OR - Public health emergency declared over measles anti-vax hotspot near Portland and NY, Jan 2019

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kaen said:
I think the lack of access to media and internet in some communities means that families make decisions based on community thought processes. Issues that come up are government interference in parental decision-making and the issue that the vaccine will lead to developmental disorders. In the vacuum of information, many groups are opting out. It is dangerous, indeed.

"Around the globe, measles infections were responsible for 110,000 deaths in 2017, the most recent statistical year. Most of them were children under 5." Measles rarely kills in the US -- but when it does, this is how it will happen - CNN
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Now the latest anti-vaxxer claim is that vaccines cause cancer and auto immune disorders. They're going hard on that now.
 
Inthedetails said:
I think some exemptions have to exist. We can't force an injection on people, can we? But, we can do the things we do - you can't register for school without up-to-date vaccines, for example - that ensure that people in large numbers comply.

But I think the emphasis needs to be on public education - and not vilification that just makes people hide or dig in their heels more.

We changed American ideas about smoking, drinking and driving, etc. and we can change minds about vaccines as well. Reaching pocket communities will be a challenge and will likely require an ally within the community, but it's certainly not impossible.

The continued name-calling and vilification will not help at all.

jmo
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You're right. It causes people to dig in their heels and become more defensive and entrenched.

I don't think they're very intelligent, however. They're conspiracy theorists. But if we have to baby them into understanding logic that's fine. It will save lives and prevent serious illnesses.

The problem is that when anyone tries to educate there is an anti-vaxxer mob that drowns them out with a concerted harassment campaign. They find out about a medical group or doctor or parent or whatever, who posts something about the benefits of vaccines and they circulate info on their website and blitz the group or business or person.

And yes, anti-vaxxers are bullied with name calling and death threats on the internet. But not as part of a concerted campaign that includes destroying their businesses.

They make it very hard for logical voices to be heard and for education to result. And that's purposeful:

Kass faced some anger in the hallway after the hearing, he said, with one person calling him “a disgusting liar”. But it wasn’t until several hours later that “the *advertiser censored* hit the fan”. That’s when Kass realized that his Facebook page was being flooded with one-star reviews calling him everything from a “disgrace” and a “pedophile” to a “Nazi pharma shill” and “ shilling for infanticide”. Kass disabled the Yelp-like reviews feature on the page, but that didn’t stop the onslaught, which moved into the page’s comments and across the ecosystem of anti-vaxx Facebook pages and groups. By Monday, five days after his brief testimony, he had compiled a photo gallery with hundreds of screenshots of abusive comments.

Anti-vaxx 'mobs': doctors face harassment campaigns on Facebook


Interviews with mothers who've lost children and with those who spy on anti-vaccination groups, reveal a tactic employed by anti-vaxers: When a child dies, members of the group sometimes encourage each other to go on that parent's Facebook page. The anti-vaxers then post messages telling the parents they're lying and their child never existed,or that the parent murdered them, or that vaccines killed the child, or some combination of all of those.

Nothing is considered too cruel. Just days after their children died, mothers say anti-vaxers on social media called them *advertiser censored*, the c-word and baby killers.

Her son died. And then anti-vaxers attacked her - CNN
 
gitana1 said:
You're right. It causes people to dig in their heels and become more defensive and entrenched.

I don't think they're very intelligent, however. They're conspiracy theorists. But if we have to baby them into understanding logic that's fine. It will save lives and prevent serious illnesses.

The problem is that when anyone tries to educate there is an anti-vaxxer mob that drowns them out with a concerted harassment campaign. They find out about a medical group or doctor or parent or whatever, who posts something about the benefits of vaccines and they circulate info on their website and blitz the group or business or person.

And yes, anti-vaxxers are bullied with name calling and death threats on the internet. But not as part of a concerted campaign that includes destroying their businesses.

They make it very hard for logical voices to be heard and for education to result. And that's purposeful:

Kass faced some anger in the hallway after the hearing, he said, with one person calling him “a disgusting liar”. But it wasn’t until several hours later that “the **** hit the fan”. That’s when Kass realized that his Facebook page was being flooded with one-star reviews calling him everything from a “disgrace” and a “pedophile” to a “Nazi pharma shill” and “******* shilling for infanticide”. Kass disabled the Yelp-like reviews feature on the page, but that didn’t stop the onslaught, which moved into the page’s comments and across the ecosystem of anti-vaxx Facebook pages and groups. By Monday, five days after his brief testimony, he had compiled a photo gallery with hundreds of screenshots of abusive comments.

Anti-vaxx 'mobs': doctors face harassment campaigns on Facebook


Interviews with mothers who've lost children and with those who spy on anti-vaccination groups, reveal a tactic employed by anti-vaxers: When a child dies, members of the group sometimes encourage each other to go on that parent's Facebook page. The anti-vaxers then post messages telling the parents they're lying and their child never existed,or that the parent murdered them, or that vaccines killed the child, or some combination of all of those.

Nothing is considered too cruel. Just days after their children died, mothers say anti-vaxers on social media called them *advertiser censored*, the c-word and baby killers.

Her son died. And then anti-vaxers attacked her - CNN
Click to expand...

And these people can be reached with logic and tolerance?
 
gitana1 said:
You're right. It causes people to dig in their heels and become more defensive and entrenched.

I don't think they're very intelligent, however. They're conspiracy theorists. But if we have to baby them into understanding logic that's fine. It will save lives and prevent serious illnesses.

The problem is that when anyone tries to educate there is an anti-vaxxer mob that drowns them out with a concerted harassment campaign. They find out about a medical group or doctor or parent or whatever, who posts something about the benefits of vaccines and they circulate info on their website and blitz the group or business or person.

And yes, anti-vaxxers are bullied with name calling and death threats on the internet. But not as part of a concerted campaign that includes destroying their businesses.

They make it very hard for logical voices to be heard and for education to result. And that's purposeful:

Kass faced some anger in the hallway after the hearing, he said, with one person calling him “a disgusting liar”. But it wasn’t until several hours later that “the **** hit the fan”. That’s when Kass realized that his Facebook page was being flooded with one-star reviews calling him everything from a “disgrace” and a “pedophile” to a “Nazi pharma shill” and “******* shilling for infanticide”. Kass disabled the Yelp-like reviews feature on the page, but that didn’t stop the onslaught, which moved into the page’s comments and across the ecosystem of anti-vaxx Facebook pages and groups. By Monday, five days after his brief testimony, he had compiled a photo gallery with hundreds of screenshots of abusive comments.

Anti-vaxx 'mobs': doctors face harassment campaigns on Facebook


Interviews with mothers who've lost children and with those who spy on anti-vaccination groups, reveal a tactic employed by anti-vaxers: When a child dies, members of the group sometimes encourage each other to go on that parent's Facebook page. The anti-vaxers then post messages telling the parents they're lying and their child never existed,or that the parent murdered them, or that vaccines killed the child, or some combination of all of those.

Nothing is considered too cruel. Just days after their children died, mothers say anti-vaxers on social media called them *advertiser censored*, the c-word and baby killers.

Her son died. And then anti-vaxers attacked her - CNN
Click to expand...
You bring up a really great point about the onslaughts that happen online. THAT is another huge issue to combat, imo. I know it's not the topic of this thread, but it is a serious problem that needs to be solved. The cultural norm of criticizing each other in online slug fests has gone beyond bad manners and has reached a danger zone.

We have a lot to work on.

jmo
 
NYC health officials warn against 'measles parties' amid biggest outbreak in decades

A public health emergency was declared in New York City on Tuesday due to a measlesoutbreak — and health officials are warning against the idea of "measles parties."

Such parties involve intentionally exposing unvaccinated children to other children with a disease, with the intent that they would get the disease themselves. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) "strongly recommends against hosting or participating in these events."

Orthodox Jews are hosting "measles parties," New York officials say as they order vaccinations to stop outbreak

The high rate of measles is in part attributed to the fact that there are relatively low vaccination rates in Williamsburg's Orthodox community, so the highly contagious and dangerous virus spreads easily. Additionally, Dr. Oxiris Barbot, the New York City health commissioner, said there had been reports of “measles parties” in the area as well. Those parties usually have parents deliberately exposing their children to measles so that they become naturally immune after contracting the virus. The children would then show blood immunity and could return to school.
 
In NYC, bolded by me:

"The current New York outbreak is localized to Brooklyn, in particular a neighborhood with a prevalence of unvaccinated kids. The news prompted Mayor Bill de Blasio to issue a controversial mandate requiring residents in four zip codes to get vaccinated within 48 hours. Since many there cite religious reasons for deciding against vaccinations, there is likely to be legal action."

The 2019 measles outbreak is spreading — here’s what you need to know
 
human said:
And these people can be reached with logic and tolerance?
Click to expand...

Interesting thought. They are so entrenched in their dogma of "Vaccines are the root of all evil", there is no logic in that at all. So, logic isn't going to work.

It is obviously their belief system, whether for religious reasons or whatever..."Suffer the children". Sadly.
 
Replying to myself, regarding the Brooklyn mandatory vaccination order in four zip codes:

Inthedetails said:
Tweet from NYC Health Commissioner:

Commissioner Oxiris Barbot on Twitter

"We are in the midst of a #measles outbreak. People in violation of our order to get vaccinated against measles will get a violation and could be fined $1,000 per instance."
Click to expand...

"To enforce the order, health officials said they did not intend to perform random spot checks on students; instead, as new measles cases arose, officials would check the vaccination records of any individuals who were in contact with those infected.

;The point here is not to fine people but to make it easier for them to get vaccinated,' Dr. Oxiris Barbot, the city’s health commissioner, said at the news conference."


New York Declares Measles Emergency, Requiring Vaccinations in Parts of Brooklyn
 
gitana1 said:
Yes but then why is the OP stating that we have this serious problem with unvaccinated "illegals" entering the country without being inspected?

I've never been asked if I'm ill when traveling internationally. That happens occasionally if there's a serious Ebola outbreak. Otherwise, nope.

And no one has ever asked me at any border for my vaccination record. They don't do that for people immigrating here either.

The point is an illogical one. It doesn't make sense.

1. Immigrants aren't medically inspected.
2. Travelers to this country aren't medically inspected at borders except in the very rare case of an Ebola outbreak.
3. Neither travelers nor immigrants entering legally are required to show proof of vaccination records.
4. People south of the border have good vaccination rates.
5. Most immigrants come here via plane and via visa.
6. Most "illegals" simply overstay a visa.
7. Illegal immigrants aren't dirtier or more disease ridden than Americans.
Click to expand...

I'm a new to posting and very much respect Gitana1's posts, however, as an immigrant to the US, I most definitely DID have to provide proof of vaccination status, and had to have negative HIV, syphilis and TB testing before I received my visa (in my home country).
 
kaen said:
Agree on every single point. Yes. Yes. Yes. In fact, the locus of the NY outbreak comes from people who do not vaccinate and travel to enclaves in Israel that have outbreaks and don't vaccinate as well. This is not about illegal immigration as much as it is about religious exemption of vaccination. Education needs to happen. Public Health officials need to quarantine communities and people who refuse to vaccinate. This is much more serious than the idea of holding a chicken pox party so you don't have to vaccinate your kids.
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Ha! I remember being exposed purposely with my siblings " to get it all over it once " as my mother would say.

I was surprised that it wasn't until 1995 that people got vaccinated for chickenpox in the United States after the vaccine was approved.

And yes, I did get the shingles vaccine
 
Last edited:
This is like week old news here.

Baltimore Jewish leaders issue guidance on measles after case is confirmed in Maryland

Baltimore Jewish leaders issue guidance on measles after case is confirmed in Maryland

In response to the case confirmed last week, the local Jewish organizations advised people who might have been exposed to measles to contact their doctor before going to a doctor’s office and to ensure that children and adults have received both doses of the MMR (measles, mumps and rubella) vaccine. The groups also urged those who have not been vaccinated to avoid public places.

....

Sinai Hospital temporarily bans children under 14 without appointments after measles case

Sinai Hospital temporarily bans children under 14 without appointments after measles case

......

What I heard on radio for the ban is that the patients Dr. is on the facility at Sinai.
 
"New York Mayor Bill de Blasio (D) vowed Thursday that the city would defeat a lawsuit challenging his order for members of a Brooklyn neighborhood experiencing a measles outbreak to get vaccinated or pay a $1,000 fine....

'The more I’m hearing, the more I realize it's a really small group of strong anti-vaccination voices that convinced a number of parents of something that is factually wrong,' de Blasio said, adding: 'We will beat them.'"

De Blasio defends vaccination mandate from planned legal challenge
 
BetteDavisEyes said:
Metro Detroit measles outbreak: Vaccinated before 1989? You may need a booster

41 cases of measles confirmed in Metro Detroit

DETROIT - The number of confirmed cases of measles in Metro Detroit is still 41, but the number is expected to increase as more cases are confirmed.

Local 4's Dr. Frank McGeorge is closely following developments to answer the most common questions...
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This was something I was wondering about. There have been some of these measles cases recently that showed up in people that had been vaccinated. I was wondering if measles had mutated, or if there had been bad batches of vaccine or if adults might need boosters. I know immunization is not 100% and occasionally vaccinated will still get measles, but it just seemed that there were more than there should have been.
 
Should we mandate mandatory vaccinations? No exemptions? That seems a slippery slope to a totalitarian state.

Especially for a country founded on principles of religious freedom.

I once had a form of severe chronic fatigue syndrome flu, about 23 years ago, I have never missed a flu shot since that experience. While flu shots are not mandatory, I completely believe that they reduce influenza levels in society. Some people think that getting a flu shot makes them sick...I don't know.
 
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