OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #26

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rsd1200

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The warrant, signed by Pike County Common Pleas Judge Timothy S. Hogan, indicated authorities believe the truck was “used as a means of the commission of the crime’’ of aggravated murder.


In the state of Ohio, aggravated murder can be defined as:

  • An intentional, preplanned, and premeditated act that is designed to cause the death of another person, or the termination of another person’s pregnancy.

  • Causing the death of another person or unlawfully terminating another person’s pregnancy while committing, attempting to commit, or fleeing after committing crimes like kidnapping, rape, burglary, trespassing, etc.

The Difference Between Murder and Aggravated Murder:
Cases which are less violent and which do not involve special circumstances are charged as murder. Aggravated murder may involve special circumstances and heinous crimes other than murder may be committed by the offender. Aggravated murder also often has a premeditated element to it, as compared to murder, which is committed with “malice aforethought” (intent to kill). Also, aggravated murder may involve the offender receiving a payment for performing the act of murder

http://attorneyadamburke.com/felony-charges/ohio-murder-charges/


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...assacre-more-search-details-emerge/101713414/
 

Midge Montana

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The warrant, signed by Pike County Common Pleas Judge Timothy S. Hogan, indicated authorities believe the truck was “used as a means of the commission of the crime’’ of aggravated murder.


In the state of Ohio, aggravated murder can be defined as:

  • An intentional, preplanned, and premeditated act that is designed to cause the death of another person, or the termination of another person’s pregnancy.

  • Causing the death of another person or unlawfully terminating another person’s pregnancy while committing, attempting to commit, or fleeing after committing crimes like kidnapping, rape, burglary, trespassing, etc.

The Difference Between Murder and Aggravated Murder:
Cases which are less violent and which do not involve special circumstances are charged as murder. Aggravated murder may involve special circumstances and heinous crimes other than murder may be committed by the offender. Aggravated murder also often has a premeditated element to it, as compared to murder, which is committed with “malice aforethought” (intent to kill). Also, aggravated murder may involve the offender receiving a payment for performing the act of murder

http://attorneyadamburke.com/felony-charges/ohio-murder-charges/


http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...assacre-more-search-details-emerge/101713414/

Have you seen a copy of the warrant? I only ask because I hadn't seen the aggravated murder part listed in any of the articles I read.
Can you post a link?
 

Gunslinging Granny

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I'm having trouble seeing JM involved in this. Somewhere I read he was close to his sister. How much money would it take to assist someone in murdering your sister and her entire family? How much money would be worth breaking your elderly dad's heart?
 

branwynbreeze

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What if Wagners enlisted JM to collect evidence against his family for custody battle by explaining child would want for nothing and have a wonderful life growing up with them. When JW went to pick up his daughter, perhaps they had a huge blowup over how to raise their child. JW stewed about or got others worked up over situation and decided to do something about it. The text may have been a vague don't worry about it, it's handled.

From 03 May 2016
LM's statement:
He said investigators still have not released his own son’s pickup truck, or the tools carried in it. He said he doesn’t know what authorities wanted with James Manley’s truck or his tools.

http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...owed-part-investigation-pike-county/83882994/
 

0101ABA

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Have you seen a copy of the warrant? I only ask because I hadn't seen the aggravated murder part listed in any of the articles I read.
Can you post a link?

The mention of aggravated murder comes directly from the Cincinnati.com article linked in the post (by rsd1200).
 

jk204

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I'm having trouble seeing JM involved in this. Somewhere I read he was close to his sister. How much money would it take to assist someone in murdering your sister and her entire family? How much money would be worth breaking your elderly dad's heart?

JM's truck is suspected of being used to commit the crime. It was not necessarily JM driving it.

As for motivation, it's not money, I agree. But It was premeditated for sure.

ETA: although I say it's not money. A few months ago I posted about another case where the brother in law did it for a conflict over money
 

rsd1200

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Per the news article, the warrant for the GPS tracker didn't contain the name of LM, nor did it refer to the Rhoden murders. I find that very suspicious.

Could it mean that they think the vehicle may not have been under LM's control that night?

"The warrant, signed by Pike County Common Pleas Judge Timothy S. Hogan, indicated authorities believe the truck was “used as a means of the commission of the crime’’ of aggravated murder. Or it was in the possession of another person with the intent to use the vehicle as a means of committing the crime, the warrant said."
http://www.cincinnati.com/story/new...assacre-more-search-details-emerge/101713414/


I looked into Tracking Device Warrants, and they differ in that a:
Warrant for a Tracking Device. A tracking-device warrant must identify the person or property to be tracked.

The time must not exceed 45 days from the date the warrant was issued. (45 day extensions can be granted if good cause is shown.)

Also:
Within 10 days after the use of the tracking device has ended, the officer executing a tracking-device warrant must serve a copy of the warrant on the person who was tracked or whose property was tracked.

More info here: https://www.law.cornell.edu/rules/frcrmp/rule_41

 

Jennifer17

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I'm having trouble seeing JM involved in this. Somewhere I read he was close to his sister. How much money would it take to assist someone in murdering your sister and her entire family? How much money would be worth breaking your elderly dad's heart?

I think that too. His sister and his neice/?
 

panda114

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Is it possible that JM let JW borrow the truck for some reason, and the text was asking when he'd bring it back? And that could be referring to "in the possession of another person with the intent to use the vehicle as a means of committing the crime"?
 

rsd1200

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HR lived on the site of an illegal, large, marijuana farm (criminals and danger). She also couldn't pinpoint the identify of her new baby's father (eww and potential for danger).

LE has never proven it to be a large marijuana farm. We've seen zero proof. Reader's comment actually led me to believe that it wasn't all that large; “It wasn't because they had a couple little indoor grows, ... It's much bigger than that." But, even if it turns out to be ginormous, HMR couldn't make her parent's and uncle's choices for them.

HMR had just turned 19 when she was murdered. JW was 23 at the time. They had a two year old, together. From looking at his SM, it seemed they'd been together since at least 2011. He's had quite a few pictures of her, and both of them together, on his SM account. So it didn't seem like they'd just hooked up, and ended up with a baby. I have a theory about 2nd pregnancy and the father situation but TOS prevents me from tossing it out there.


Reader's quote:
http://www.daytondailynews.com/news...rs-abound-pike-county/sw88H0SRjuYVltzKX3xXUO/
 

Adt1984

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Is it possible that JM let JW borrow the truck for some reason, and the text was asking when he'd bring it back? And that could be referring to "in the possession of another person with the intent to use the vehicle as a means of committing the crime"?

If that's the case, JM could have let a lot of people borrow his truck if you think about it.. possibly another family member.. or one of the Wagner's. I just don't think JW would have any reason to borrow JM's truck. JW has his own truck plus there were 2 trucks left on the property on St Rt 41 hooked up to trailers. I guess you could argue maybe they didn't have the trucks a year ago.... but given their background and lifestyle, my guess is they had trucks and would have no legit reason to borrow someone's.
Also, texting someone at 2:00AM to ask about returning a borrowed vehicle is kind of odd timing..I guess unlike the others, I don't think it's such a reach to believe JM was involved. LE has been so tight lipped up until this point, I can't imagine all of this chaos/info leaking out being unwarranted. Maybe I'm wrong.
 

OsoTejano

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Bizarre warrant, very strange investigation, very odd tactics.

No more doubt in my mind. Call in the FBI and have them take over this investigation. BCI doesn't seem to know what they're doing. Or something.

I'm calling my senator. Enough of this.

Considering that all other warrants in this case have been sealed, I am wondering if it is related to another case like the one linked below -

http://portsmouth-dailytimes.com/news/14835/pike-county-investigation-ends-in-murder-arrest



Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk
 

MJKTOOL

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i would think that quote would have sent up red flags to LE the minute they heard it. "Why was she picked up a day earlier than planned? Did you often pick her up early? Had you ever picked her up early?" Etc.

That tracking device went on his truck one day before the anniversary of the mass murder. I'm thinking LE was really reaching for anything. This guy has no criminal record and no reason to kill his little sister and all her family.

But on the other hand, why would you destroy the tracker if you've got nothing to hide? Just because we haven't heard a motive publicly from LE , doesn't mean JM didn't have one. I really don't think they're grasping for straws because a judge isn't going to put himself at risk by granting a warrant for a tracking device without legit evidence.

I'm still of the opinion that this crime was committed by a group of people with various motives. Custody issues, jealousy/greed, etc. I think that's why they've had such a hard time solving it. Because it's not just one cut and dry motive.

The sad fact is that we humans kill each other for the pettiest of reasons.
 

molly1255

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http://globalnews.ca/video/2660827/father-of-ohio-shooting-victim-says-suspect-knew-rhoden-family

I believe this was the first interview given by LM after the murders. In this interview, he expresses his anger that LE took his son's truck, apparently after his son and daughter were told that it was ok to leave their vehicles at the scene.

There has to be a reason why LE took his son's vehicle, but I've not seen anything to indicate "why" they took his vehicle. I'm gathering from this interview that only JM's vehicle was taken and that BJM's vehicle was not taken.

Does anyone know the reason why LE took JM's vehicle? I assumed initially that maybe he had some unpaid fines, but given the magnitude of what LE was dealing with, I would think the last thing they would be worried about would be towing a car for unpaid fines.

I'm thinking someone in LE grew suspicious of JM very early on. Perhaps JM said something that was off or his affect was off?

Any thoughts on this?
 

GoBuckeyes

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The only situation I can think of that would cause JM to collude with the W family is ongoing violation of the children in some manner. (I don't even want to speculate on that matter.) There is no evidence whatsoever that the children were being harmed. I am simply responding to the previous question concerning collusion.

Interestingly, with the age difference between HR and JW, and the age of their child, it would seem that JW was guilty of statutory rape, per the laws of Ohio.
 

molly1255

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But on the other hand, why would you destroy the tracker if you've got nothing to hide? Just because we haven't heard a motive publicly from LE , doesn't mean JM didn't have one. I really don't think they're grasping for straws because a judge isn't going to put himself at risk by granting a warrant for a tracking device without legit evidence.

I'm still of the opinion that this crime was committed by a group of people with various motives. Custody issues, jealousy/greed, etc. I think that's why they've had such a hard time solving it. Because it's not just one cut and dry motive.

The sad fact is that we humans kill each other for the pettiest of reasons.

I agree - why destroy a tracker if you have nothing to hide? Another thing that struck me is that LE told his wife to call him to come home, she did, and he declined to come home.

I'm sure this family is sick and tired of being questioned, polygraphed, and being the focus of so much attention. But above all, LE is trying to find out who slaughtered their close family members. To me, JM's removal of the tracking device and his refusal to come home to talk to LE on Monday indicates that either he fears he is being railroaded by LE, or that he is trying to hide something.

I do think there is a puppet master involved in this case - a person who was calling the shots through manipulation of emotions, and perhaps even trickery. I'm not seeing that person as being JM. He may have been tricked into providing information, a vehicle, and perhaps a cell phone and didn't realize what it was all about until the discovery of the murders. I think the puppet master is someone who had something very definitive to gain from the murder of this entire family and ultimately, I think it was about control.

JMO
 

MJKTOOL

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The only situation I can think of that would cause JM to collude with the W family is ongoing violation of the children in some manner. (I don't even want to speculate on that matter.) There is no evidence whatsoever that the children were being harmed. I am simply responding to the previous question concerning collusion.

Interestingly, with the age difference between HR and JW, and the age of their child, it would seem that JW was guilty of statutory rape, per the laws of Ohio.

People keep saying they can't figure any motive for JM. The thing is though that none of us know the dynamics of that families different relationships other than what LM has described.

My family is very similar to the Rhodens/Manleys. Myself and one other cousin are the only two that have been successful. It does breed contempt and resentment. They don't see that we busted our butts to get the life we live. All they see is that we have things and they don't.

There could be a dozen different motives in JM or any other family members head that they've justified in their own minds. From the few details released publicly, this seems to have been an incredibly emotional, violent crime. That, to me, screams family.
 
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