OH - Pike Co, 8 in Rhoden Family Murdered Over Custody Issue, 4 Members Wagner Family Arrested #69

[Covert Operative]

As we get closer to trial I thought it would be interesting if we posted a scenario of how we think the crimes happened.

Pre the last court hearing when we found out the ruse Billy used to get Chris Sr to answer door I used to think JW went to Danas home first and killed the 3 victims their, (not sure if all 3 were at her home or who went in besides JW). After last court hearing it seems logical now to assume my theory was wrong and all 3 went first to Chris Sr home, I think it didn't go to plan and all 3 were involved at his home although I still think Billy alone killed Chris Snr and Gary. I think they went to Frankies home and possibly killed him and Hannah by shooting through the window - JW killed those victims. Then they went to Danas and JW killed all 3, then went to Kenneth and I think Billy murdered him.

That is my latest attempt to try to figure out how the crimes happened, but I will probably be proved wrong at trial,

I think the order is CRsr home, FR home, DR home and then KR. I go back and forth if KR was first or last. If we can go by bladder amounts of urine then I would say last, however I know there are to many variables for that.

When they said in court that someone was killed around 12ish midnight it made me think KR was first even more at that time. I still find it somewhat strange they intended to make a shot outside at CRsr with FR being alive and possiby hearing that, or GR being inside for that matter, maybe that gun had a silencer also. They may have not thought GR was at the home that night. FR ex did not leave until 10:30ish so killing either CRsr, GR, or FR, HG around 12ish seems a little risky. They may not have known she was at the home that night so that did not play into their decision.

Not sure if the urine amounts in the badders coud be an indicator, but with other tidbits we now know, it may be. Too many variables that can account for the bladder contents/non contents to list.

 

[Covert Operative]

Thanks for checking. You do a great job with the Motions and checking the facts.

Be interesting to see how Deering rules on these Motions. I think there will be some rulings this month.

I am curious what the engineers are going to testify to.

 

[Cool Cats]

I am curious what the engineers are going to testify to.

06/07/2022	SUBPOENA ISSUED TO SCIOTO CO SHERIFF FOR SERVICE UPON DARREN LEBRUN, SCIOTO CO ENGINEER Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M
06/07/2022	SUBPOENA ISSUED TO ADAMS CO SHERIFF FOR SERVICE UPON LEE PERTUSET, ADAMS CO ENGINEER Attorney: NASH, JR, RICHARD M

Welcome to the Scioto County Engineer's Website

Darren LeBrun, PE, PS Scioto County Engineer. (Photo)​

Engineer - Adams County Government

www.adamscountyoh.gov

Main Contact: Lee Pertuset, Adams County Engineer

 

[Niner]

Thanks for checking. You do a great job with the Motions and checking the facts.

Be interesting to see how Deering rules on these Motions. I think there will be some rulings this month.

here's what I have in my notes:
Next motions hearing on 6/21/22 to hear arguments on Motions to suppress audio recordings (Motion #81-was denied) & family’s testimony (Jake & Angela’s) & dismiss the specifications (Motion #80).

 

[Cool Cats]

here's what I have in my notes:
Next motions hearing on 6/21/22 to hear arguments on Motions to suppress audio recordings (Motion #81-was denied) & family’s testimony (Jake & Angela’s) & dismiss the specifications (Motion #80).

Good. Hopefully we will hear more Motions. Trial is getting closer and there are enough Motions to fill a Wagner well/cistern. Pardon my pun.

 

[Covert Operative]

here's what I have in my notes:
Next motions hearing on 6/21/22 to hear arguments on Motions to suppress audio recordings (Motion #81-was denied) & family’s testimony (Jake & Angela’s) & dismiss the specifications (Motion #80).

My opinion, they will also ask to have the engineers at that hearing if Deering allows those two subpoenas for them.

 

[Covert Operative]

here's what I have in my notes:
Next motions hearing on 6/21/22 to hear arguments on Motions to suppress audio recordings (Motion #81-was denied) & family’s testimony (Jake & Angela’s) & dismiss the specifications (Motion #80).

I think motion 85 is suppose to be heard also. This is the one that involves them asking for certain things to be dropped because they occurred in other counties.
Preliminarily, before the presentation of evidence upon the scheduled motions, it was agreed that Defendant's Motion No. 85, entitled "Defendant's Motion To Dismiss" will be scheduled for hearing on June 21, 2022, at 1:00 o'clock p.m. It is so ordered.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Looks like the games are going to begin somewhat early. Not really surprised.

 

[Niner]

I think motion 85 is suppose to be heard also. This is the one that involves them asking for certain things to be dropped because they occurred in other counties.
Preliminarily, before the presentation of evidence upon the scheduled motions, it was agreed that Defendant's Motion No. 85, entitled "Defendant's Motion To Dismiss" will be scheduled for hearing on June 21, 2022, at 1:00 o'clock p.m. It is so ordered.

Yes, I do have that for this upcoming motions hearing. It was in the next paragraph in my notes - so I made it bold. Thanks!

 

[Covert Operative]

Yes, I do have that for this upcoming motions hearing. It was in the next paragraph in my notes - so I made it bold. Thanks!

Thanks. For some reason I did not see that in your most recent post. Not sure why. I was researching something else and saw in the court notes about motion 85. Motion 85 may have to do with the engineers, not sure.

 

[Dudly]

I think motion 85 is suppose to be heard also. This is the one that involves them asking for certain things to be dropped because they occurred in other counties.
Preliminarily, before the presentation of evidence upon the scheduled motions, it was agreed that Defendant's Motion No. 85, entitled "Defendant's Motion To Dismiss" will be scheduled for hearing on June 21, 2022, at 1:00 o'clock p.m. It is so ordered.

I don’t see any reason for County Engineers except to define county lines and show what county things did or did not happen…

 

[Gcooper829@gmail]

At Frankie's they were shot at close range with gun touching or almost touching their heads which rules out distance shooting from a window. There of course was distance shooting at Chris's.

https://www.wcpo.com/news/state/sta...reporters-to-inspect-slain-family-s-autopsies
• Rhoden family massacre: Preliminary autopsy reports reviewed

Walk into Frankie's bedroom and on the left wall is a crib, past the crib is the bed, the head of the bed is against the left wall. Frankie is on the side closest to the crib, HG on the side furthest away. They are sketched on their sides facing towards each other. Hannah is under the window.

Frankie's floor plan of entire trailer = Starts at 1:25:44 = diagram not a photo.
George's Bond Hearing Scheiderer's testimony and diagram evidence.
George Wagner request for bail denied after hearing reveals new details

I used to think just Billy and George went to Chris Sr's while Jake went to Frankie's and Dana's. But we have 2 sets of footprints which could be Jake's and George's prints according to Angela, and we have Jake shooting a 6th victim which they make it sound like he didn't die, like a wound to Chris Sr. Weird.

And then there is the drug ruse and shooting from outside. So I am sure all 3 were at Chris Sr's house and Gary was only killed because he was a witness. Some were killed only because they were there that night according to Canepa.

Only one footprint is at Dana's house and I believe only Jake was in Dana's and Frankie's with Billy and George more as lookouts, or just inside but "out of the way" of Jake shooting.

You said the diagrams of Frankie's and Hanna Gilleys was at 1:25:44 and put a link to a news article that's not even 2 minutes long. I found footage of the hearing on YouTube and it's not at 1:25:44 there either can you post a link to the diagram again

 

[Caylee Advocate]

I don’t see any reason for County Engineers except to define county lines and show what county things did or did not happen…

Agreed. Location, location, LOCATION. Tornado sirens going off like crazy right now. YIKES!!!

 

[Puzzles8]

I am curious what the engineers are going to testify to.

I am too.

These engineers appear to work for Adams and Scioto County, so I'm guessing they may be civil engineers.
In our area, civil/municipal engineers tend to plan/execute/maintain public infrastructure. They are also known to help, advise and deal with issues on private property, if those issues stem from problems with public infrastructure. I'd not be surprised if they also inspected things like septic systems, wells or cistern wells, etc.

Coincidentally, the Peterson Farm is in Adams County, the FWF is in Scioto County.

IIRC isn't there also a motion to exclude evidence from other counties?

How all of this might be related - I have no clue!
JMO

 

[Puzzles8]

Agreed. Location, location, LOCATION. Tornado sirens going off like crazy right now. YIKES!!!

Be safe

 

[Covert Operative]

I am too.

These engineers appear to work for Adams and Scioto County, so I'm guessing they may be civil engineers.
In our area, civil/municipal engineers tend to plan/execute/maintain public infrastructure. They are also known to help, advise and deal with issues on private property, if those issues stem from problems with public infrastructure. I'd not be surprised if they also inspected things like septic systems, wells or cistern wells, etc.

Coincidentally, the Peterson Farm is in Adams County, the FWF is in Scioto County.

IIRC isn't there also a motion to exclude evidence from other counties?

How all of this might be related - I have no clue!
JMO

I believe motion 85 only mentions Scioto and Adams county from what I remember. There may be another motion that I do not recall.
If for some reason the judge ruled in favor of the defense I would think the state has a remedy for that. They could probaby amend the indictmet or file the charges in the county it occurred in if it came to that.
I believe I remember RN trying that about forgery and it did not work out.

 

[Cool Cats]

You said the diagrams of Frankie's and Hanna Gilleys was at 1:25:44 and put a link to a news article that's not even 2 minutes long. I found footage of the hearing on YouTube and it's not at 1:25:44 there either can you post a link to the diagram again

You need to go to George's Bond Hearing. It is - the entire Bond Hearing - in the article 2nd photo down. Takes a minute to pop up. It shows Scheiderer on the stand.

George Wagner request for bail denied after hearing reveals new details

WAVERLY, Ohio (WKRC) - One of the four Wagner family members charged in the execution-style murders of eight members of the Rhoden and Gilley families asked the court to set bail for him. However, Judge Randy Deering denied the request from George Wagner IV after hearing two hours of testimony...

local12.com

Starting at about 1:25 Scheiderer is handed a diagram of Frankie's trailer. To see the whole trailer you need to stop on different parts while Schneider holds the diagram.

I got a very good look at Franklie's floor plan by pausing a few different times.

You come in through the front door and next to the front door on the left is the couch. To the left is a kitchen with a table and the back door is off the kitchen. To the left of the kitchen on the far left side of the house is a bedroom with a closet. Between the kitchen and bedroom is a bathroom.

When you come in the front door there is a hallway directly to the right and the first door on the left is a very small bedroom then next to that is a bathroom and then next to the bathroom on the far right side of the house is Frankie's and HG's bedroom.

Walk into Frankie's bedroom and on the left wall is a crib, past the crib is the bed, the head of the bed is against the left wall. Frankie is on the side closest to the crib, HG on the side furthest away. They are sketched on their sides facing towards each other.

On the floor plan above HG it says her first and last name and on the floor plan below Frankie it says Clarence before it cuts off. Clarence is Frankie's given name.

The outside of the house shows a window on the far right end of the house where their bedroom is. I think the window is over their bed, it looks like HG slept under the window. It was the crib then the bed then the wall with the window.

These are examples. You can move your finger slowly across the "line" on the screen and stop and see various rooms.

 

[Cool Cats]

I am too.

These engineers appear to work for Adams and Scioto County, so I'm guessing they may be civil engineers.
In our area, civil/municipal engineers tend to plan/execute/maintain public infrastructure. They are also known to help, advise and deal with issues on private property, if those issues stem from problems with public infrastructure. I'd not be surprised if they also inspected things like septic systems, wells or cistern wells, etc.

Coincidentally, the Peterson Farm is in Adams County, the FWF is in Scioto County.

IIRC isn't there also a motion to exclude evidence from other counties?

How all of this might be related - I have no clue!
JMO

BBM - "IIRC isn't there also a motion to exclude evidence from other counties?"

Yes. Many Counties and places including Franklin County Ohio.

States Response To Motion To Suppress Audio Recordings Filed by #GeorgeWagnerIV. | PDF

Rhoden Massacre Piketon Massacre

www.scribd.com

 

[Tena]

I don’t see any reason for County Engineers except to define county lines and show what county things did or did not happen…

My thoughts also..I believe the defense is really stretching these motions. Am I remembering right that DR's home was in another county? It has been so long. With AC representing the AG's office early on, she would be representing statewide. Is she now special prosecutor for Pike Co. only? This case gets so far out there by the day and minute.

 

[Caylee Advocate]

Be safe

Thank you. My Rottie is a big whiner, he is terrified when storms happen. He would stand up to Godzilla, but is a baby when lightning booms or heavy downpours come into play. I had to bring him to the basement with us. He only weighs 140 pounds... LOL