Identified! Oh - Eastlake, Whtmale 454umoh, 70, Alias 'jnchandler Iii', Jul'02 - Robert Ivan Nichols

Discussion in 'Identified!' started by iNTERESTEDWOMAN, Aug 12, 2007.

  1. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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  2. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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    I'm not sure about the likeness on this guy, but he had been around the Navy and with prison credit for good time, could have been out by the time the chandler false ID was obtained. He also seemed to want to settle into a life before he was picked up on the wanted poster, assuming he divorced while in prison?

    George ben Edmonson. For some reason I can't paste my links. Will try to paste separately.
     
  3. Cymro

    Cymro Active Member

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    I agree he looks dead on for the age regression, but Alson Wahrlich appears to be deceased.

    www.findagrave.com/cgi-bin/fg.cgi?page=pv&GRid=133500534&PIpi=106205179

    [​IMG]
     
  4. Ambercat

    Ambercat Well-Known Member

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    We can rule out Frank Freshwater -- he's been found alive in Melbourne, FL.

    frankfreshwater1959.jpg frankfreshwater2015.jpg

    http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/breaking-news/os-frank-freshwaters-shawshank-ohio-fugitive-20150505-story.html

    http://www.floridatoday.com/story/news/crime/2015/05/05/brevard-deputies-arrest-fugitive-who-escaped-in-1959/26916305/

    It sounds like he was living on the other end of town (Eau Gaille) from where Mr. Ambercat and I were living when we were in Melbourne and I don't think we ever ran into him. Honestly, I seriously doubt that I would have recognized him.
     
  5. Kentuckiana

    Kentuckiana New Member

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    Let me get some opinions on this. I've always been completely fascinated with these two cases, but it never occurred to me to compare them with each other. Let me begin by saying that I have always favored a mob connection to the Tammen disappearance. He was a musician, held a musician's union membership and both his home town and the area around southwest OH and northern KY (especially Newport, KY) were areas where the mob was making major inroads at that time. As a musician playing gigs around his home town and around SW Ohio, he could have easily come in contact with that element or have seen something he shouldn't have seen, or even gotten a glimpse of a lifestyle that ultimately held some appeal for him. I always felt that he went to the coroner for the blood type test because he was worried that something might happen to him and he wanted his blood type in the hands of the county coroner, just in case. It could have been fear, because of something he knew that he should not have known, or it could have been because he was contemplating a different life and recognized the inherent dangers that came with it.

    There was a great deal of talk about the investigation of Tammen's disappearance being totally FUBAR'ed by the police. There was the housing director of MU who said he was certain he saw Tammen in NYC in the company of two other men and that Tammen was making extended, but expressionless eye contact with him at the restaurant. This gentleman also said he reported the sighting to an MU official who never passed it on to the authorities. I've also heard murmurs that, initially, MU tried to keep the disappearance hushed up. That came from one of Tammen's house mates. An investigator questioned why the FBI jumped in on the investigation of his disappearance. A second investigator said there were rumors that he could not get in to.



    Now, all that being said, here are some correspondences between the two: Very close in age, the height and weight works, check out the squared chin, thin lips, the shape of the brows, shape of the hairline, cheek bone structure, hair color (both were brown). Even though Chandler's driver's license says his eye color was gray, in all the pics of him currently posted, they look quite brown, as was Tammen's. Now the one thing about Chandler that has always looked bizarre to me was his nose. He has an extremely wide septum (the tissue and cartilage that divides the nostrils). I question whether the man had a nose job or nose fracture(s) in the past. Tammen was on the wrestling team. They believe Chandler was connected to the Navy. Tammen was in the Navy ROTC. Tammen had been a business major at the time of his disappearance. Chandler dabbled in stocks and bonds, which I find a bit unusual given that everyone around him took him for a simpleton with a gift for engineering. Chandler had a connection to California and, according to him, he lived in Florida at one time. He says on his apartment application that he has a brother in Colorado and a sister in Ohio. Tammen's father moved to Florida after his mother died, his brother relocated to California, and his sister remained in Ohio. I thought I had seen a reference to one of his brothers being in Colorado at one time, but now I can't find it. I'm not sure when Tammen's last brother passed away, but the sister is the only surviving member of his immediate family. Is it possible that he wanted to be near family but not close enough to endanger them or have them find out he was still alive? His sister is in Ohio, and that is where Chandler finally died. I believe that, by that time, she was already the only surviving member of the Tammen brood. Chandler settles in Eastlake, which is only 27 miles from Tammen's childhood home of Maple Heights.

    Of course, even this would be just part of the story. If they are one and the same, he was living a very different life between '53 and '77 or '78 when he decided he wanted things to get a lot quieter in his life.

    Oh, and when Chandler is invited to a costume party that no one thought he would attend, he shows up decked to the nines as a gangster.

    Ronald H. Tammen, Jr.
    John Doe known as Joseph Newton Chandler III
     
  6. Kentuckiana

    Kentuckiana New Member

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    We need to consider, too, how this Doe, in the era before the internet, got so much accurate information on Joey Chandler. When you consider that Joey's mother was from Buffalo, NY and his father was from Weatherford, TX and his mother's family still lived in NY at the time of the car accident, how did he know so much genealogical information in order to fill out the request for the birth certificate? South Dakota is not exactly close to Texas. Cleveland, on the other hand, is quite close to Buffalo, NY. If he knew this information because of a family connection, I believe he is most likely connected to the Kaaber side of the family.

    The other possibility is that he was provided this data by someone with access to government computers. One of the Tammen theories is that Tammen was recruited by the CIA or the FBI for deep undercover work. I find it a bit odd that every single fingerprint of this Doe was too smudged to use out of a book that he had read. That is one hell of a convenient coincidence. If, on the other hand, the very people entrusted to hide you are also the same people trying to ID you, they could arrange to make that happen. I'm not convinced that the Doe was a good guy. He may have turned some states evidence in return for witness protection and no prosecution. Unless he has a family connection to Joey Chandler, I think it almost has to be that the government provided him with the info he needed to become Joey Chandler.

    As soon as I am able to get into Ancestry, I am going to do some research on the Kaaber family and the Tammen family to see if those two cross paths at all. I'm also going to try to find out if any Kaaber-associated surnames can be linked to any high profile crimes.
     
  7. ice190

    ice190 New Member

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    I like your idea but I thought somewhere Tammen had been ruled out.

    It's a possibility he could have been a truck driver or worked in the railroad industry.
     
  8. Kentuckiana

    Kentuckiana New Member

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    I did spend time on a genealogy website yesterday looking through both family histories. Lo and behold, the Chandler family has a lot of old photos posted and one branch of that family has that nose with the really wide septum, the deep space between the nose and the upper lip and the elongated ears. In some of them it is more pronounced than in others, but several of the girls have it very strong. They would be first cousins once removed to the little boy's father. The boy's paternal grandfather was a brother to their paternal great grandfather. The thick-septum nose appears to have come from their paternal great grandmother as only that branch of Chandlers seems to have it but it shows up in several of them. I think he was a Chandler, possibly through his mother.
     
  9. Earth

    Earth Well-Known Member

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    It's worth a check.
     
  10. Ambercat

    Ambercat Well-Known Member

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    I was looking through the Washington State Department of Corrections Escaped Offenders Most Wanted (http://www.doc.wa.gov/mostwanted/escapedoffenders.aspx) and noticed an escaped convict named Stanley Dee Rose who reminded me of the faux Joseph Newton Chandler III.

    stanrose_front.jpg stanrose_side.jpg
    http://www.doc.wa.gov/mostwanted/Offender.aspx?DocNum=118079&Name=ROSE,%20Stanley%20Dee&type=e

    Although the WA DOC describes Stanley Rose as being 5'5", I was able to locate an old article (09/15/1958) describing Mr. Rose as 5'7". It sounds as though Mr. Rose has a history of criminal behavior and using aliases since he was 17. His hair looks darker in the photo than what I would consider blond but that is just IMO. portangelessep151958.jpg

    While I'm not sure if it could be mistaken for a hernia (repair?) scar, at the time of his apprehension for a jewelry store robbery in 1970, Mr. Rose was shot in the lower abdomen and required surgery to have the .38 caliber bullet removed and repair perforations in his small intestine. Also, while he was incarcerated, he studied at Walla Walla Community College then Washington State University through some sort of prison extension program. I wasn't able to find out what he studied, though, so I don't know if it was anything remotely close to electronics or drafting.

    Although the warrant for his arrest is dated October 7, 1980, I was able to locate an article about him escaping in the Walla Walla Union Bulletin dated Friday August 4, 1978 stating that Stanley Rose, a Washington State Penitentiary inmate, had escaped from the prison work release program at the University of Washington Seattle and was reported missing the previous Tuesday (August 1, 1978) at 9 PM. Then it seems as though Stanley Rose drops off of the face of the earth; prior to this, it seemed as though he was regularly in Washington state newspapers for reasons relating to his incarceration. wallawallaaug4_1978.jpg
     
  11. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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    This seems like a very good possibility. I think there are strong resemblances with rose. I just wonder about the age. Not sure it's right.

    I also started thinking of the Vietnam era and navy deserters. I found the following navy ensign that went missing. Although his family believes he was murdered, a court found that the suspect was coerced into a confession. He I think his photo also has resemblances, particularly the eyes, which I have been looking for.


    http://www.arlingtoncemetery.net/almuns.htm
     
  12. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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    This seems like a very good possibility. I think there are strong resemblances with rose. I just wonder about the age. Not sure it's right.

    I also started thinking of the Vietnam era and navy deserters. I found the following navy ensign that went missing. Although his family believes he was murdered, a court found that the suspect was coerced into a confession. I think his photo also has resemblances. I should note that the suspect later pled when a court of appeals upheld the confession. I think he looks a lot like him though.

    http://www.arlingtoncemetery.net/almuns.htm
     
  13. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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  14. Ambercat

    Ambercat Well-Known Member

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    John Newton Chandler III's was born on 03/11/1937; Stanley Dee Rose's birthday is 11/21/1941. There's roughly a four year difference.

    I don't think Vietnam era servicemen's prints are in available in a computer database just because of how long it took the LA County Coroner to ID Buddy Stuart (IMO). I really do wish that there was more information available about people believed to have gone AWOL during the 1970s to early 1980s but that has to do with trying to ID Randy Kraft's unidentified victims.
     
  15. Tulessa

    Tulessa Well-Known Member

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    What a fascinating thread!
     
  16. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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    N
    I keep coming back to the picture of this man. It's those eyes that I keep coming back to, but as I look closer at the picture, everything else seems right on to me... The nose is right, the facial structure, the mouth, and particularly the chin right down to where indentations or shadows appear on the chin, and the chin shape. I know his family wants to consider him exhonorated and considers him deceased, but what if they're wrong? I don't believe they'd ever cooperate with DNA and theyd have to exhume the UID to do it.

    Had anyone else here examined his photo closely?t


    Note: I edited my previous post to say the court of appeals said the confession was not coerced but for some reason That edit doesn't show up in this repost.
     
  17. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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    I just saw that DNA tests are submitted but are not complete on the UID.
     
  18. Owutatangledweb

    Owutatangledweb Well-Known Member

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  19. lola2923

    lola2923 New Member

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  20. lola2923

    lola2923 New Member

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    A few more links to case files and other correspondence with regards to this case I have just come across..
    Case Part 1: http://www.scribd.com/doc/267598309/Joseph-Newton-Chandler-III-Case-part-1
    Case Part 2: http://www.scribd.com/doc/267598508/Joseph-Newton-Chandler-III-Case-part-2
    Case Part 3: http://www.scribd.com/doc/267598502/Joseph-Newton-Chandler-III-Case-part-3
    I do have the unedited crime scene photo links, but did not post them due to the graphic nature... I am new here and not sure what is allowed and what is not.
     

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