GUILTY OR - Whitney Heichel, 21, Gresham, 16 Oct 2012 #5

Discussion in 'Recently Sentenced and Beyond' started by Knox, Oct 16, 2012.

Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.
  1. La Louve

    La Louve For Whitney and Teghan

    Messages:
    2,184
    Likes Received:
    1,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I understood your meaning.
    I don't think any of your scenarios are "impossible" but I also don't think they are likely. For the reasons I stated before, I think JH pulled into the gas station intending to get only as much gas as he could in a short amount of time, and asked the attendant for maybe $5 worth. He would want to limit the amount of time the car was visible to the security cameras and people at the station. He gets his $5 worth, a bit over a gallon, heads to another station a couple blocks away (the T/A), gets another gallon or so, and now he has enough to drive up to Larch Mountain and back to the Walmart.
     
  2. PoirotryInMotion

    PoirotryInMotion Registered Muser

    Messages:
    4,284
    Likes Received:
    16
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Thanks for the answers. And the clarification (its discovery then led searchers to the Dodge Park items, down the road a ways). Just trying to place if the sweater had evidence that would indicate it was left there prior to or after her murder, to establish route pattern possibilities. Unknown to general public at this time, I gather.
     
  3. Quester

    Quester New Member

    Messages:
    4,724
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    0
    … He said the first clue they found was Heichel's sweater. …
    … The searchers began to realize the situation was dire when they found Heichel's sweater. …


    http://www.katu.com/news/local/Sear...-first-clue-found-by-searchers-175893161.html
    [FONT=&quot]
    dire[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]/dī(ə)r/[/FONT]
    [FONT=&quot]Adjective:[/FONT]

    1. [FONT=&quot](of a situation or event) Extremely serious or urgent.[/FONT]
    2. [FONT=&quot](of a warning or threat) Presaging disaster.[/FONT]

    From the above descriptions and definitions, I made the following assumptions: the sweater was deposited after the murder and most likely had blood on it which would have triggered a sense of seriousness/reason to worry that something terrible had already happened/involved injury or death - "the situation was dire". If there was no blood on the sweater, one wouldn't automatically and immediately sense the situation was "dire". JMVHO

    Do we know which was found first, the SUV or the sweater? TIA
     
  4. Boodles

    Boodles Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,325
    Likes Received:
    2,839
    Trophy Points:
    113
    They found the Explorer at Walmart, and later that day found the sweater. It seems the situation would have been "dire" when they found the SUV with all the blood in it. :( Maybe they didn't see the blood since they were told not to touch the car. But they must have looked in the back to see if she was in the vehicle. (I would have.)
    http://www.oregonlive.com/gresham/index.ssf/2012/10/post_14.html
     
  5. Sasquatch

    Sasquatch Member

    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    16
    I keep having to correct the name Pleasant Home Road, because I keep calling it Pleasant Hill Road. I never even knew there was a small town named Pleasant Home until this case.

    We also have to figure out if the sweater was a cardigan or pullover sweater or a main piece of clothing. That tells a story as well.
     
  6. Desdemona

    Desdemona * * * * Desi * * * *

    Messages:
    767
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    As for Whitney's Explorer being found first, and then the sweater....

    See, I was not able to find any reference to the sweater in the timeline of "finds" in the article you linked.

    re-linking the article for reference:
    http://www.oregonlive.com/gresham/index.ssf/2012/10/post_14.html

    And other articles refer to the sweater as the 'first clue found' but do not specify WHEN it was found... That's why I was asking earlier whether it might have been found prior to her vehicle.
     
  7. Desdemona

    Desdemona * * * * Desi * * * *

    Messages:
    767
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    I regret that it will seem rude that I've made several posts this evening, and will not be waiting around for further discussion. Due to some information I learned tonight, I won't be posting in this thread any more. My apologies for sounding mysterious; the reason is not something to be posted here.

    In the meantime, will be following Whitney's case with you all, and will be praying she and her family will be granted justice.

    :seeya: Cheers to all!
     
  8. Sasquatch

    Sasquatch Member

    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    16
    Thank you for the great discussions and contributions!
    It was great reading your posts!
     
  9. Glow

    Glow Active Member

    Messages:
    2,551
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    38
    Half baked idea here...

    Remember when we wondered if there were two cell phones or three? Or the reports of the phone being thrown "in the lake" "in the grass beside the lake" or "found in the turn out"?

    So applying that to the finding of the sweater....

    what if the sweater/coat is the same garment? Depending on what reporter is interviewing which witness, some might call a hoodie a "coat" others might call it a "sweater".

    Dont know if this applies but just wondering if maybe the various reports are talking about the same garment just describing it differently.
     
  10. Boodles

    Boodles Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    4,325
    Likes Received:
    2,839
    Trophy Points:
    113
    There are so many sources of data, it's difficult to keep track.

    But in the linked article it says, among other things, they found the car, then.... "Later that day, investigators found more of Heichel's belongings in a trash bin at a nearby shopping center. Around the same time,they received information that the SUV had been driven into Clackamas County soon after her disappearance.

    Junginger said a search team organized by the Heichel family's church found "additional evidence" late Tuesday near Dodge Park, but he would not elaborate."

    Since they later told us the sweater was found near Dodge Park, I'm deducing the "additional evidence" was, at minimum, the sweater, found on Dodge Park Blvd.

    It may be documented also in the PDF or the Gresham PD timeline.
     
  11. Sasquatch

    Sasquatch Member

    Messages:
    423
    Likes Received:
    6
    Trophy Points:
    16
    That is a real possibility. The mention of a coat found in Dodge Park was from a letter from one of the church elders. I believe it was retracted due to some errors. It is easy to confuse Dodge Park Road and Dodge Park when you hear it. The coat could have easily been the sweater. The main reporting was a sweater found at Dodge Park Blvd and Pleasant Home Road and that evidence was found at dodge park. What valuable evidence that they found at Dodge Park, is still yet to be determined. The Dodge Park evidence wasn't put into any of the reports released to the public.
     
  12. windrower

    windrower Well-Known Member

    Messages:
    360
    Likes Received:
    1,083
    Trophy Points:
    93

    Longtime reader here, though I rarely post. But I want to say I will miss your keen observations and logical dissemination of the information regarding Whitney's murder. You have been a voice of reason, and I appreciate your efforts to stay tethered to the truth.
     
  13. La Louve

    La Louve For Whitney and Teghan

    Messages:
    2,184
    Likes Received:
    1,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    I agree it is confusing. I can also envision that Whitney might've worn both a coat and a sweater that morning. The weather was rainy and temps had recently gotten a lot cooler. She could have worn a sweater for warmth and a light raincoat to keep her dry. I do that a lot in the fall around here when it's not really cold enough for a big heavy winter coat, but I need something to protect me from the rain and to stay a bit warm.

    Also about the timeline of which was found first, the sweater or the Explorer, does anyone else local recall the tv news that day? I worked from home and followed the story pretty much all day. KGW broke in with updates a couple times and I remember when they announced that her car had been found by the search groups around 1pm. I want to say that was the first thing announced as being found, but I just can't remember for sure.
     
  14. Xavier

    Xavier New Member

    Messages:
    955
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0

    La Louve--- Yes, I can see you theory.

    IMO, Holt's not going to casually roll into Shell to get gas.

    He's probably skittish, freaked out anyways. IMO he knew he needed a good gas fill up to drive a long distance to complete the crime.

    To cut short the first gas fill up, I believe he saw someone he knew at Shell gas station. Put yourelf in Holt's position. Would'nt you get out of there fast if you saw a familiar face? He probably saw messages on WH's cell phone come pouring in by the minute. Maybe Holt saw a text message on WH's cell phone from someone saying they saw her SUV at the Shell station?

    There are alot of scenarios possible. I look at Holt's rushed, manic behavior like your newly engaged fiancee at the theatre cheating on you but she leaves quickly because she does'nt want to get busted.
     
  15. Xavier

    Xavier New Member

    Messages:
    955
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
    We don't know enough information yet. The national stir on this case has everyone quiet on providing any more details.

    As for the bloody sweater. IMO the crime labs can determine pretty much down to the hour how the texture, composition of the blood was when found and would be able to determine a timeline of WH's time of death/murder.
     
  16. JulieR

    JulieR New Member

    Messages:
    967
    Likes Received:
    7
    Trophy Points:
    0
    Sorry if this has been posted, its just so sad and sweet. This family is so amazing, I am so glad there are so many looking after them.


    http://portlandtribune.com/pt/9-news/122908-whitneys-voice-still-speaks-to-family-

    She disappears into an office and emerges hunched over, dragging a bin too heavy to carry. It’s filled to the brim with letters. She pulls it in front of the couch, sits down and grabs a handful at random reading the postmarks.

    Orlando. Austin, Texas. San Diego. New Jersey. North Platte, Neb. One from all 50 states and countries around the world.

    Thousands of letters are stacked before her. At Clint’s apartment there’s another bin.

    “Because of the widespread acknowledgment of Whitney’s death and who she was, we’ve been given an opportunity that most people don’t have when they mourn,” she says. “We’ve been given a reason to rejoice. Not just in the hope, but in what we have right now.”

    At a time when faith in humanity could be lost, for this family, it’s been renewed.

    “We can lose faith in an individual,” Lorilei says. “But our faith in humanity is stronger because of Jehovah’s outpouring of abundant love to us through his people.”

    But the pain is still there, bubbling up in quiet moments alone. “Those are often the toughest,” she says. “There hasn’t been a day that’s gone by that I haven’t cried.”

    For Clint, it’s hardest at night. “Just before you go to bed and there’s that quiet,” he says. “Normally it’s the time where I would talk about the day or she would talk about the day — that’s the hardest for me because she’s not there. Going to bed by myself, she’s not there. Waking up in the middle of the night and looking over to her side of the bed — she’s not there. Waking up in the morning on her side of the bed because she’s not there.”

    But in those moments, where silence was always filled with her tender voice, Clint plays the message.
     
  17. Glow

    Glow Active Member

    Messages:
    2,551
    Likes Received:
    1
    Trophy Points:
    38
    I think it might have been posted but thank you for sharing it.

    It really speaks to the heart of the matter doesn't it? While we can get very specific about details and timelines and motivations, at the end of the day, this wonderful, loving family lost their daughter, sister, wife.

    Life has changed for them forever because of the heinous act of another but they still have their faith in humanity intact. It is so heartwarming to know they havent been robbed of that also. It really speaks to why Whitney was so special to so many when we see the family that she came from and the character being displayed now under such a hard time.
     
  18. La Louve

    La Louve For Whitney and Teghan

    Messages:
    2,184
    Likes Received:
    1,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    BBM
    Xavier I disagree with your assumption that JH stopped at the gas station with the intent to fill the tank. He would not need a full tank to get to Larch Mountain from the Shell Station. I believe the distance is only about 10-15 miles each way. If the Explorer averages 15MPG, it would take a couple gallons to get up to Larch and back to the Walmart. He also would have been freaked out, as you say, and in a hurry to dispose of Whitney's body and dump the Explorer and other evidence. That does not lend itself, IMO, to someone then pulling into the gas station, saying "fill it up" and then waiting the interminable minutes while the tank is filled.

    If JH had pulled in and asked for the tank to be filled, once the attendant had started the filling process s/he most likely would have walked away to help another customer. Under your theory, JH would have then seen someone at the gas station that he knew and decided he needed to get out of that gas station fast. So without drawing any more attention to a vehicle with a broken out passenger window and possibly a dead woman in the back seat under a pile of table linens, JH would have called for the attendant and asked to stop the fill-up, OR JH would have gotten out of the Explorer (possibly with blood on his clothes), removed the nozzle from the tank himself (which by then would have alarmed the attendant) and hurriedly driven off. Each of those scenarios draws more attention to Holt and the Explorer, not less.

    Putting myself in Holt's place, once I knew I needed gas for the Explorer, I would have wanted to get in and out of that gas station as quickly as possible and draw as little attention to myself as possible. That would have been my intent the moment I pulled up to the pump. I would not have risked longer exposure by choosing to sit there a good five or ten minutes or so while the tank was being filled.
     
  19. La Louve

    La Louve For Whitney and Teghan

    Messages:
    2,184
    Likes Received:
    1,673
    Trophy Points:
    113
    Thank you for sharing this again. I got so choked up the first time I read it I had to stop and come back to it later.

    What has struck me throughout this ordeal is how gracefully Whitney's family and spiritual community have tangibly expressed and embodied their beliefs. Whitney's light continues to shine.
     
  20. caffeinejean

    caffeinejean New Member

    Messages:
    177
    Likes Received:
    0
    Trophy Points:
    0
Thread Status:
Not open for further replies.

Share This Page



  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice