GUILTY OH Pike Co., 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #62

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sunshineray

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The items in discovery can be discussed. The individuals named in the discovery outside of those charged in these crimes should not be discussed unless LE, MSM or Court Proceedings establish the connection to the case, or reveal clarity of why specific names are mentioned in the discovery.

At this time we have names associated with cell phones and we have names associated with certain records, etc. in the discovery. To discuss any of those names and why they may be listed would be pure speculation at this time and could not be cited as fact based on what has been released.

Hope that makes sense!
Yes it does and thank you for clarifying it for me. My apologies for my earlier blunder.
 

molly1255

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An article says Billy and Chris got into a physical fight 2 weeks before the murders.

The Other Acts Document says Billy pulled a gun on Chris. Wouldn't surprise me if Chris was winning the fight so Billy pulled the gun to get the upper hand.

One thing Chris had over the Wagners was the age-thing of when Hanna was 15 and Jake 19. I wonder if this explains why Jake never went to a Custody Hearing, only consulted an attorney.

The house was purchased when Hanna was pregnant with her 2nd. I think there just wasn't enough room anymore for another baby. They needed more room for the grandchildren that were now coming along, Frankie had 2 kids and it was time for different housing.

He put $30,000 down and mortgaged $30,000 using his land as collateral, Adams County land loan according to the records I saw years ago.

I don't think the house mattered to the Wagners. Why would Jake use the Rhodens crowded housing to say she's unfit when he never even had an initial Court Hearing about custody in the first place?

Besides, Hanna lived in 2 different places according to, I think it's in the Other Acts. Probably spent time back and forth with CH.

The Wagners for some reason didn't want to fight it out in court, wanted to strong arm them instead. Everyone wonders why they didn't just do what everyone does and take it to court.

We might now know why the Wagners couldn't report the grows, Billy was neck deep in his own drug running. Chris had too much on him and Billy doesn't seem like the type who lets people hold anything over him, not that Chris was holding anything over him.

With custody Chris would win, Billy lose. Billy hates losing.

Speculation

I guess I didn't see that Billy pulled a gun on CR Sr. I need to go back and look at the Other Acts doc.

JW clearly did not want to go to a Custody Hearing. There was no legal reason for the court to grant him full custody. I imagine his attorney may have told him that and he may have also told him he might be led out of court in handcuffs over the age thing. So he and his family went out and committed mass murder.

Just hideous.
 

Caylee Advocate

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If this isn't reason to keep us hanging in there, I don't know what is. :) Goodnite peeps.


Jake Wagner could receive up to eight consecutive life sentences for the Rhodens’ murders and 160 years imprisonment for the other charges.


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Tiff23fr

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Ann99

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wt

This is JMO, but I think for AW it may have been for money. I have this theory (my own pure speculation) that AW was not going to be provided for financially by the W estate after FW died. I wrote a post a while back about generation skipping trusts, and if anyone really needed one, IMO, FW and her husband really needed one with respect to the unique challenges posed by both Billy and AW.

JMO, I don't see Billy's parents thinking it would be wise to allow Billy to inherit a big chunk of anything. He failed to launch and at a minimum, he was irresponsible. And then there is AW. If they gave Billy a lot, he could die before AW, or she could divorce Billy after he received an inheritance and she could get her hands on FW's assets and blow through it all. When people who have estates (does not even have to be that large of an estate) have concerns like this, they sometimes solve them by providing their adult child with an income from the estate and that income ends when their child dies. If their child's spouse survives their child, not their problem. JMO, I think it might be possible GW4 and JW were going to come into some money, property or both when Billy died and the same may also have been true for the great-grandchildren after their fathers died.

The forged custody docs did two things, at least in AW's mind. They provided custody for JW in the event of HMR's death and they also provided that AW got custody of the children in the event of GW4 or JW's death. Note, they did not provide custody for Billy and AW, just AW. Jake got custody of the child after the murders. Why didn't AW destroy those documents? JMO, I don't think she was sloppy in not destroying those documents, but rather viewed them as "insurance" that she would get custody in the event GW4 and/or JW died. It would work like an annuity, guaranteed income for life, if she could maintain control of both her boys and her grandchildren and groom them to understand it was their job to provide for AW financially.

For JW, I don't think it was about money. I think it was because he lost control of HMR and he wanted to get even with her. JW has had nothing to do but think while he's been in jail and he's been removed from the influence of his mother for a long time. It might be possible he thought AW was on his side as she egged him on, and perhaps he's realized she was only out for herself.

I could be totally off, but this is what makes sense to me. And this is all JMO.

I agree with you. I had not thought of generation skipping trusts. Good point.
 

Ann99

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I thought they look looked very nervous, too. Imagine spending spending several years working on a defense for your client and then being faced with Jake's plea and Jake will be testifying against your client. I would never want to be a criminal defense attorney!

Once Deering adjourned the hearing, Geo4 didn't even speak to his attorneys, he just turned and walked away. Looked like anger to me.
 

sunshineray

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This is JMO, but I think for AW it may have been for money. I have this theory (my own pure speculation) that AW was not going to be provided for financially by the W estate after FW died. I wrote a post a while back about generation skipping trusts, and if anyone really needed one, IMO, FW and her husband really needed one with respect to the unique challenges posed by both Billy and AW.

JMO, I don't see Billy's parents thinking it would be wise to allow Billy to inherit a big chunk of anything. He failed to launch and at a minimum, he was irresponsible. And then there is AW. If they gave Billy a lot, he could die before AW, or she could divorce Billy after he received an inheritance and she could get her hands on FW's assets and blow through it all. When people who have estates (does not even have to be that large of an estate) have concerns like this, they sometimes solve them by providing their adult child with an income from the estate and that income ends when their child dies. If their child's spouse survives their child, not their problem. JMO, I think it might be possible GW4 and JW were going to come into some money, property or both when Billy died and the same may also have been true for the great-grandchildren after their fathers died.

The forged custody docs did two things, at least in AW's mind. They provided custody for JW in the event of HMR's death and they also provided that AW got custody of the children in the event of GW4 or JW's death. Note, they did not provide custody for Billy and AW, just AW. Jake got custody of the child after the murders. Why didn't AW destroy those documents? JMO, I don't think she was sloppy in not destroying those documents, but rather viewed them as "insurance" that she would get custody in the event GW4 and/or JW died. It would work like an annuity, guaranteed income for life, if she could maintain control of both her boys and her grandchildren and groom them to understand it was their job to provide for AW financially.

For JW, I don't think it was about money. I think it was because he lost control of HMR and he wanted to get even with her. JW has had nothing to do but think while he's been in jail and he's been removed from the influence of his mother for a long time. It might be possible he thought AW was on his side as she egged him on, and perhaps he's realized she was only out for herself.

I could be totally off, but this is what makes sense to me. And this is all JMO.
You're not off at all. It totally makes sense. FW, IMO, didn't take a shine to AW...ever. She also wasn't going to let AW get control of anything she left to her son or grandson's through attrition.

It shows how invested AW was in having control. Control of kids and the money her kids and/or grandkids would come to inherit from FW that she didn't destroy those custody documents it seems she herself forged and notarized. To me the only explanation, after being repeatedly questioned and according to her attorney harrassed by LE, is she was pathologically dwelling in her own world of self-grandeur thinking nothing will stop me. AJMO
 

molly1255

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You're not off at all. It totally makes sense. FW, IMO, didn't take a shine to AW...ever. She also wasn't going to let AW get control of anything she left to her son or grandson's through attrition.

It shows how invested AW was in having control. Control of kids and the money her kids and/or grandkids would come to inherit from FW that she didn't destroy those custody documents it seems she herself forged and notarized. To me the only explanation, after being repeatedly questioned and according to her attorney harrassed by LE, is she was pathologically dwelling in her own world of self-grandeur thinking nothing will stop me. AJMO

Thank you. It is what makes sense to me. JMO, I also don't think FW would have ever taken a shine to AW. A lot has been written about FW, but I've never seen where anyone who knows her has ever called her stupid. All JMO
 

gizmobtj

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Any thoughts on the psychology of it all? Is it something passed down thru generations or did it just develop as they seem to have their free passes for prior incidents?

It baffles me, really, that all 4 were ok with murdering 8 people. Not one had the decency to call timeout.

None of these 4 will garner an ounce of sympathy from me. I hope the guilt eats them alive and consumes their every thought. But, they are most likely depressed, angry, sad, etc... because they are finally being held accountable for being screwups. What a legacy Billy!!! MOO JMO
I think it assumes a lot to think they were all OK with murdering them. People do things they don't like all the time. That said, there are examples of American families that killed together, particularly in thr Midwest in the 1880s and there is a psychological concept of Folie a Deux that could be playing a role.

Folder a Deux
Shared Psychotic Disorder - StatPearls - NCBI Bookshelf.

Bloody Benders
Bloody Benders - Wikipedia
 

ohioexpat63

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Everything22

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Fair enough. Thanks for the info

Ohio, I totally agree with your previous post. These murders are current and evidence is voluminous to say the least. AND the killers are in custody, one of whom has already admitted guilt to all his 23 charges and has agreed to testify against the other three. Pretty convicting.

Stand your ground.

As for me, I'll assume the 4 killers knew full well what they were doing ...based on all we have learned.

RIP Rhodens and Gilley.
 
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