ACTIVE SEARCH PA - Linda Stoltzfoos, 18, Bird-in-Hand, Lancaster County, 21 June 2020 *arrest*

Discussion in 'Missing Persons Discussion' started by TTF14, Jun 22, 2020.

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  1. Yemelyan

    Yemelyan Well-Known Member

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    I fear this could be foul play, sadly. But I hope it isn't.

    For those who are familiar with Lancaster or Amish communities in general, if it IS foul play.....what percentage chance would you place the offender is from outside the Amish community vs. an Amish person inside the community?
     


  2. Sillybilly

    Sillybilly Administrator Staff Member Administrator Moderator

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    Speculation needs to be based on some known fact that is in MSM.

    Unless there is MSM or info from LE that states Linda has some mental disability or is on the spectrum, that discussion is not productive and simply derails the thread with many posts that may not even be relevant.

    Please move on from that discussion.

    Thanks.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2020
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  3. Hereshecomes75

    Hereshecomes75 Well-Known Member

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    If it is foul play, my thoughts are that it would almost certainly be someone not Amish. I can recall a very few Amish women in Pennsylvania who were killed by their husbands. Obviously that’s not the case here.

    But the only Amish murder victims I can think of in Lancaster County were killed by non-Amish people. Naomi Huyard was killed in 1982 by a teenaged neighbor when she went to their house to put food in a freezer they shared. The boy was Mennonite, not Amish. And then of course there are the victims of the 2006 Nickel Mines shooting. Charlie Roberts was a milk truck driver known to the Amish but was not Amish.

    So not that there’s a lot of precedent to consider, thankfully, but it seems like a perpetrator would likely be not Amish but not a total stranger to the community either. I think if someone from inside the Amish community were involved with Linda’s disappearance, her family and friends would have been able to give LE something to go on, whether it was an actual issue between Linda and this person or just someone whose actions surrounding the disappearance seemed suspicious.
     
  4. Lusitana

    Lusitana Well-Known Member

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    I'm sort of leaning to someone that knew Linda and her family. When a girl goes missing, I always tend to think that a boy/man is the perpetrator, but girls can do it too. If Linda had a suitor, what are the chances of a girl in the community being jelous?
     
  5. belleyes

    belleyes LOOK I learned how to type a user title.

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    I believe it would be highly unlikely to be a jealous amish girl.
     
  6. Hereshecomes75

    Hereshecomes75 Well-Known Member

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    I agree. I feel like a girl who’d be jealous and mean-spirited enough to fatally harm another girl would be a real anomaly and would stand out in the community.
     
  7. oceanblueeyes

    oceanblueeyes Well-Known Member

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    Sadly in today's time if she was kidnapped by a predator, and that is my belief at this time, it could be anyone in the area at the time she went missing into thin air. I wouldn't discount the offender being amish themselves.

    I believe many crimes may go unreported such as rapes, DV etc. in the amish community. Jmo.

    No one no matter where they live or who they are aren't immune from being targets of sexual predators who strike when they see an opportunity to do so.

    Imo, for predators their targets are selected when they feel the opportunity is right. Many times when it happens in daylight no one sees or hears a thing. They usually select their victim when they see them alone at the time, and vulnerable with no one else around.

    I've read extensively through the years about sexual predators. Even before they strike they are fully prepared in case an opportunity arises. They have long fantasized what they will do way before they kidnap their first victim.

    Unfortunately for their victims they are very good at what they do. They arent some frightening looking monsters, but look just like everyone else. They can come across as very unassuming, and safe.

    However when neccessary when kidnapping a victim they can be ruthless in order to control the victim by paralyzing fear. It's whatever works for them at the time they seize their victims.

    They are also known to take the abducted victim to another location, even possibly to their own home or property to rape, and even murder the victim or murder them elsewhere. If they put the remains in another area from where the rape, and murder occurred it can be what they consider their comfort zone which can be close by or many miles away.

    Also we have seen where the suspect puts the body inside of their home like a crawl space, inside walls, basement, or buried under their porch. Etc.

    They know police must have probable cause to be able to search any private home or property.

    So it could literally be anyone who was in the area at the time she disappeared without a trace. It could turnout to be someone who is the least likely to be suspected who lives in the town or surrounding areas.

    For all we know the offender could have been stalking her for awhile without her knowing ....tracking her daily routines. While most predators select targets based solely on the opportunity at the time...some do stalk their selected targets first, and then act when they see them walking alone.

    If deceased, her body may not have been put outside in the elements such as farmland etc. She could be inside of someone's home buried or concealed somewhere in or under the home or has been buried in an outbuilding.

    Finding the body of a missing person is truly looking for a tiny needle in a huge haystack with LE not even knowing which haystack to look in nor knowing if the elusive haystack may be inside instead of outside.

    Jmhoo
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2020
  8. Yemelyan

    Yemelyan Well-Known Member

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    RSBM.

    This was what I worried about when I posed my question. I had heard there were undercurrents of sexual abuse in Amish communities and it does make me wonder if a predator could arise in a community like that, hidden in motivation to other Amish people. We don't know how LE is working and what intelligence they've received. It may be that there is someone suspected by the community, or it could be that the thought is still unfathomable.
     
  9. Rotten apple

    Rotten apple Well-Known Member

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    No, a Pre-K to 8 school in Mt. Joy! I’m familiar with LMH though as my daughter has had sports practices there :)
     
  10. Blue Ridge

    Blue Ridge Armchair Detective

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    Where are you, Linda?
    It's been a whole week now.

    :(
     
  11. Rosiebones

    Rosiebones Well-Known Member

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    Was there an awareness in this Amish community of the Sasha Krause (Mennonite) in New Mexico murder to consider a copycat scenario?
     
  12. oceanblueeyes

    oceanblueeyes Well-Known Member

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    I didn't save the link I read this morning. I'm sorry, but it's easy to find. Just google Lancaster, PA crime rate.

    I would gladly do it myself, but darn it, I don't know how to do links from my cell phone. LOL! Yes, I'm old. :)

    Anyway, I was curious so I looked up the violent crime rate for Lancaster, PA, and I was shocked by what I read.

    It said per capita it's in the 12% of LEAST safest cities for violent crime. In other words 88% of all other cities in our nation per capita are safer.

    I'm sure the violent crime spills over into BIH too since it's a little over six miles from Lancaster.

    That data per capita comes from reported violent crimes. I still feel there may be numerous violent crimes that have happened in this area that go unreported for various reasons.

    jmho
     
  13. am80

    am80 Well-Known Member

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    Lancaster, PA is very diverse and covers many zip codes. You have “ Lancaster city”, then you have suburban Lancaster, then there is country Lancaster. There are very safe areas throughout Lancaster and there are some the not-so-safe areas.
     
  14. Hereshecomes75

    Hereshecomes75 Well-Known Member

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    Very true. And most of the violent crimes in Lancaster are very clearly drug-related and concentrated in a few areas.

    Bird In Hand, PA - Crime Stats & Rates | Homefacts


    This link is (ideally, if it comes out right) to the crime rate in East Lampeter Township, of which Bird-in-Hand is a part. Not much violence here. The larceny/theft category seems pretty high because of the Walmart super center and outlet malls that are also in the township.
     
  15. sds71

    sds71 Well-Known Member

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  16. TTF14

    TTF14 Spaceship Headlight Pattern Expert

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    Extremely diverse!

    I'm leaning toward stranger abduction/crime of opportunity, though, which, to me, says "localish" perpetrator. Not necessarily Amish, and in fact probably not, but probably familiar with the Amish community.
     
  17. CuriousQuiet1

    CuriousQuiet1 Well-Known Member

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    Questioning as others have about LS not coming home Sunday but not being named as a missing person until Monday... Isn't this totally ordinary for someone 18 years old? I have no idea what the laws are or what the accepted normal practice of local LE is, but I have read time and time again in true crime stories that you can't file a missing person report on someone 18 or older until they are missing for days. This makes total sense to me. Most 12 year olds missing for a few hours is a scary story. Many 18 year olds missing for a day or two is a teenager testing their independence.

    MOO, I'm trying to make sense of the missing person report coming out Monday, I am NOT trying to cast aspersions on the family or LE. It makes sense to me that no matter how long she was missing LE had to wait to investigate because she is an adult.
     
  18. GordianKnot

    GordianKnot On Time Out

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    BBM:

    No, that's not true.
    There is no requisite "waiting period" before someone can be reported missing to LE, either minors OR adults:

    https://pittsburghpa.gov/files/police/orders/ch4/43-02-Missing-Person-Investigations.pdf

    SABBM:
    1. 3.0 CLASSIFICATION OF MISSING PERSONS

    2. 3.1 A person may be declared missing when his or her whereabouts are unknown and unexplainable for a period of time that is regarded, by a responsible person that is closely associated with the missing person, as highly unusual or suspicious in comparison to the missing person’s behavior patterns, known plans, or routines.

    3. 3.2 The PBP does not have a waiting period for reporting any missing person.

      3.2.1 The Federal Crime Control Act of 1990 (42 U.S.C. 579 (a)) eliminated any waiting period before initiating an investigation of a missing person under the age of twenty-one (21) and reporting that person to the National Crime Information Center (NCIC).

      3.2.1.1 Officers will manage reports of missing persons eighteen (18) to twenty (20) years of age consistent with this general order and without regard to their adult status.
    _______________________

    The idea that you have to wait 24 or 48 hours to file a mp report is a fairly common, but dangerous misconception.

    When someone goes missing, time is of the essence.

    JMO.
     
    Last edited: Jun 28, 2020
  19. Lusitana

    Lusitana Well-Known Member

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    I do get what you're saying, but I don't believe waiting days before reported someone (of any age) mising is not the best idea. But I do understand your point, by logic, a 12-year-old girl not coming home on a Sunday night is way more concerning than a 18-year-old girl not coming home on a Sunday night. But it depends on your 18-year-old. If your 18-year-old doesn't do stuff like this, if her friends came home, if she's the quiet, shy type... then it's cause for concern, as opposed to another 18-year-old girl that sleeps over at friends houses, that goes to graduation parties, that is outgoing, etc.
     
  20. dally_doodle

    dally_doodle Well-Known Member

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    From the news articles I’ve read along side the posts that were made by family/admin she wasn’t reported missing until the next day because they were all asleep when she was supposed to have arrive back home. It wasn’t until they woke up to see her not there did they report her missing.

    also, I can say that as a 911 dispatcher people call ALL THE TIME to report people missing. Sometimes they are only missing for 30 minutes when police are called. A report may not be made by the officer at that time when 911 was called but at least where I dispatch at, we do not tell the caller to wait. We still send an officer & have them better advise. & while a report may not be made, the call stays on file.
     
    Last edited: Jun 29, 2020
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