UNSOLVED Oh - Pike County: 8 People From One Family Dead As Police Hunt For Killer(s) #33

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rsd1200

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They’re isolated in terms of membership. In terms of being ultra right, in terms of what they actually worship. In terms of beliefs. Yes very isolated.

They appear to be pretty "open". Most secretive places don't have welcoming FB and Internet sites with the address, times and dates of events, meetings, and history and what they believe, on the internet and FB. My fil's Masonic lodge seems more secretive than these two churches.

Have you ever attended these churches and met the parishioners? I mean, Kenai is one of the most conservative places in the conservative state, of AK.

Have you thought about becoming a verified insider? I mean, you've spoken to folks in both regions. One, of whom, seems to need to put down the meth pipe. That might be a lead right there.
 
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MittenScarpetta

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The theories in this case can be very interesting. Researching them will send you down rabbit holes over and over but really at the end of the day, IMO I think we all sometimes think it has to be something complicated because 8 victims in 4 locations is complicated within itself. Something complicated would make more sense to our minds in order to wrap our brains around the fact that 8 people were murdered in the safety of their own homes in the middle of the night.

I truly believe the motive itself is “simple” but what would make that motive bigger than “ a few little grows and a few stolen cars” as Reader said (paraphrasing)

Here’s an interesting case:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/global...y-nathan-obrien-alvin-and-kathryn-liknes/amp/


'Hand marks of blood on the wall': Douglas Garland murder trial hears graphic evidence from boy's mother | CBC News

It’s different than this case in many ways but shows how someone can plan for years to carry such atrocious actions out
 

Betty P

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The theories in this case can be very interesting. Researching them will send you down rabbit holes over and over but really at the end of the day, IMO I think we all sometimes think it has to be something complicated because 8 victims in 4 locations is complicated within itself. Something complicated would make more sense to our minds in order to wrap our brains around the fact that 8 people were murdered in the safety of their own homes in the middle of the night.

I truly believe the motive itself is “simple” but what would make that motive bigger than “ a few little grows and a few stolen cars” as Reader said (paraphrasing)

Here’s an interesting case:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/global...y-nathan-obrien-alvin-and-kathryn-liknes/amp/


'Hand marks of blood on the wall': Douglas Garland murder trial hears graphic evidence from boy's mother | CBC News

It’s different than this case in many ways but shows how someone can plan for years to carry such atrocious actions out

JMO, it was simple and complicated, since it involved the killing of 8 people in 4 different homes within the span of a few hours.

That's an extremely big risk to take for garden-variety revenge. I'm still inclined to think the person(s) behind the murders believed the Rhodens, most likely CR1 posed an extreme threat to them.

There had to be some major motivation to plan and execute so many people at one time. The risk of being caught, of leaving evidence behind, of having a victim fight back or call 911, increased exponentially with each murder and crime scene. It may explain why they didn't kill the small children - doing so would have gotten them an automatic death penalty if caught.

So what killers/bosses would have felt sufficiently threatened to take this risk and what was scaring them?

Did they feel their plan and executioners were good enough to evade arrest and conviction, or did they also believe they had some sort of protection? JMO, the motive was simple, but the execution was somewhat complicated and probably expensive.
 

Betty P

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ADL Report: Armed & Dangerous: Ohio

Pike county Ohio militias and practice retreats. I had to dig to find.

Thanks, Charliegizmo49. That's interesting. No doubt that group was there in the 90's and some of them probably still are. Interesting they have managed to evade detection by the FBI and SPLC. They must have good connections and keep a low profile.

Ohio Militia | Terrorist Groups | TRAC

13 Ohio groups on the same list of militias as the Michigan-based Hutaree

Militia members in Louisiana have been involved in drug trafficking, specifically meth

Militia member accused of drug trafficking

Arizona, too

Arizona militia members accused of stealing cocaine from smugglers

This is an interesting article about how law enforcement often ignores the activities of violent militia and paramilitary groups. Turns out Ohio is one of the few states in the US who have no laws against para-military training & activities. The other is Michigan. And Alaska.

Why the law turns a blind eye to right-wing militias

Found this group to be unusual, too. A militia/anti-government type of group made up of county sheriffs. They believe the federal government (FBI, DEA, etc.) should not exist and that only county sheriffs are legally qualified to be law enforcement agents.


Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association - Wikipedia
 
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RAISINISBACK

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Thanks, Charliegizmo49. That's interesting. No doubt that group was there in the 90's and some of them probably still are. Interesting they have managed to evade detection by the FBI and SPLC. They must have good connections and keep a low profile.

Ohio Militia | Terrorist Groups | TRAC

13 Ohio groups on the same list of militias as the Michigan-based Hutaree

Militia members in Louisiana have been involved in drug trafficking, specifically meth

Militia member accused of drug trafficking

Arizona, too

Arizona militia members accused of stealing cocaine from smugglers

This is an interesting article about how law enforcement often ignores the activities of violent militia and paramilitary groups. Turns out Ohio is one of the few states in the US who have no laws against para-military training & activities. The other is Michigan. And Alaska.

Why the law turns a blind eye to right-wing militias

Found this group to be unusual, too. A militia/anti-government type of group made up of county sheriffs. They believe the federal government (FBI, DEA, etc.) should not exist and that only county sheriffs are legally qualified to be law enforcement agents.


Constitutional Sheriffs and Peace Officers Association - Wikipedia

Very scary. As I said most people are terrified of these loonies and if, that being a big IF, there was some kind of wing nut militia involved in these murders, I can see no one wanting to speak up. Being that most of these nuts are associated with a cult like religion of some sort, I can see why they would leave the babies alive.

The question is, did The R's, namely CR1 and KR and the W's belong to any such group?

We don't have anything to prove they did. All we know for certain is the W's moved to AK, to a town where there is a militia presence who's leader is Norm Olsen, who was also involved by grace of both Nichols and McVeigh attending meetings held by his group, in the OKC bombing. We know the W's attended a church in AK that was connected with a church they attended in Ohio.

But if, and again this is a big IF, the W's belonged to any such group, that group would certainly have the training and firepower to carry out these murders, and in keeping with Reader saying the killers are local, which if it was a group operating in Pike county, they would be locals. Also those groups generate the kind of loyalty that none of their members talk to LE and if anyone else knows or sees anything they are too afraid to speak up.

Looking like more of a fit than I would like to see.

I get so nauseated when any mention of militias come up that I cannot even think.

Maybe someone else on here can contribute some thoughts on this line of speculation.

JMO
 

Betty P

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Very scary. As I said most people are terrified of these loonies and if, that being a big IF, there was some kind of wing nut militia involved in these murders, I can see no one wanting to speak up. Being that most of these nuts are associated with a cult like religion of some sort, I can see why they would leave the babies alive.

The question is, did The R's, namely CR1 and KR and the W's belong to any such group?

We don't have anything to prove they did. All we know for certain is the W's moved to AK, to a town where there is a militia presence who's leader is Norm Olsen, who was also involved by grace of both Nichols and McVeigh attending meetings held by his group, in the OKC bombing. We know the W's attended a church in AK that was connected with a church they attended in Ohio.

But if, and again this is a big IF, the W's belonged to any such group, that group would certainly have the training and firepower to carry out these murders, and in keeping with Reader saying the killers are local, which if it was a group operating in Pike county, they would be locals. Also those groups generate the kind of loyalty that none of their members talk to LE and if anyone else knows or sees anything they are too afraid to speak up.

Looking like more of a fit than I would like to see.

I get so nauseated when any mention of militias come up that I cannot even think.

Maybe someone else on here can contribute some thoughts on this line of speculation.

JMO


Just a hunch, but I doubt the deceased Rhodens were members of such a group. No indication of it on their FB pages or other SM. Some of them attended the UHR church, which doesn't seem to be affiliated with any of those militia groups. Rhodens didn't seem to be political, none were military veterans.

W's, OTOH seemed a little different, hyper religious, judgmental, home schooling, etc.
 

rsd1200

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The theories in this case can be very interesting. Researching them will send you down rabbit holes over and over but really at the end of the day, IMO I think we all sometimes think it has to be something complicated because 8 victims in 4 locations is complicated within itself. Something complicated would make more sense to our minds in order to wrap our brains around the fact that 8 people were murdered in the safety of their own homes in the middle of the night.

I truly believe the motive itself is “simple” but what would make that motive bigger than “ a few little grows and a few stolen cars” as Reader said (paraphrasing)

Here’s an interesting case:
https://www.google.com/amp/s/global...y-nathan-obrien-alvin-and-kathryn-liknes/amp/


'Hand marks of blood on the wall': Douglas Garland murder trial hears graphic evidence from boy's mother | CBC News

It’s different than this case in many ways but shows how someone can plan for years to carry such atrocious actions out

Very little evidence was released in that case, til trial time. A lot of work piecing that all together. That was a very petty grudge too. I mean, seriously. Seventy -five years wasn't enough for that horrible individual.
 

rsd1200

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This case reminds me more of Pop The Trunk or Catfish. Somebody in the R family drew negative attention from someone, about what, we don't know for sure, but somebody went and handled business. I lean more toward the deceased knowing their killer(s). May not have been besties, but the likely knew who they were. I'd not doubt that the Greenup side of line doesn't know something.
 

Charliegizmo49

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JMO, it was simple and complicated, since it involved the killing of 8 people in 4 different homes within the span of a few hours.

That's an extremely big risk to take for garden-variety revenge. I'm still inclined to think the person(s) behind the murders believed the Rhodens, most likely CR1 posed an extreme threat to them.

There had to be some major motivation to plan and execute so many people at one time. The risk of being caught, of leaving evidence behind, of having a victim fight back or call 911, increased exponentially with each murder and crime scene. It may explain why they didn't kill the small children - doing so would have gotten them an automatic death penalty if caught.

So what killers/bosses would have felt sufficiently threatened to take this risk and what was scaring them?

Did they feel their plan and executioners were good enough to evade arrest and conviction, or did they also believe they had some sort of protection? JMO, the motive was simple, but the execution was somewhat complicated and probably expensive.


I would have to say the hatred and vengeance had to be festering for years. And it was not one issue but many issues year after year, a grudge that became a deep dark festered wound. A scab that was consnsntly picked at, never allowed to heal.

After a time a plan was hatched. A plan that at least one killer worked out in her head. She thought of everything. It was around dinner they first spoke of it and she was later surprised whe her husband spoke of it again. Yes they would do it. Get rid of the Rhoden forever. It had to be simple and it had to be perfect. The family would do it all together. And then never speak of it again.
 

MittenScarpetta

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Very little evidence was released in that case, til trial time. A lot of work piecing that all together. That was a very petty grudge too. I mean, seriously. Seventy -five years wasn't enough for that horrible individual.
I was never aware of that case until recently probably because I mostly follow US cases. BUT after reading. I was floored at how they initially thought there was no forced entry and then the finding of the hole drilled in the keypad. The truck also caught my attention. And the fact that it had to do with a business grudge.

I don’t know much, but I do know there’s a lot of crazy in this world. It’s just unbelievable.
 

Charliegizmo49

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I was never aware of that case until recently probably because I mostly follow US cases. BUT after reading. I was floored at how they initially thought there was no forced entry and then the finding of the hole drilled in the keypad. The truck also caught my attention. And the fact that it had to do with a business grudge.

I don’t know much, but I do know there’s a lot of crazy in this world. It’s just unbelievable.


And not to appear to be repetitive but the case if the cardiologist murder in Houston‼️ Having lived with a mentally ill mother for years, as a child I thought a grudge was normal behavior. She still, at 80, carries grudges against people who have long died. A few she “passed on” to children who had not even been born at the time if the original offensive incident. I honestly didn’t understand the concept of forgiveness until my step grandparents stepped in to teach it. It was as a teen I learned to forgive. It was radical and my mother believed it was teenage rebellion. She has estranged all extended family and has for over 50 years.

Not healthy but it made no difference to her.
 

Charliegizmo49

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They appear to be pretty "open". Most secretive places don't have welcoming FB and Internet sites with the address, times and dates of events, meetings, and history and what they believe, on the internet and FB. My fil's Masonic lodge seems more secretive than these two churches.

Have you ever attended these churches and met the parishioners? I mean, Kenai is one of the most conservative places in the conservative state, of AK.

Have you thought about becoming a verified insider? I mean, you've spoken to folks in both regions. One, of whom, seems to need to put down the meth pipe. That might be a lead right there.


Meth and heroin is so much worse than any opiod crisis were spending money to fight. Both have killed so many kids in their 29’s up there and almost weekly here. It’s tragic and tiesmd in with guns and all kinds of illegal activity.
 

Sojourn

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Ive done a lot of research on home schooled children . It would appear many have right wing fanatical religious parents . While researching I also searched for home schooled children who kill and are serial killers ....there has been a survey of this , and their is quit a bit in numbers that have killed or are serial killers . Figuring this out in percentage as of the population in the USA would be pretty difficult . But when I found the list it struck me as being very high for a small group of home schoolers . I believe it was 30 or 40 ill see if I can find this again and post it .

I think if you are some nut job parent and wish to home school , isolating your child from main stream thinking , you could create any number of maladjusted individuals .

One of the most notable is israel Keyes from alaska .
Israel Keyes
 

rsd1200

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Meth and heroin is so much worse than any opiod crisis were spending money to fight. Both have killed so many kids in their 29’s up there and almost weekly here. It’s tragic and tiesmd in with guns and all kinds of illegal activity.

I know what you mean about the dangers of those two street drugs. The government trying to solve one problem, too fast, created the other problem. You might think about becoming Verified though.
 

Charliegizmo49

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Ive done a lot of research on home schooled children . It would appear many have right wing fanatical religious parents . While researching I also searched for home schooled children who kill and are serial killers ....there has been a survey of this , and their is quit a bit in numbers that have killed or are serial killers . Figuring this out in percentage as of the population in the USA would be pretty difficult . But when I found the list it struck me as being very high for a small group of home schoolers . I believe it was 30 or 40 ill see if I can find this again and post it .

I think if you are some nut job parent and wish to home school , isolating your child from main stream thinking , you could create any number of maladjusted individuals .

One of the most notable is israel Keyes from alaska .
Israel Keyes


Yes he was bad. No conscience whatsoever and killed himself before the feds were done questioning him.

And they clearly said there were many more murders LE thought he had committed.
 

Chelly

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I would have to say the hatred and vengeance had to be festering for years. And it was not one issue but many issues year after year, a grudge that became a deep dark festered wound. A scab that was consnsntly picked at, never allowed to heal.

After a time a plan was hatched. A plan that at least one killer worked out in her head. She thought of everything. It was around dinner they first spoke of it and she was later surprised whe her husband spoke of it again. Yes they would do it. Get rid of the Rhoden forever. It had to be simple and it had to be perfect. The family would do it all together. And then never speak of it again.
I get it. Hillbilly Justice. But why not just all leave town, go north and skip the killings?
 
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