OH OH - Brian Shaffer, 27, Columbus, 1 Apr 2006 #5

[itsrak]

I appreciate your comments and input on the construction site given your background knowledge; however, this is an example of what I am referring to in my earlier post. I think it is a misstep to assume that “ruling out” the construction area (if we want to call it that) means there are no other plausible theories that end in Brian being “entombed” in the building somewhere. None of the three possibilities you outlined mention this as a possibility.

For example: what about the roof? This actually came up recently on a well-known true crime podcast. One of the hosts asked about the roof, and the only answer anyone could come up with was along the lines of “I have to imagine they searched there.” But could CPD have done a quick cursory search early on, when they felt it was unlikely he was there (understandably so) and just missed him? I think it’s possible.

To be clear, I’m not suggesting that Brian Shaffer’s skeleton is just hanging out in full view on the roof. While the bar was small, the building itself is not. It houses an entire movie theater and other businesses. There are crevices. There is duct work (we have seen missing people later found in duct work—see: Jamie Minor). In fact, if you look at Google Earth, there are some weird angles where the two subunits of the building are conjoined. Could he have gotten wedged somewhere? Drunk people do weird things.

There was a stairwell located near where Brian was last seen on camera. Does it provide access to the roof? Is anyone familiar with the building layout to know how one would get up there? There has to be some way. A door can be seen on the aerial view.

If I were taking over this case, the first thing I would do is extensively search the roof and all crevices/duct work etc. even if it was searched before. I know it’s a long shot, but where else on this planet could you search so easily and have any greater chance of finding him?

I am sure there are other highly unusual places within the building structure that Brian could have ended up in a very strange accident as well. I agree the “buried in concrete” theory seems unlikely—maybe even distracting from all the other places in the building he could have ended up. But my point is: let’s not dismiss other possibilities that end in the bar without getting buried in concrete.

I've never even heard anyone make the case for 'buried in concrete'. In fill under concrete would certainly seem possible. As would crevice in this non-square complex. Duct work, sure. Dead space, sure. Maybe even tunnels. Roof, sure. I was in DC for many years, and recall the case of a drunk male partying at a bar in an old brownstone type building near Ford's Theatre, got up on the roof, and stumbled, slipping into crevice between two buildings. Body hung there, so tightly wedged they probably couldn't even scream for help, for many years. When they found him, his skeletonized remains still had his id on him. Never have been able to find a link for that case. Yeah, the fact remains that there is only one place on the planet that could be searched with a greater than infinitesimally tiny chance of finding the remains of Brian Shaffer - the Gateway Complex. What would be the best interview ever on this case would be interview with construction foreman and members of construction crew and building owner OSU's main guy on the project back in '06. Never happen. The Hurst interviews were certainly interesting, when he speculated that Brian entered the construction zone, and described the construction zone as 'completely dug up'. But a group interview of the construction guys would be fascinating. Like this guy, for one:

Would love to hear this guy - and the other guys - explain why there is no way in $*%%#^# that Brian Shaffer's remains are in the complex, why the stench wasn't his body decaying, why they are absolutely sure that Brian got out, what compelled Hurst to suggest that the construction area was not well secured ....

 

[XPh]

For the record, I do think Clint is likely witholding some information, but it doesn't necessarily have to be ground-breaking, smoking gun information that could solve the case.

For example, maybe he's been asked about his last conversation with Brian and refuses to talk about it because it may not have been pleasant or friendly. We know from Detective Hurst that they argued that night over something. For example, suppose Brian's last words to him were something like

"*advertiser censored** you and never speak to me again you piece of s***!"

If that's the case, Clint could feel that by telling the media or the police this, it could raise more suspicion around him or otherwise complicate the case. Seems pretty minor to most people, but an attorney could advise their client to not talk about stuff like this because it can certainly get twisted into something else.

(My opinion only).

100% agree with this.

I also think it’s quite possible that someone knows something illegal was happening that night (drugs, for example) but wants to remain silent about it. “Someone knows something” doesn’t necessarily mean that knowledge is about foul play, or that it’s direct knowledge about what happened to Brian. Purely speculation, MOO.

 

[XPh]

I've never even heard anyone make the case for 'buried in concrete'. In fill under concrete would certainly seem possible. As would crevice in this non-square complex. Duct work, sure. Dead space, sure. Maybe even tunnels. Roof, sure. I was in DC for many years, and recall the case of a drunk male partying at a bar in an old brownstone type building near Ford's Theatre, got up on the roof, and stumbled, slipping into crevice between two buildings. Body hung there, so tightly wedged they probably couldn't even scream for help, for many years. When they found him, his skeletonized remains still had his id on him. Never have been able to find a link for that case. Yeah, the fact remains that there is only one place on the planet that could be searched with a greater than infinitesimally tiny chance of finding the remains of Brian Shaffer - the Gateway Complex. What would be the best interview ever on this case would be interview with construction foreman and members of construction crew and building owner OSU's main guy on the project back in '06. Never happen. The Hurst interviews were certainly interesting, when he speculated that Brian entered the construction zone, and described the construction zone as 'completely dug up'. But a group interview of the construction guys would be fascinating. Like this guy, for one:

Would love to hear this guy - and the other guys - explain why there is no way in $*%%#^# that Brian Shaffer's remains are in the complex, why the stench wasn't his body decaying, why they are absolutely sure that Brian got out, what compelled Hurst to suggest that the construction area was not well secured ....

Yes. To all of this.

There are many possibilities within the complex beyond just the construction area. Things get missed in searches. Drunk people do strange things and can end up in weird places.

Here is what frustrates me most. There seem to be two camps when it comes to Brian theories: those that believe he could still be in the complex somewhere, and those that think that’s impossible and that he clearly left before whatever happened. But regardless of which camp you’re in, there’s only one place on Earth you could have a look now and have an actual real chance of finding any relevant information, and that’s inside that building. No matter which theory you think is most likely, I think we can agree on that. You can’t just go search the entire rest of the outside world....but you can have another look at that building.

I do not like to criticize law enforcement at all, bc I ultimately realize I’m not in their line of work and they are likely privy to other information I don’t have. But at the same time.......just have a look. Unless you’re actively investigating something outside of that building (like really actively investigating), then go back and see if you find something, no matter how small. There are new detectives and fresh perspectives to take a look at things. Not an expert, but there has to be some sort of new technologies or new techniques that weren’t available in 2006.

I just wish LE would do something. Release some new information to see if it triggers something, check out the roof of that building....just something. Once again, totally realize there may be more going on that meets the eye, but this case seems cold as cold can be. Even a longshot is better than nothing. MOO.

 

[aThousandYearsWide]

The only thing that makes sense to me (sorry if it has already been mentioned; I couldn't read all 5 threads) is what happened to Donna Payant and she went missing from a maximum security prison she worked at. She was murdered and put in a trash bin that was brought to the dumpster. Since they have security footage of everyone leaving I would believe the answer lies with someone that left after he went back in. An employee even who would have access to the bar's kitchen trash cans, etc. Sorry if these thoughts have already been speculated.

 

[Ozoner]

The only thing that makes sense to me (sorry if it has already been mentioned; I couldn't read all 5 threads) is what happened to Donna Payant and she went missing from a maximum security prison she worked at. She was murdered and put in a trash bin that was brought to the dumpster. Since they have security footage of everyone leaving I would believe the answer lies with someone that left after he went back in. An employee even who would have access to the bar's kitchen trash cans, etc. Sorry if these thoughts have already been speculated.

An accidental death in the construction area stands out as the most likely solution, but there are other possibilities. Foul play is one. He may have stumbled into the construction area and witnessed something that someone didn't want him to witness.

 

[XPh]

The only thing that makes sense to me (sorry if it has already been mentioned; I couldn't read all 5 threads) is what happened to Donna Payant and she went missing from a maximum security prison she worked at. She was murdered and put in a trash bin that was brought to the dumpster. Since they have security footage of everyone leaving I would believe the answer lies with someone that left after he went back in. An employee even who would have access to the bar's kitchen trash cans, etc. Sorry if these thoughts have already been speculated.

I agree that it is possible that Brian possibly sadly ended up in a dumpster—either through foul play or drunken misadventure. If that happened, I would learn toward drunken misadventure over foul play. If it were foul play, I think it’s likely someone would have seen/heard something, someone would have come forward, etc.

I believe (might be wrong, can’t remember) a landfill search was done and turned up nothing. Obviously they could have missed him. They were also searching in dumpsters as early as Monday, although that doesn’t guarantee they weren’t too late.

The reason I lean toward a building mishap is that it neatly explains the fact that he isn’t seen leaving. I think ending up in a dumpster is 2nd most likely. The 3rd most likely outcome is ending up in a car near Wendy’s and meeting foul play. I rank them that way based on the number of unlikely occurrences/assumptions that would need to be true to lead to that outcome. All just MOO.

I think the unfortunate part about the dumpster theory is that I imagine there is little they could do now. I’m not an expert on landfill searches, but I imagine 15 years later it’s highly unlikely anything could be found. If that is what happened to Brian, I am afraid we would truly never find out.

 

[King91]

I too believe misadventure. If in fact, Brian is deceased, I wouldn’t be surprised if remains are found not far from the UTS. Perhaps within a few mile radius and in a place that nobody ever thought to look. I know they are two different cases but I can’t get over the fact that Joshua Maddux was missing for 7 years only to be found less than a mile from his home.

In a chimney, of all places.

However, we can’t rule out any possibility. The phone pings in the 30 days that CPD pinged his phone are really interesting to me.

 

[drama_farmer]

I too believe misadventure. If in fact, Brian is deceased, I wouldn’t be surprised if remains are found not far from the UTS. Perhaps within a few mile radius and in a place that nobody ever thought to look. I know they are two different cases but I can’t get over the fact that Joshua Maddux was missing for 7 years only to be found less than a mile from his home.

In a chimney, of all places.

However, we can’t rule out any possibility. The phone pings in the 30 days that CPD pinged his phone are really interesting to me.

I've been leaning towards the "misadventure" side of the fence, and if I were looking for circumstantial evidence to support that theory, I would point out the possible significance of the date: April Fool's Day. Imo

 

[velvta]

I find it hard to believe that the police would have not searched the building to their satisfaction. There have been no public complaints from them that the building was not searched sufficiently enough and that they're being blocked from doing a more thorough search, either by the building's owners or from within the CPD for legal or budgetary reasons. The building has been searched, and Brian's body is not in it.

 

[XPh]

I find it hard to believe that the police would have not searched the building to their satisfaction. There have been no public complaints from them that the building was not searched sufficiently enough and that they're being blocked from doing a more thorough search, either by the building's owners or from within the CPD for legal or budgetary reasons. The building has been searched, and Brian's body is not in it.

Searching to their satisfaction isn’t the same as guaranteeing they didn’t miss something. Especially when the search occurred at a time when they were likely eager to expand their search outward from the building (and understandably so).

 

[itsrak]

I find it hard to believe that the police would have not searched the building to their satisfaction. There have been no public complaints from them that the building was not searched sufficiently enough and that they're being blocked from doing a more thorough search, either by the building's owners or from within the CPD for legal or budgetary reasons. The building has been searched, and Brian's body is not in it.

Dogs fail. Humans fail. Happens all the time.

 

[itsrak]

Dogs fail. Humans fail. Happens all the time.

Had investigators somehow on the morning of Monday, April 3, 2006, foreknown that Brian Shaffer would never be seen again, never a single credible sign of life, his body would never be found outside the complex, would they have searched the complex harder, moved a bunch of dirt in the 'completely dug up' construction area? Would Randy Shaffer, somehow possessing such knowledge, have pushed harder? He would later that week essentially second-guess investigators by running dogs through right after they had. So he was pushing. His instincts were good. Did he push to have construction halted, have some dirt moved? Would he have pushed harder to have some dirt moved, more dirt moved, to try to find Brian's body inside the construction area?

 

[Hilda Swenson]

I too believe misadventure. If in fact, Brian is deceased, I wouldn’t be surprised if remains are found not far from the UTS. Perhaps within a few mile radius and in a place that nobody ever thought to look. I know they are two different cases but I can’t get over the fact that Joshua Maddux was missing for 7 years only to be found less than a mile from his home.

In a chimney, of all places.

However, we can’t rule out any possibility. The phone pings in the 30 days that CPD pinged his phone are really interesting to me.

Didn't his phone ping by fluke when his gf called it in September to a tower 14 miles north of Columbus?

 

[lonewanderer]

There was a case I read about once that reminded me this one;

A Hispanic man was considered missing for a number of years (10 or so) and his body was discovered behind the shelves of the restaurant (or maybe it was a grocery store) where he worked when the establishment was doing renovations.

I can't remember if he starved to death, suffocated, or was crushed. If I remember correctly, his circumstances where a little different. He was the only one in the store at the time, and the store was closed for the (maybe extended) weekend.

Either ways, just reminded me a little of this. He was searched for extensively and it was never thought of to look in that specific place.

 

[aThousandYearsWide]

There was a case I read about once that reminded me this one;

A Hispanic man was considered missing for a number of years (10 or so) and his body was discovered behind the shelves of the restaurant (or maybe it was a grocery store) where he worked when the establishment was doing renovations.

I can't remember if he starved to death, suffocated, or was crushed. If I remember correctly, his circumstances where a little different. He was the only one in the store at the time, and the store was closed for the (maybe extended) weekend.

Either ways, just reminded me a little of this. He was searched for extensively and it was never thought of to look in that specific place.

I remember that case! It was a grocery store and I believe he was found behind the freezers on the employee's only side. I think everyone was in awe no one smelled anything after all that time.

**Edit** I found that case! 10 years after he disappeared, Iowa man is found dead at vacant store where he used to work: Police

Update** I remember there being another similar death in around 2017/18. I remember it inspired a short story me and an ex were writing together. Same situation, a employee in his 20's was later found deceased in the supermarket they worked at. I can't find that case but it can't be Larry because we broke up in the summer of 2018 a year before he was discovered.

 

[aThousandYearsWide]

I remember that case! It was a grocery store and I believe he was found behind the freezers on the employee's only side. I think everyone was in awe no one smelled anything after all that time.

**Edit** I found that case! 10 years after he disappeared, Iowa man is found dead at vacant store where he used to work: Police

Update** I remember there being another similar death in around 2017/18. I remember it inspired a short story me and an ex were writing together. Same situation, a employee in his 20's was later found deceased in the supermarket they worked at. I can't find that case but it can't be Larry because we broke up in the summer of 2018 a year before he was discovered.

FL - FL - Frostproof, AdmixMale UP10251, 17-23, found hanged behind market, Jan'93
I found the case I was thinking of. No wonder I couldn't find it; they are still unidentified.

 

[george14]

It’s possible he is at the site, but I doubt it. This is a very high profile case. I would assume they have checked diligently.

However, there are a few posters on this forum who make it a point to mention the fact that Brian “must be” at the bar still. They allude to it in every single post.

 

[itsrak]

It’s possible he is at the site, but I doubt it. This is a very high profile case. I would assume they have checked diligently.

However, there are a few posters on this forum who make it a point to mention the fact that Brian “must be” at the bar still. They allude to it in every single post.

Me, I don't think he is at the bar. I think his remains may well be in the Gateway complex that once housed the bar, several other business, and an under-construction grocery. There is no evidence he ever left the complex. He still may have, but I doubt it.

 

[Falkner77]

It’s possible he is at the site, but I doubt it. This is a very high profile case. I would assume they have checked diligently.

However, there are a few posters on this forum who make it a point to mention the fact that Brian “must be” at the bar still. They allude to it in every single post.

*EVERY*
Single.
Post.

 

[lonewanderer]

I am not sold that he is still in the bar, but also not entirely sold he made it out of the bar.

The one thing that makes me think he left the bar is the cell phone ping miles away from the bar.