OH - Pike Co - 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered - 4 Wagner Family Members Arrested #87

justtrish

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2017
Messages
2,236
Reaction score
27,960
Actual Documents:


COLUMBUS, Ohio (AP) — A man who lost several relatives in the killings of eight people in southern Ohio four years ago filed a wrongful death lawsuit Tuesday against the suspects, saying he wants to be sure none of them receive financial gain from the crime.

“In my eyes, why should someone benefit from destroying other people’s lives?”

Uploaded by WOSU-TV Public Media

Thank you so very much! I'll read over there here shortly!
 

pittsburghgirl

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 30, 2005
Messages
3,339
Reaction score
6,850
If BW goes to trial, he needs to ask for a change of venue, in GW trial all the jurors were from Polk County so they possibly knew some of the victims' families and friends, they were from the community and they had to return to the community, GW was never going to be found G by a jury who lived in the community where the crimes were committed,
Years ago, a federal prosector brought a ridiculous 80+ count indictment for fraud and theft against the Allegheny County PA coroner, for stuff like using a copier for private papers and getting a ride to the airport. I said at the time that no jury in the county would convict him--because he had been a brilliant and effective coroner for decades and the charges were obviously political. Local juries are often able to cut through the BS that goes on at higher level of political and political influence. In this case, local people knew deeply the impact of these murders and could trust not just the investigators but ordinary people who testified like TC and Beth.
 

Cool Cats

Well-Known Member
Joined
Dec 21, 2018
Messages
9,090
Reaction score
64,342
Thank you so very much! I'll read over there here shortly!

No prob. I did screenshots because sometimes a poster can't get documents to download from Scribd. So this way they can still read the documents.

If you have any opinions about the civil lawsuit please post.

Do you think that this civil lawsuit will allow the victim's families to get financial gain from the Wagners?
In other words, Tony doesn't want the Wagners to profit off of their crimes but does it look to you like the victim's families will be able to seize Wagner property and money in bank accounts, etc...?

Angela owned her dad's house, there are Wagner bank accounts, the Wagners had trucks and trailers and many other various possessions.......possibly still owned some land somewhere. Billy has a trust fund.

I hope they get everything the 4 Wagner's owned from the time they were arrested. And that if any Wagner money and property went to other people, I hope the court can recover all of that for the families. If a criminal commits a violent crime against someone and the criminal knows they could be sued by their victim, it is illegal in some States for the criminal to transfer all of their money and assets to other people and the court will still seize back all of the criminal's assets for the victim.
 
Last edited:

pamelado2

Well-Known Member
Joined
Jan 17, 2017
Messages
1,190
Reaction score
1,807
All of the victims are covered in the lawsuit. It says right here, see attachment.
Tony is the estate administrator for Chris SR, Chris JR, Frankie and Hanna. Each of the other 4 victims have different estate administrators. Those 4 different estate administrators are referred to as John Doe.
Oh sorry I missed that!
 

justtrish

Well-Known Member
Joined
Apr 29, 2017
Messages
2,236
Reaction score
27,960
No prob. I did screenshots because sometimes a poster can't get documents to download from Scribd. So this way they can still read the documents.

If you have any opinions about the civil lawsuit please post.

Do you think that this civil lawsuit will allow the victim's families to get financial gain from the Wagners?
In other words, Tony doesn't want the Wagners to profit off of their crimes but does it look to you like the victim's families will be able to seize Wagner property and money in bank accounts, etc...?

Angela owned her dad's house, there are Wagner bank accounts, the Wagners had trucks and trailers and many other various possessions.......possibly still owned some land somewhere.

So I wonder if the victims could actually get some financial return from Wagner assets. Anything Jake has should go to his daughter, anything George has should go to his son. There are also 2 other children, Frankie's boy, and Hanna's 2nd child, they should also receive financial support.

I think I remember Tony saying that he wanted the children to be taken care of.

My opinion is that Wagner bank accounts should be frozen and vehicles, trailers, 4 wheelers, Angela's South Webster house, and all other Wagner property should be sold - liquidated - and the money put into trusts for the 4 children, and also, the money could even help the people who are raising the children.

I don't know, but it seems like there must be some way the families can get whatever money and assets the Wagners left behind after being arrested.

Too bad FW wasn't found guilty because we all know she is worth a fortune. Rita, in a very minor role, might not have done enough for the families to win a civil suit against her. Plus, she had to sell her land to hire an attorney and is poor according to what she said in her bond hearing.

But I do have to wonder if there is any possibility that the families could get a settlement from FW. Wishful thinking on my part.
I am not sure on what the civil case would mean. I do wonder the timing of it. It was filed 2 years from the arrests and then 5 months later Jake pleads guilty. I am curious about the charges being dropped against FW because she is listed in the civil case.

Oh and Fredricka's charges were dropped without prejudice so they can be refiled and I hope once all 4 are sentenced if there was anything more there, then I hope she is charged. I really am not a fan of the "I just didn't know" excuse for people that are so intertwined. I mean she called Billy at 11pm or so the night of the murders (I think I am remembering that time right).. maybe because he wasn't home yet and he lived with her.. but she knew he wasn't home then.. he might have just he stayed at Peterson Road.. I think it had to be odd for him to be gone from home though because why else would she call that night? Then news breaks that Chris Sr entire family wiped out and I wonder what Fredricka thought if anything then. Then she buys the bullet proof vests.

I guess it is possible she didn't connect any dots, but she was a smart business woman or at least she knew the loopholes and she seemed to do well for herself anyway. She raised Billy and had to know he had some shady dealings so what did she think of him not coming home that night.. did she call BCI to tell them it was odd.. Did she learn that Billy had just gifted his niece (her granddaughter) that truck the morning of the murders? I do think sometimes people are doing things we just don't know about, but in that family she didn't get where she is by putting her head in the sand and just not knowing what was going on around her.
 

Caylee Advocate

MY GIVE A DAMN'S BUSTED
Joined
Mar 15, 2009
Messages
4,280
Reaction score
12,772
If BW goes to trial, he needs to ask for a change of venue, in GW trial all the jurors were from Polk County so they possibly knew some of the victims' families and friends, they were from the community and they had to return to the community, GW was never going to be found G by a jury who lived in the community where the crimes were committed,
Though it may have benefitted him if the jurors were from "POLK" county (in Florida), he was stuck with PIKE county ones. ;) Perhaps you mean he was never going to be found "innocent" by a jury who lived in the community.?
 

Betty P

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
18,647
Reaction score
86,533
Now compare those dates to James being arrested for destroying the GPS (on 5/12 after agents went to retrieve the tracker) and the charges being dropped.

So Scheiderer saw the matching .22 casings when he was putting the GPS tracker on Jake's truck, not when the search was done a few weeks later.

I remember them talking around the time of the arrests/arraignments, they said something about a BCI Agent (Scheiderer) looking down and seeing something.

We always said something big happened in the investigation between the time the tracker was put on James Manley's truck on April 22 and the searches on May 12. Up until they found those casings, they were still thinking James Manley was a suspect.
 

Betty P

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
18,647
Reaction score
86,533
He said something along the line of waiting for AG Yost to make comments at a news confernce. I think he didn't want to make comments before Yost
Yost is his boss and seems to be easily riled. Yost shook up the AG's office when he took over, remember? He ordered the AG office drop the Pike County Murders case against the Wagners, implying he thought it wasn't worth the expense and effort. He had one of his assistants attend a couple of pre-trial hearings. She gave some kind of strange statement that the Ohio AG was dropping the case. JMO, Yost seems to be a prickly guy and may be in a bad mood because the prosecutor he forced out ended up getting 2 confessions and a conviction so far. Agent Scheiderer probably has to be very careful around him.

Did Yost make a comment yet? Here it is:


Ohio Attorney General Dave Yost’s Statement on George Wagner IV’s Guilty Verdicts​


11/30/2022


(COLUMBUS, Ohio) — Ohio Attorney General Dave Yost issued the following statement regarding George Wagner IV’s case in Pike County following this evening’s guilty verdicts:

This case was a test of BCI’s abilities, and BCI passed it with flying colors,” Yost said. “Today’s jury verdict puts the stamp of approval on the bureau’s work.

"I am grateful for the untold hours, days and weeks that our investigators and forensic scientists dedicated to this case – it reinforces the team’s dogged determination to secure justice for the victims and their families.”
 
Last edited:

Caylee Advocate

MY GIVE A DAMN'S BUSTED
Joined
Mar 15, 2009
Messages
4,280
Reaction score
12,772
No prob. I did screenshots because sometimes a poster can't get documents to download from Scribd. So this way they can still read the documents.

If you have any opinions about the civil lawsuit please post.

Do you think that this civil lawsuit will allow the victim's families to get financial gain from the Wagners?
In other words, Tony doesn't want the Wagners to profit off of their crimes but does it look to you like the victim's families will be able to seize Wagner property and money in bank accounts, etc...?

Angela owned her dad's house, there are Wagner bank accounts, the Wagners had trucks and trailers and many other various possessions.......possibly still owned some land somewhere. Billy has a trust fund.

I hope they get everything the 4 Wagner's owned from the time they were arrested. And that if any Wagner money and property went to other people, I hope the court can recover all of that for the families. If a criminal commits a violent crime against someone and the criminal knows they could be sued by their victim, it is illegal in some States for the criminal to transfer all of their money and assets to other people and the court will still seize back all of the criminal's assets for the victim.

JMO. What bank accounts? I would love for the families of all eight victims to get any and all monies or property these 4 monsters had/have, but I don't see it really amounting to a whole hell of a lot.

In fact IMO BW had no trust fund set up. I guess they could slip Billy some truth serum and he could tell them where all that buried money is. :rolleyes:

As far as FW and RN, I don't think that will go anywhere. All JMO.
 

Chris_p_bacon

Well-Known Member
Joined
Sep 5, 2021
Messages
160
Reaction score
1,516
Though it may have benefitted him if the jurors were from "POLK" county (in Florida), he was stuck with PIKE county ones. ;) Perhaps you mean he was never going to be found "innocent" by a jury who lived in the community.?
I could not imagine the fear the people in that community felt in the days/weeks/months after the homicides. After all the evidence the jury saw/heard I am sure they would not have felt safe in their community if George was found not guilty and released to live in that same community. I know I would not feel safe with him on the loose. Any of the Wagners for that matter. It was an enormous amount of evidence. How could anyone feel safe in their homes. I not only hope the Rhoden, Gilley and Manley familes get some semblance of justice with George's upcoming sentencing but I hope that community as a whole can now sleep better at night knowing that 3 out of the 4 Wagners (who conspired to murder 8 people in the middle o f the night, most of them sleeping harmlessly in their beds, two of them nursing children) are now on their way to prison for a very, very long time. I think it is one of the most important things in our justice system---the right to a trial by a jury of your peers.
 

Betty P

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
18,647
Reaction score
86,533
Thanks for posting this! The one I saw yesterday cut off early so I didn't see the last 10 minutes or so until this one. I know many were annoyed about the repetitive things and the testimony that kept coming up that was only Jake and Angela. I always thought it was to really hammer home how they all operated. Just because George was not smack dab in every conversation, doesn't mean he wasn't there. Just like Billy, he didn't even live in that house, but he was there. I think seeing how they have always operated was key because this wasn't a one time spur of the moment crime they committed. They had a pattern and they really were for lack of a better word "cult". Nobody was able to enter that family and become part of the core group. It was always the 4 of the against the world.

I found it interesting the prosecution said they expected George to testify because the defense wasn't able to refute what was presented any other way. I could see that too. I think the moment they called him was a shock to everyone because it seemed there were not going to be witnesses that day, but then they called him. So I think that was the surprise. Look at who the defense subpoenaed. Then look at who was called before George. They really were more like character witnesses and not anyone that could refute what was presented. Then their expert I think was a big fail. I would be upset if I were him.. he wasn't given all the evidence or information needed to even make an accurate assessment at Chris Sr house. I don't know if that was on purpose or an oversight, but it sure didn't look good for them. So the only choice they had was George.

Again, this case was not a matter of did George shoot Chris with that SKS or was it Jake. I think those charges were all related to one another also. They didn't need to decide each one individually based on all evidence. I think once they voted on one of the murder charges, then they likely were able to say he was guilty of all charges. So those questioning how it was so quick or if they took it seriously.. I don't think it was a matter of sitting down to hash out all 22 charges.. I mean even the murder charges.. if they thought he was involved, then it's guilty on all 8 and then the conspiracy and burglary, etc.

Reading the indictments when they were first handed down, I recognized how seamless and well crafted those charges were. They built their case very well, with good fallback positions. LOL, I studied the charges closely, even made a couple of spreadsheets. As you say, those charges made it easy for the jury to do their job.
 

Caylee Advocate

MY GIVE A DAMN'S BUSTED
Joined
Mar 15, 2009
Messages
4,280
Reaction score
12,772
I could not imagine the fear the people in that community felt in the days/weeks/months after the homicides. After all the evidence the jury saw/heard I am sure they would not have felt safe in their community if George was found not guilty and released to live in that same community. I know I would not feel safe with him on the loose. Any of the Wagners for that matter. It was an enormous amount of evidence. How could anyone feel safe in their homes. I not only hope the Rhoden, Gilley and Manley familes get some semblance of justice with George's upcoming sentencing but I hope that community as a whole can now sleep better at night knowing that 3 out of the 4 Wagners (who conspired to murder 8 people in the middle o f the night, most of them sleeping harmlessly in their beds, two of them nursing children) are now on their way to prison for a very, very long time. I think it is one of the most important things in our justice system---the right to a trial by a jury of your peers.

In all honesty, the fear let up maybe a month or so after these murders. People were fairly confidant that it was targeted against the family but attributed it to drugs. As more and more came out, gossip changed, but with no hard evidence to prove these rumors.. what could be done? I am just thankful it is 3/4 of the way through completion.

My thoughts are of these families and I hope to help by making their holiday a little brighter. I have a couple if things in mind. :)
 

Betty P

Well-Known Member
Joined
Oct 31, 2008
Messages
18,647
Reaction score
86,533
JMO. What bank accounts? I would love for the families of all eight victims to get any and all monies or property these 4 monsters had/have, but I don't see it really amounting to a whole hell of a lot.

In fact IMO BW had no trust fund set up. I guess they could slip Billy some truth serum and he could tell them where all that buried money is. :rolleyes:

As far as FW and RN, I don't think that will go anywhere. All JMO.

I doubt they will have a problem with RN. Once she's testified at Billy's trial, the prosecution will sign off on her plea deal. I suspect they only wanted to put pressure on her to admit what happened with the forged custody docs. She did the right thing in coming forward to help with the investigation.

With FR, JMO, they suspected she was involved in more than they could prove. They probably knew she would fight, but they didn't have enough evidence to go after her on some of the other activities she was part of.
 
Last edited:

Fat Old Man

Well-Known Member
Joined
Feb 7, 2019
Messages
105
Reaction score
830
I am not sure on what the civil case would mean. I do wonder the timing of it. It was filed 2 years from the arrests and then 5 months later Jake pleads guilty. I am curious about the charges being dropped against FW because she is listed in the civil case.

Oh and Fredricka's charges were dropped without prejudice so they can be refiled and I hope once all 4 are sentenced if there was anything more there, then I hope she is charged. I really am not a fan of the "I just didn't know" excuse for people that are so intertwined. I mean she called Billy at 11pm or so the night of the murders (I think I am remembering that time right).. maybe because he wasn't home yet and he lived with her.. but she knew he wasn't home then.. he might have just he stayed at Peterson Road.. I think it had to be odd for him to be gone from home though because why else would she call that night? Then news breaks that Chris Sr entire family wiped out and I wonder what Fredricka thought if anything then. Then she buys the bullet proof vests.

I guess it is possible she didn't connect any dots, but she was a smart business woman or at least she knew the loopholes and she seemed to do well for herself anyway. She raised Billy and had to know he had some shady dealings so what did she think of him not coming home that night.. did she call BCI to tell them it was odd.. Did she learn that Billy had just gifted his niece (her granddaughter) that truck the morning of the murders? I do think sometimes people are doing things we just don't know about, but in that family she didn't get where she is by putting her head in the sand and just not knowing what was going on around her.
If Billy really flipped out like JW said, after CRsr was dead. I bet FW could read her son well enough, to Know something was not right with his behavior. Nightmares, not sleeping, more then normal drug use. But something he could not hide from her, made even RW?
Didn't they say George was having nightmares?

Does anyone remember which one was filing something about Jail House Snitches?

I thought it might be from nightmares.

As for giving a truck to his niece, I would say this was out of Billy normal behavior. I bet he always wanted his share from Mommy, and half of RW.

All My opinions!
 
Top