Ohio woman loses appeal on "White Only" pool sign

Discussion in 'Up to the Minute' started by Reader, Jan 12, 2012.

  1. Reader

    Reader New Member

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    http://news.yahoo.com/ohio-woman-loses-appeal-white-only-pool-sign-211226261.html


    (Reuters) - A Cincinnati landlord found to have violated state anti-discrimination laws after she hung a "white only" sign outside her swimming pool lost an appeal with the Ohio Civil Rights Commission on Thursday.

    The ruling clears the way for the case to be referred to the state attorney general's office for possible state civil charges and the possibility of being forced to pay compensatory and punitive damages.
    -------

    The commission's ruling followed a complaint by Michael Gunn, a former tenant who brought his 10-year-old biracial daughter to a Memorial Day weekend pool party on Hein's property attended by about 20 other guests.

    Gunn said Hein later questioned him about the "chemicals" his daughter used in her hair and blamed the girl, the only non-Caucasian at the party, for making the pool water "cloudy."........Gunn told the commission that about a week later he saw the "white only" sign on the gate leading to the pool.


    More at link...
     
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  3. mysteriew

    mysteriew A diamond in process

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    LOL sometimes people are so stupid. Glad she lost.
     
  4. LinasK

    LinasK Verified insider- Mark Dribin case

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    The sign was an antique??? Really? That's the best defense she could come up with??? :banghead:If the real issue was what chemicals the girl put in her hair, then the landlord could have come up with a better policy, like showering/washing hair prior to entering the pool, NOT banning anyone black because of the chemicals they might use in their hair!
     
  5. krimekat

    krimekat Amazed and Baffled

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    antique or not -- it's vulgar!

    Now I can appreciate Americana art but this is just bad taste . . . IMHO only, of course
     
  6. LinasK

    LinasK Verified insider- Mark Dribin case

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    Yeah, it's like posting a Confederate flag or a Swastika and claiming it's an antique!!!
     
  7. Nova

    Nova New Member

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    <modsnipped>

    Referencing the Confederate flag and the swastika wasn't a random choice on the part of LinasK. Both are well recognized symbols of bigotry and hatred. (And BTW, secession was treason, so your defense of the Confederate flag seems problematic at best.)

    And, yes, both symbols have had other meanings in the past, but their use as symbols of barbarity (whether slavery or holocaust) has overwhelmed those other historical meanings, so there's really no excuse for displaying them.

    Unless there's a swastika in your antique Hopi blanket: I think we'll all figure out it doesn't represent German National Socialism.

    Otherwise, it's a shame that these symbols are now "owned" by the ignorant and intolerant. But that's the way it goes.
     
  8. believe09

    believe09 Active Member

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    O/T Isnt it the Navajo Whirling Logs, Nova?

    I received some items from a loved one's estate, and a whirling logs carving was included. I was completely shocked, lol, until I did a little checking into the symbol.

    :twocents:
     
  9. Nova

    Nova New Member

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    Sorry, believe. I pulled the Hopis out of thin air. I should have done some research to see which Native American groups used the swastika. I know it appears on some of their artifacts (and pre-dates Hitler), but I'm not expert enough to know from which nation.

    (ETA maybe I apologized too soon. Wiki does list the swastika as a Hopi icon:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Swastika#Native_American_traditions

    That link says it's the Navahos who used a similar sign for "Whirling Logs."
    )

    I have seen such blankets, baskets, etc., and in context I didn't for a moment confuse them with mid-20th century German iconography.

    FWIW, if someone collects Americana and has a "Whites Only" sign at home in her private collection, that's one thing. But this woman hung up her sign at her pool.
     
  10. Jacie Estes

    Jacie Estes Medical Marijuana Advocate

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    While the swastika immediately brings to mind Nazi Germany, it is not only a native Southwestern design, it can be called a native design almost anywhere in the world. It is the result of basket weaving where the ends of a simple cross design are turned either to the right or left, depending on the direction of the weaving, to form a swastika. Its meanings are as diverse as its worldwide origins.
    http://www.collectorsguide.com/fa/fa040.shtml


    Swastika was also the name of a hockey team in the early 1900s.
    http://www.birthplaceofhockey.com/hockeyists/swastikas/swastikas-story.html
     
  11. LinasK

    LinasK Verified insider- Mark Dribin case

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    Thanks Nova! You get my point exactly. Unless I missed something, I thought the other poster and I were on the same side of the issue...:waitasec:
     
  12. Nova

    Nova New Member

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    You were, but that poster seems sensitive about the Confederal flag (I'm assuming). I used to have a small one myself, which I kept in my (private) office. I grew up in a former Confederate state and the flag represented a lot of things, many of them good, about the place I called home for half my life.

    But at some point, watching the flaps over flying the flag in front of the South Carolina capitol and similar incidents, I had to accept that it had come to represent something I wanted no part of. So my flag hit the waste basket.

    Too bad. Still, one either wants to be associated with neo-Nazis and white supremacists, or one does not. The fact is such groups now "own" those symbols.
     
  13. shana

    shana New Member

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    The excuse about the hair chemicals is laughable at best, horrible at worst: Racism, in its purest form.

    There is just so much wrong with this woman's stance, from singling-out a biracial child (the only non-100% Caucasian in the pool) and then complaining to her father about the cloudy pool water (riiiight)...

    Some may think he (a Caucasian man with a biracial daughter who was visiting) should not have moved-out and should have stood his ground instead. Well, I respect his stated reason for moving, and for the legal action he took thereafter even more so.

    It took just a week for the accused to put-up that sign, and then make ridiculous excuses for it. I hope that she is charged, now that her appeal has been denied.
     
  14. Cypros

    Cypros New Member

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    The "swastika" is one of the oldest abstract symbols. It is found on pottery in Mesopotamia going back about 5000 years ago. It is also found in some of the earliest churches and synagogues (which are in the Middle East). The symbol is also commonly used in east Asia. Its meaning varies from cultural to culture but mostly is linked to the concepts of eternity and well-being. The association of the "swastika" with negative meanings is a modern phenomenon.
     
  15. Jacie Estes

    Jacie Estes Medical Marijuana Advocate

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    Ignorance is ignorance and this woman is displaying just that when she puts the sign up. This woman has chosen to exhibit racism and hatred rather than move forward in her thinking and be accepting of all peoples.

    Hitler, ironically, took the American Indian symbols and perverted them. He studied, along with actions from other cultures/countries, the way that American Indians were treated during the Removal Program of the 1800s; he modeled his campaign of genocide on these. He also modeled after the actions of South Africa and the Boer Wars.
    "Hitler's concept of concentration camps as well as the practicality of genocide owed much, so he claimed, to his studies of English and United States history. He admired the camps for Boer prisoners in South Africa and for the Indians in the wild west; and often praised to his inner circle the efficiency of America's extermination - by starvation and uneven combat - of the red savages who could not be tamed by captivity." P. 202, "Adolph Hitler" by John Toland
    http://www.nemasys.com/ghostwolf/Native/genocide.shtml
     
  16. Nova

    Nova New Member

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    In fairness to the poster who brought it up, it was clear she was talking about Nazi and neo-Nazi swastikas. I'm sure there are exceptions, but in almost all cases, Nazi swastikas are presented in a context such that I don't confuse them with Native American, Near Eastern or Hindi swastikas.
     
  17. chissus

    chissus Member

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    Why do some people go out of their way to hurt people's feelings?
     
  18. LinasK

    LinasK Verified insider- Mark Dribin case

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    Nor Nordic symbols, which also supposedly contain a swastika...
     
  19. Kat

    Kat Kind words do not cost much

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    Can't misconstrue what a sign that says "white's only" on it means.

    Means white's only. That's what it meant when it was made and that's what it means now, especially if it's hung outside of an americana or USA history museum. Pretty straight forward to me. but that's just my humble opinion.

    The thing with people (adults) who have those type of prejudices and are of the disposition to share them either overtly or covertly is we can't teach them a darn thing.

    When their prejudices are that ingrained into who they are (they usually learn them at a very young age) then nobody can show them how narrow minded that is, except life experiences---------and the Law. She needs to be prosecuted and fully. It won't change her mind about her prejudices but it will make her think twice before she acts out again in this way.

    There's nothing wrong with the confederate flag or owning one (except what Nova said, I don't think it needs to be flying over a capital either) there nothing wrong with shakti or the native american symbols that were used by the nazi's who corrupted our image of those symbols by using them. But when you tack up a "White's only" sign by a swimming pool it's kind of like putting a black painted jockey in your front yard. It's not just in poor taste it's sending a message.

    I got her message loud and clear. I think the courts should too. If they don't I'll be kind of surprised. JMHO
     
  20. LinasK

    LinasK Verified insider- Mark Dribin case

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    Calling the sign an "antique" is just a thinly veiled excuse for racism, that's the bottom line! If it were only about polluting pool water with hair chemicals ( which, by-the-way may be a valid concern), then as I stated earlier, she could have generalized her pool policies by requiring everyone who enters to shower/wash their hair before entering the pool. It's really that simple. In the 60's my father owned apartment buildings that had public pools in the complexes. He required everyone with long hair to wear a bathing cap/swim cap, so that the long hair wouldn't clog the drain...
     

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