not be able to answer all of your questions.
    Rumors are not allowed. Discussing comments from the news, and Social Networks are not allowed, they are considered rumors. We are not going to allow fighting or discussing a fight that is or may be going on with Facebook pages. Do not bring it here.

    Lets stay focused on Jennifer. Please continue here...
     
  4. MissieMt

    MissieMt New Member

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    Finally caught up! A lot happened last night, and I'm happy JR's thread is moving again!
    I noticed it was pointed out that a lot of spouses have affairs and it doesn't result in a missing person....thank goodness for that!
    I also noticed that it was said if a spouse were permitted to have an affair, they most likely would. I feel like that is an unfounded assumption. Although the divorce rate here is very high I feel many people DO still take their vows very seriously and even if permitted, would not be able to ignore their "moral compass" which says an affair is wrong. Maybe I'm naive or old fashioned, but I think it's wrong to assume such things.
    I think we ALL (myself included) have blinders on with this case. Some people only want to see one scenario as possible, and others only want to see another completely different scenario. I think this may be doing a great disservice to Jennifer, and it makes me sad...Hence my lack of posting lately.
    I have tried very hard to see both sides, but it's hard to do when some questions go unanswered by those here who have those answers but refuse to give them because it doesn't fit in with their "blinders".
    I think we all know that statistically speaking, when a woman goes missing the husband is often responsible. I think if there were statistics on women who go missing to an unfaithful husband, we would find that the husband is found responsible even more often. I also think that if statistics were available, the times a woman "up and leaves" vs the times that a woman is intentionally disappeared by her unfaithful husband would speak volumes. And again, I would love to see statistics on women whose spouse cheats but who happen to fall victim to random crime (murder by an unknown person).
    I think the answer is in those numbers somewhere. Although we don't have solid "numbers" to back up these scenarios I encourage everyone to read some more threads on missing women here on WS with an open mind. I think in that reading you will see the numbers and it will be pretty hard to deny what happened to Jennifer.
     
  5. sreshowtime

    sreshowtime Active Member

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    thank you Fox, Piper & ORR for the landfill/dumpster info.Fox, would be interesting to know if that landfill is adequately fenced in or not, or any possible exterior entry points or not.

    It would be interesting to know if mud was found inside the van, considering it was unusually muddy on the outside.

    As far as 'something' occurring in the daytime...can someone kindly refresh me on When she was reported missing?

    In another direction- is it possible that 'hope' seemed bleak initially, but with an investigation moving forward, that facts have been discovered we are not privy to, that might give a glimmer of 'hope'?
     
  6. LadyBugSTL

    LadyBugSTL Justice For Jennifer

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    Before I retired my career(s) for health reasons, for 20 years I also worked remotely, via VPN access for a total of 3 companies, the more recent of which is very large and well known. In earlier years, I logged in via desk top or laptop and in more recent years also had the capability to login via phone.

    Depending on the companies policies, some may require you to login and out only once, when you start for the day, and then you finish work for that day; others require logging in and out for breaks and lunch. Many companies have the capability to "look in" on an employee's work session to "see" (via keystrokes or other indicators) what they are doing that very minute, however, this is very seldom utilized, (as it would not be cost effective to be monitoring every employee that closely and if you do have to monitor them that closely, why are they working remotely and not in the office or for the company at all).

    The only time "real time" monitoring would be utilized in my experience anyway, would be immediately prior to some sort of disciplinary action (pertaining to suspicion of abuse of the system, etc.) Some companies generate reports the following day or weekly to keep track of a persons production while working remotely (tracking keystrokes, items processed, etc), but again, rarely is anything utilized "live" - all that is "seen" is that you are logged into the system, not your physical location.

    As such, time can easily be manipulated to suit ones personal agenda. I personally know of people who have logged into VPN at work and then immediately left to take their kids to the doctors, dogs to their vets, who take 2 hour long lunches, who go shopping, etc. I've known people who made an ungodly amount of money by watching TV in one room, and once every half hour or hour getting up and taking 5 minutes to "work" by adjudicating a single insurance claim, and then returning to watch TV (this, in the instance of VPN with a time-out feature).

    I've known of people who've painted the entire interior of their homes and "worked" at the same time, cooked dinner, cleaned house, weeded their gardens,........ And all of the above was with desk-top or lap-top VPN access only - with VPN access via phone? The possibilities for manipulation are endless! If there is a VPN inactivity "time out" feature, a simple flip of a screen would keep one connected...

    Could one manipulate the system day in and day out and not get caught? I guess it's possible - depends on your job (see below) - however - during a 24 - 48 hour period - easily - it may never be noticed - and if he was questioned about a "lack of production" on those dates, he could claim he was worried about his wife.....

    IMO VPN and/or WebEx as an alibi, doesn't hold water - nothing solid about it - more like a sieve, if you ask me?

    (BTW - I'm *not stating that everyone with VPN access does the above or that I have done this myself, I have not (have been tempted!) - I know that there are wonderful people who work better at home w/VPN than they do in office (myself included) - however, I assisted in founding the "work-at-home remote" program for each of these companies and when production numbers indicated we might have a problem w/a few folks seriously abusing the privledge (for weeks on end), I was asked to do footwork and investigate (because I do that too) hence the examples above.)

    Sorry, didn't mean for this to be so long.....
     
  7. enzeder

    enzeder New Member

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    BBM - JR was reported missing about 8 p.m. on Dec. 11.

     
  8. sreshowtime

    sreshowtime Active Member

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    Thanks enzeder. okay then, I will assume the father was at home with the children after school and on into the evening /night then. And might assume he did not 'go out' looking for her after that reported time???

    A cursory aerial view for the landfills doesn't seem to indicate a covert way in 'after hours', hmm, or during,unless someone local just happens to know the ways around in there better.
     
  9. Bettylou4you

    Bettylou4you New Member

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    A timeline would help. When did the kids leave? When did GR go running? When did he pick up the kids? what did he do that evening? How was he both working from home and out running? There are really no definitive timeline events except him being seen in the sauna and the kids leaving. Everything else, including JRs plans to go to the mall are from him. lavonda cites his air tight alibi. That raises flags with me. Most days i am all over the place and would have a tough time accounting for my activities in an 'airtight' way. Sure I have a routine, but its mostly my word that i was where i said for the whole day. It raises flags with me that someone with such a fluid and independent schedule like GR happens to have an Airtight alibi for the whole day his wife goes missing. Why did he go running in the middle of a day when he is saying he was logged in to various work accounts. I want to see a timeline of that whole day, but the info just is not out there.
     
  10. nursebeeme

    nursebeeme Registered User

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    Ladybug, thank you for that info on VPN. My SIL currently works from the cloud and has described the same type of situation.

    If she has something she "has" to do she told me that she creates a meeting that only she is invited to and takes her child to the doctor, etc (she does not abuse it lol.. this is just an example)

    She further told me (as you are describing) that it is very easy to appear you are up in the cloud working away while you really are not.

    Onto another topic: I saw it asked a few times on the last thread but not answered: were Jennifer's parents/her family at this event?
     
  11. Sharoneonta

    Sharoneonta New Member

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    Where does the elderly gentleman that she was working for live?
    Does he have any family in the area?
     
  12. fringles

    fringles New Member

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    Respectfully snipped...

    This is a great point!

    We have him driving the kids to school, heading out jogging, going to the sauna, possibly picking the kids up (?) and presumably from five or six getting worried about Jen. That's not a lot of time to be working - so I guess we either presume he didn't have a lot on and his employer was ok with him taking some hours off, or he was using the VPN the way it's been suggested people could, ie fairly loosely.
     
  13. Tennlyn

    Tennlyn New Member

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    Thinking about the timeline:
    Looks like sunset was about 4:30 pm that day. I wonder if Dad cooked dinner or ran out to pick-up something after the kids got home.

    And yea, I'm also still wondering how much interaction the kids had with Mom that morning. Was it ever clarified if Jennifer was up and around before they left for school, or did she sleep in?
     
  14. Caring4Many

    Caring4Many Verified Insider-Rose Marie Gayhart Case

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    BBM
    I think having an airtight alibi on the day a loved one goes missing versus any other normal day is telling. I honestly would look at the situation different had someone said "He normally runs when the kids get out of school (or after work hours)but since Jennifer planned to be gone past then he'd decided to break routine that day to not miss his run because he'd be picking them up, getting dinner ready or helping with homework, etc"

    As for the VPN & Webex issues I think it really comes down to whether the person using these things as an alibi is running the meetings or simply attending. For example, a Project Manager has calls that they run to obtain project status in which they are conversing with others. But there's also staff meetings or company calls that are required by employees that you simply listen in on. Ones that would require a person to do the conversing could attribute to an alibi although couldn't attest to who you were with. If that makes any sense.
     
  15. Bettylou4you

    Bettylou4you New Member

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    Interaction with the kids that morning: if she were planning on running away, or harming herself she would know that was the last time she would see them. As a mother, that would be an intensely emotional and heartbreaking moment. How could you do it? Then wait a couple of hours and jump in your van and take off. What did she do between the time the kids left and when she left? How could you live those last hours in your home knowing you were running off never to see your kids again. I know i wouldn't be able to hold it together, nor would anyone i can imagine.
     
  16. Caring4Many

    Caring4Many Verified Insider-Rose Marie Gayhart Case

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    :goodpost::goodpost:
    :goodpost:

    I don't know how I never thought of how this would go, it's a fabulous point.
     
  17. sreshowtime

    sreshowtime Active Member

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    ^^ yes good point to consider

    Unless, and I do not mean this disrespectfully, she had already detached emotionally and had become devoid of showing any type emotion
     
  18. epiphany

    epiphany Active Member

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    Yes. I wonder what GR said Jennifer was doing prior to leaving at about 10:30 AM, but after he returned home from driving the children to school.

    For example, did Jennifer take a shower that morning? Did she straighten her hair before she left?

    Did she exercise for a brief time in the well-equipped home gym prior to getting ready to leave?

    What was Jennifer doing in the home prior to giving GR that kiss goodbye on his cheek?
     
  19. LadyBugSTL

    LadyBugSTL Justice For Jennifer

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    You're welcome! If I may ask, how many times has your SIL worked through an break rather than taking one, or lunch? If its as many times as I did, it's lots and more than justifies the time she took in taking her child to the doctor - the people that I was asked to investigate were continually manipulating the system, almost on a daily basis, for months. And (LOL) I never said I didn't streeeeeettch the privledge a bit every so often - the last 8 years all I had to do was log-in and log-out once. All that mattered was that I made production on a weekly basis (and I was strictly held to that). So, if there was a day I wasn't feeling well, mid to late in the week, and knew I'd already made production for the week - there were a couple of days where I "may" have slipped an extra 15 min break in there or worked at a much reduced rate........ :angel:

    There is so much opportunity for a persons time to be spent in nearly any manner he chooses.....to get anything they want accomplished, accomplished....

    As to if Jen's parents/sisters attended, I believe I read either on the Help Find or previous thread that they did not attend, will look to see where I read it......
     
  20. Bettylou4you

    Bettylou4you New Member

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    Tennlyn, my post was jumping off your point, i forget to quote your post!
     
  21. PAHouseWifey

    PAHouseWifey New Member

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    OMGosh! My head is spinning...so much great brainstorming going on here!

    I thought the Lavonda's discovery about the mud near where the phone was found was very interesting. Especially, if it is true that there was supposed to be a search in that area that GR opposed to.

    Also, I have agreed with Lavonda about the importance of sending the message to the person who is missing that it is OK to come home, you are loved and missed. However, I think GR and ES have sent a much different message through their actions. Actions do speak louder than words. How loved was Jennifer???

    <Mod Snip>
     
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