OH - Pike County: 8 people from one family dead as police hunt for killer(s) - #26

[RAISINISBACK]

BBM
I didn't realize this until late yesterday, but, the warrant was not for JM's truck that they took at the scene of the murder last year. The warrant was for an entirely different make and model of vehicle.

True. Even if I'd done nothing wrong, and they'd put a tracker on my car, and then threatened me with a felony and lock-up, and I thought that they thought that I'd lied on a poly, and that I'd had something to do with murdering my family, I'd have been at a lawyer's office rather than mowing my lawn. If I'd done nothing wrong and found a tracker on my car, I'd have just continued to drive the car to work and back, and called a LAWYER.

bbm
That is kind of why I am thinking that the truck in the warrant may have been at CR1's for repair. BJM said in an interview they towed vehicles left on the property for CR1 to repair.

Then again I don't know what a K2500 is. If going by the numbers of my F150 then a K2500 could be a huge truck. Maybe even a diesel. And we all know who does repairs on diesel engines. That truck could have been left at JW's for him or his brother to repair if it was a diesel engine. We just don't know.

I honestly think this is not new information for LM or JM. I think they knew about the truck and the text much earlier. They don't seem too shocked about it.

I think the only thing new about the info is LM telling it to news media. He and LE has to assume JW and company are reading every news report they can get right now because of the searches. They may be trying to scare them into making a mistake or saying something to someone that could be incriminating.

 

[MsAugust]

LE has never proven it to be a large marijuana farm. We've seen zero proof. Reader's comment actually led me to believe that it wasn't all that large; “It wasn't because they had a couple little indoor grows, ... It's much bigger than that." But, even if it turns out to be ginormous, HMR couldn't make her parent's and uncle's choices for them.

HMR had just turned 19 when she was murdered. JW was 23 at the time. They had a two year old, together. From looking at his SM, it seemed they'd been together since at least 2011. He's had quite a few pictures of her, and both of them together, on his SM account. So it didn't seem like they'd just hooked up, and ended up with a baby. I have a theory about 2nd pregnancy and the father situation but TOS prevents me from tossing it out there.


Reader's quote:
http://www.daytondailynews.com/news...rs-abound-pike-county/sw88H0SRjuYVltzKX3xXUO/

I believe I'm thinking the same theory as you...

 

[smc1225]

bbm
That is kind of why I am thinking that the truck in the warrant may have been at CR1's for repair. BJM said in an interview they towed vehicles left on the property for CR1 to repair.

Then again I don't know what a K2500 is. If going by the numbers of my F150 then a K2500 could be a huge truck. Maybe even a diesel. And we all know who does repairs on diesel engines. That truck could have been left at JW's for him or his brother to repair if it was a diesel engine. We just don't know.

I honestly think this is not new information for LM or JM. I think they knew about the truck and the text much earlier. They don't seem too shocked about it.

I think the only thing new about the info is LM telling it to news media. He and LE has to assume JW and company are reading every news report they can get right now because of the searches. They may be trying to scare them into making a mistake or saying something to someone that could be incriminating.

Here is what a 1997 KR2500 looks like. This is not JM's vehicle.

 

[MsAugust]

bbm

Then again I don't know what a K2500 is. If going by the numbers of my F150 then a K2500 could be a huge truck. Maybe even a diesel. And we all know who does repairs on diesel engines. That truck could have been left at JW's for him or his brother to repair if it was a diesel engine. We just don't know.

K2500 is a Chevy 3/4 ton...some are gas, some are diesel.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Here is what a 1997 KR2500 looks like. This is not JM's vehicle.

I found this about a K2500 Chevrolet. Seems there could be a lot of problems with the engine in these trucks.

Click here: 1997 Chevrolet 2500 Consumer Reviews

I bought this 97 K2500 4x4 truck used with a 6.5 turbo diesel. The motor needed a new PMD which happens alot with this motor. The PMD always burns up and the truck wont run right because of the PMDs placement.and I got a FSD heat-sync because of its relocated location so it will never go bad ever again. The truck runs like a champ after I replaced a bad vacuum pump and now the turbo works great. mileage is from low 12s city and could go all the way up to 20 highway if you drive it right. The control arm bushings are being replaced, I put on a new air intake, and I hope to do much more with this big block V8 motor. but a FSD HEAT-SYNC is a MUST with this motor of you will hate this truck and the dealerships for changing your injection pumps 10 times in two year and still not solving the problem!

 

[Agent.99]

I agree - why destroy a tracker if you have nothing to hide? Another thing that struck me is that LE told his wife to call him to come home, she did, and he declined to come home.

Reasons to stonewall LE: 1) He was involved and does not want to implicate himself. 2) He was not involved in actual murders, knows enough that could have helped LE but does not was to get involved for fear of being implicated in his own - unrelated - crimes. 3) He was not involved in actual murders, knows enough that could have helped LE but does not was to get involved for fear of his being the next entire family murdered in their beds. Fear for his family could trump love for his sister.


In my profession, all day everyday I hear people demand an ex to give up parental rights and/or threaten to give up their own parental rights. The reasons are always the same: 1) One party has moved on and the other has not, fueling anger over the betraal/rejection. 2) One is just not ready to give up control, i.e. I do not want your new Girlfriend/Boyfriend around my baby (even when the new partner is by no means a threat to the baby - the threar is only to a bruised ego) 3) there really is a reason to perceive a threat to the child.

In this case, the baby was two - a real threat would have prompted a custody hearing well before the birth of a 2nd child. JW stated he thought there was a chance he was the father. A new partner enters the picture and publicly proclaimed his love for HR and her baby (JW's baby). I know from experience that can be perceived as public humilation. Rage festers. Families take sides.

 

[Betty P]

HR lived on the site of an illegal, large, marijuana farm (criminals and danger). She also couldn't pinpoint the identify of her new baby's father (eww and potential for danger).

Actually, it's believed the 2 grow ops were located at CRSr's work trailer/property and KR's camper/shed. Hanna and her children lived with her mom and younger brother at Dana's home about 1 mile away from CR's.

Online video from Dana's home showed it was a nice, clean comfortable place. DR worked full time at the nursing home, Hanna worked there, too, until close to the birth of her baby. Not to say that CR's activity with a grow op at his work place didn't enrage the Wagner family.

 

[RAISINISBACK]

Poor LM. He has to be having a hard time believing all this has happened. One child dead, and LE implying another was involved in her death. Then the threat of arrest.

Click here: Warrant: Investigators put GPS tracker on truck of Rhoden victim's brother

Manley said he told agents that they would not find the device on the truck because his son removed it when he discovered it about a week ago. Manley said a BCI agent warned him that they were going to arrest his son on felony charges tied to the destruction of government property. Manley said they also threatened to arrest him on obstruction of justice charges on Monday.

 

[leelee114]

Surprised and secretly pleased with myself if it turns out JM was involved. Back in August I picked up on something that pointed directly to him. I asked if anyone knew the earliest time he could know everyone was dead and IIRC no one had a guess. I wrote an entire post about why I asked but convinced myself I couldn't be right and probably had the timeline wrong so I didn't post it and just saved it my iPad. It bothered me for a few weeks so I decided to post again and once more felt bad for being so critical and there was probably an innocent explanation that I wasn't seeing so I didn't post it.

Anyway in light of recent events here is the post that left me so conflicted.



"I asked earlier about any guess on the earliest time JM would have known everyone was dead but there were no guesses. Here is why I asked (apologies if it was already asked)

From the interview with Frankie's ex:

She doesn’t have to look at her phone to recall that it was 8:14 a.m. on April 22 when she got the news. Her tall-for-his-age and tow-headed son Brentley, who turns 4 in September, was all right, the caller said, but his dad and all the other Rhodens she loved?

“They told me they’d all been murdered,” said Chelsea, 21. “I didn’t know what to believe. I just had to get there to see for myself.”




Who called Chelsea? The time of death (which is actually the time of discovery for Dana,Hanna May, and Chris by LE)Jr is 8:17. If someone called her at 8:14 and specifically told her everyone was dead how did they already know?

Now there could be an assumption on the part of James Manley that after finding what he did that something was terribly wrong.But I sincerely doubt that even with the strongest hunch you are not going to start spreading the news that an entire household has been murdered until you are sure.

So even if he called BJ to tell her what he found he isn't going to risk her letting Mr.Manley know that they are all dead if there is a 1% chance they aren't. For all they knew someone could be seriously injured or not even in the house. For instance there would have been a chance that Chris Jr. wasn't there since his car wasn't at Dana's it was at his father's.They knew nothing at the time that would let them know the time of death hence upon coming upon that scene at that time it wouldn't be far fetched to assume it was a very fresh crime scene and Chris Jr could have gotten a ride to school. Wouldn't any reasonable person be holding onto small hopes like that until they had to face the truth? Heck if it were me I'd be hoping maybe someone was kidnapped because in that moment anything would be better than them all being dead. Someone was too certain too soon that they were all dead.

So is it me or did someone majorly jump the gun in letting Chelsea know? Who made that call and why at 8:14 that morning were they confident enough to call Chelsea and tell her that not only were Frankie and Hannah dead but so were Dana,Chris Jr and Hanna May."

 

[Flatbush]

I am confused about the GPS that got removed. Do these devices record in real time or do they record "within" themselves? Anyone familiar with the technology?

Also DR's brother talking to JW in the wee hours the night of murders? It is what it is! Now I can't speak for others, but that late, I don't call people. Might if I knew they were up (unlikely). Why would JW and DMs brother be on the phone so very late the night of these killings??

 

[smc1225]

Surprised and secretly pleased with myself if it turns out JM was involved. Back in August I picked up on something that pointed directly to him. I asked if anyone knew the earliest time he could know everyone was dead and IIRC no one had a guess. I wrote an entire post about why I asked but convinced myself I couldn't be right and probably had the timeline wrong so I didn't post it and just saved it my iPad. It bothered me for a few weeks so I decided to post again and once more felt bad for being so critical and there was probably an innocent explanation that I wasn't seeing so I didn't post it.

Anyway in light of recent events here is the post that left me so conflicted.



"I asked earlier about any guess on the earliest time JM would have known everyone was dead but there were no guesses. Here is why I asked (apologies if it was already asked)

From the interview with Frankie's ex:

She doesn’t have to look at her phone to recall that it was 8:14 a.m. on April 22 when she got the news. Her tall-for-his-age and tow-headed son Brentley, who turns 4 in September, was all right, the caller said, but his dad and all the other Rhodens she loved?

“They told me they’d all been murdered,” said Chelsea, 21. “I didn’t know what to believe. I just had to get there to see for myself.”




Who called Chelsea? The time of death (which is actually the time of discovery for Dana,Hanna May, and Chris by LE)Jr is 8:17. If someone called her at 8:14 and specifically told her everyone was dead how did they already know?

Now there could be an assumption on the part of James Manley that after finding what he did that something was terribly wrong.But I sincerely doubt that even with the strongest hunch you are not going to start spreading the news that an entire household has been murdered until you are sure.

So even if he called BJ to tell her what he found he isn't going to risk her letting Mr.Manley know that they are all dead if there is a 1% chance they aren't. For all they knew someone could be seriously injured or not even in the house. For instance there would have been a chance that Chris Jr. wasn't there since his car wasn't at Dana's it was at his father's.They knew nothing at the time that would let them know the time of death hence upon coming upon that scene at that time it wouldn't be far fetched to assume it was a very fresh crime scene and Chris Jr could have gotten a ride to school. Wouldn't any reasonable person be holding onto small hopes like that until they had to face the truth? Heck if it were me I'd be hoping maybe someone was kidnapped because in that moment anything would be better than them all being dead. Someone was too certain too soon that they were all dead.

So is it me or did someone majorly jump the gun in letting Chelsea know? Who made that call and why at 8:14 that morning were they confident enough to call Chelsea and tell her that not only were Frankie and Hannah dead but so were Dana,Chris Jr and Hanna May."

The first call to 911 was at 7:49 am by BJM.

http://www.chillicothegazette.com/s...ipts-911-calls-pike-county-slayings/83445300/

Officers were dispatched at 7:51am according to the incident report and another officer was flagged down at the property at 8:07 am.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-hunt-for-killer(s)-4&p=12502409#post12502409

There was plenty of time between 7:49 and 8:14 to determine that everyone was deceased before making the phone call to Chelsea.

 

[rsd1200]

bbm
That is kind of why I am thinking that the truck in the warrant may have been at CR1's for repair. BJM said in an interview they towed vehicles left on the property for CR1 to repair.

Then again I don't know what a K2500 is. If going by the numbers of my F150 then a K2500 could be a huge truck. Maybe even a diesel. And we all know who does repairs on diesel engines. That truck could have been left at JW's for him or his brother to repair if it was a diesel engine. We just don't know.

I honestly think this is not new information for LM or JM. I think they knew about the truck and the text much earlier. They don't seem too shocked about it.

I think the only thing new about the info is LM telling it to news media. He and LE has to assume JW and company are reading every news report they can get right now because of the searches. They may be trying to scare them into making a mistake or saying something to someone that could be incriminating.

I'm sorry, I misunderstood. I see where you are coming from now. Good thinking! The 1997 Chevy 2500 Extended Cab, 2500 HD Extended Cab, & 2500 Regular Cab, could be purchased with a V8, Turbo Diesel, 6.5L engine.

 

[Betty P]

The first call to 911 was at 7:49 am by BJM.

http://www.chillicothegazette.com/s...ipts-911-calls-pike-county-slayings/83445300/

Officers were dispatched at 7:51am according to the incident report and another officer was flagged down at the property at 8:07 am.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-hunt-for-killer(s)-4&p=12502409#post12502409

There was plenty of time between 7:49 and 8:14 to determine that everyone was deceased before making the phone call to Chelsea.

Thanks for that information. I was just getting ready to check the Media & Timeline thread.

In the early days of the investigation, there was a lot of erroneous information about these times of discovery, etc. that sowed confusion and attempted to point to Dana's brother and sister as being somehow complicit. It had to be corrected numerous times. Makes me wonder a little where that false information originated.

 

[Curiosum]

BBM

This is something that, once the age difference struck me, I was a bit taken aback, considering the length of time that they had been together. They'd been together since at least June of 2011, based on their SM activity. She'd have been only 14 in June of 2011. I realize that four years doesn't seem like much, and had they been 18 & 22, I'd have thought nothing of the age gap. There's over twice that between my s/o and me, and there was over 15 between my grandparents, but no one was 14 at the beginning of the relationships... and times have changed.

On a side note, had anyone else noticed that in photos, around this time last year, that JW had dyed his hair?

OH age of consent is sixteen...so, yes, it might have been statutory rape (OH's exceptions only protect those who are also under eighteen, which JW would not have been).

 

[WBF]

i don't know what specific device they used but most gps tracking equipment these days is real time where you can watch the movement of the vehicle on a web application. you can create geofences that send alerts when the vehicle enters or leaves the specified area. in fleet management, alerts are also created for speeding, hard braking, or if a vehicle is idle too long.

 

[molly1255]

I hear ya, and the only one I can remember of him seeming to be visibly shaken, was the one where he talks about "it could have been a road rage thing or it could have been a custody thing". There were some statements that I found oddly worded too. However, like you said, I don't know how one might handle something like this, or how he's dealt with it in his private life. His public way of handling it may be have been his way of trying to bring light, to potential motives, that he felt, may be overlooked.

There was a very early interview, out by the properties and he was very beside himself with grief. He was holding a water bottle and at one point, he fell back on a car and broke down crying. In this interview, he was also very upset with LE.

 

[smc1225]

Thanks for that information. I was just getting ready to check the Media & Timeline thread.

In the early days of the investigation, there was a lot of erroneous information about these times of discovery, etc. that sowed confusion and attempted to point to Dana's brother and sister as being somehow complicit. It had to be corrected numerous times. Makes me wonder a little where that false information originated.

I remember that. I think it was because there were multiple officers responding at different times to different location. And none of the reports other than the 911 called identified the person the officer was speaking with.

 

[leelee114]

The first call to 911 was at 7:49 am by BJM.

http://www.chillicothegazette.com/s...ipts-911-calls-pike-county-slayings/83445300/

Officers were dispatched at 7:51am according to the incident report and another officer was flagged down at the property at 8:07 am.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...-hunt-for-killer(s)-4&p=12502409#post12502409

There was plenty of time between 7:49 and 8:14 to determine that everyone was deceased before making the phone call to Chelsea.

Flagged down at 8:07 with JM refusing to enter Dana's house despite seeing her foot and hearing that poor baby crying.. By 8:14(3 minutes before the official discovery time) all bodies are discovered, JM has learned they are all dead reacted, has the presence of mine to call BJ have her react, and then likely she calls call Chelsea? Mighty quick if we are to believe this is the first time JM learns a huge chunk of his family has been slaughtered.

 

[jk204]

Any official news on the whereabouts of the W family?

Apart from SM postings we cant talk about and wouldn't be able to verify as authentic and dated.

 

[Bootsctr]

Regarding what might have prompted JW to ask Hanna to sign away her rights to S, I think it could have been Hanna sending the sonogram picture to whom she thought was the baby's father. I think she probably had a good idea of who the Baby Daddy was when she sent the sonogram. For whatever reason I think this could have prompted JW to seek sole custody of S.

I came across an old article from June 2016 that was very interesting regarding the surviving infants:

Less than a year into their lives, R and K have been tossed into a complicated battle over questions of custody and truth. At least three families have hired lawyers and started the laborious process to gain custody of the chubby-cheeked R and petite newborn K. Two other toddlers -- R’s grandson and R's big brother, B; and K's big sister, S -- are in the care of a surviving parent.

Several family members say they have submitted background checks, will take paternity tests and are getting their homes in order — all necessary first steps to convince the state they are the adults fit to raise the babies.


http://www.mansfieldnewsjournal.com...s-all-weve-got-left-just-those-kids/85231530/

Talk about a tangled web weaved...