PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #14

Discussion in '2000's Missing' started by J. J. in Phila, Apr 18, 2015.

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  1. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    My understanding was that both PEF's and LG's polygraphs were intense. I don't think that either murdered RFG, partly for the reasons Trackergd mentioned.
     


  2. BigCat

    BigCat New Member

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    I believe a physically fit male with a law enforcement background could possibly make it happen. His chances of success would increase significantly if RFG knew and trusted him. It's a stretch. However, it's more realistic than a professional hit man, IMO.
     
  3. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    The problem is the law enforcement officer, or nearly anyone else, getting him into Lewisburg for a clandestine meeting.
     
  4. SuperSmith

    SuperSmith Former Member

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    List your top 5 pieces of evidence that he was even in Lewisburg.
     
  5. SuperSmith

    SuperSmith Former Member

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    What if you were told that Ray Gricar was never in Lewisburg April 15th? How would that change your perspective of the case?
     
  6. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    I shall:

    1. The Mini was in Lewisburg.

    2. Witnesses saw RFG driving the Mini in Lewisburg, including where it was found.

    3. RFG's scent was detected in the parking lot where the witnesses saw him driving the Mini and where the Mini was found.

    4. His DNA was found in the water bottle in the Mini.

    4. The laptop was found in Lewisburg.

    5. A witness reported seeing him with a laptop in Lewisburg in the Mini.

    6. While it has not been released, the Centre Hall witness saw the Mini, with RFG in it, tuning at a time when it would have reached the Packwood House at the time it was spotted.

    7. Some witnesses reported RFG in Lewisburg at times/locations that corroborate the other witnesses.

    A. While not proof he reached to Lewisburg, getting the map to Lewisburg on his office computer indicates his intent to go there.

    B. While not proof he reached Lewisburg, the cell call indicates he was going in that direction.
     
  7. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    I would question the accuracy of the person telling me this.
     
  8. SuperSmith

    SuperSmith Former Member

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    Tracker, I look forward to your unbiased opinion on this. This question was posed for your response. Thank you
     
  9. TechWriter797

    TechWriter797 Registered Voter

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    That map still bothers me. Why did he need to print a map? He surely knew how to get there.

    Reasons why he might print the map (and not bring it with him):

    - to fax to someone who was going to meet him there and who was not familiar with that area
    - to add up the mileage for an expense report
    - to provide a clue as to where he was going in case something happened to him

    Any other possibilities?
     
  10. DeDee

    DeDee Well-Known Member

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    This case has troubled me since it occurred. When I 1st learned of it, my thoughts were: A prestigious DA does not just "walk away".

    Could the bottle of water containing Gicar's DNA have been in his car overnight and not freshly purchased? At some point, someone sat in the Mini's driver's seat, smoking, and perhaps wore gloves. I do not believe Ray was in the Mini at that time. Someone else had already taken Ray away.

    Not any reason for Ray Gicar to go to Lewisburg with his computer unless he needed it with him while in Lewisburg. The day before he had gone to an odd location near water. It's possible he was looking there for a secure place to drop the computer and hard drive.

    How much Penn State info had he garnered up to this point? Had he been warned not to go any further with the investigation that became the destruction JMO of Lou Paterno and the now Convicted Jerry Sandusky at Penn State?

    JHMO
     
  11. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    There is suggestion that he printed the map, only that he searched it out. He could have wanted to check the mileage for reimbursement, but this wasn't suppose to be anything official. Further, it was out of his jurisdiction.

    As a clue, why not leave it on his desk? This was in his search history. Someone would have go into his (locked?) office and then turned on his password protected computer, and then checked the search history, to find it.

    One theory I have is that he was checking the time or mileage for someone else. RFG was known to to be a fast driver. If he was giving instructions to someone that didn't drive as fast, he could have checked the time for him.her. It might be when the person would have to leave to be "on time" in Lewisburg.
     
  12. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    Respectfully snipped.


    It is possible, but no killed could have known for sure that his DNA was in the water.


    He had talked to people about losing the data on the laptop, a year or more before he disappeared. It might have been unrelated.

    BTW, he didn't have that laptop during the 1998 investigation of Sandusky.
     
  13. SuperSmith

    SuperSmith Former Member

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    No map was printed........
     
  14. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    I left out the "no." There is no suggestion that a map was printed. There was no map left behind in the office, at the house, or in the Mini.
     
  15. SuperSmith

    SuperSmith Former Member

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    There was also no indication exactly who did the search for directions and more importantly when the the search for directions done. Keep in mind several coworkers had access and his password to log in.
     
  16. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    I am not sure that any coworker had his password or access to his individual office. The computer was password protected.

    Further, the police said that RFG did the searches, as per Disappeared.
     
  17. SuperSmith

    SuperSmith Former Member

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    Per Law Enforcment a coworker gave them access to Gricars computer and apparently there was more than one with entry access
     
  18. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    It also could have been the county IT person, who might have general access to all county computers, but not someone who could just walk into his office. I'm not sure LE ever claimed a "coworker." Would you have a citation? JKA indicated that she didn't know.
     
  19. SuperSmith

    SuperSmith Former Member

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    Well, lucky for you and others I AM sure.
     
  20. J. J. in Phila

    J. J. in Phila Verified Insider

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    Well, do you have a citation? Centre County does have IT people in all probability. There may be master "administrator" account, but again, it would not be anyone in the office.
     
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