PA PA - Ray Gricar, 59, Bellefonte, 15 April 2005 - #16

[minazoe]

I feel like Ray went to LB and met up with a woman.
then, someone ( a third party drove around and located them).
the third party waited until Ray was alone.
the third party pulled up along side Ray and asked if they could just talk.
I think Ray said ok but let me move my car. This is when he moves the car.
Ray got into the car with the third party.

this is where Ray lost his life.

I think someone took Ray's keys to search the car and make sure there was no clue in the car to lead back to this person.

this is my scenario and I'm sticking to it. for now! Lolz..damm this case! mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

It would be unusual for RFG to voluntarily park the car where is was, unless he was planning not to return. He was fanatical about the Mini. Where he parked it was under trees, with birds, and possibly sap.

 

[minazoe]

hmm..well then maybe he never moved the mini... still though. the mini could have been moved to buy time. maybe off the street so it might be missed! Why would Ray park it there at all then?

why?

wouldn't he want the car to be nice for his daughter? why would he do something so against his nature? people don't change, they don't. A conscientious parker is not going to park his
car under a coconut tree.

I find that quite odd...now Im more convinced it wasn't he who moved the car. mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

hmm..well then maybe he never moved the mini... still though. the mini could have been moved to buy time. maybe off the street so it might be missed! Why would Ray park it there at all then?

why?

wouldn't he want the car to be nice for his daughter? why would he do something so against his nature? people don't change, they don't. A conscientious parker is not going to park his
car under a coconut tree.

I find that quite odd...now Im more convinced it wasn't he who moved the car. mOO

First, it wasn't his car. He paid for it and put it in PEF's name.

Second, one very good reason to park the car where he did is so that it would be difficult to see from the street, at least until the lot emptied out.

 

[minazoe]

So you are basing a suicide conclusion on where he parked the car that day? Why was he so persnickety about a car he gave to PF? I don't get it. What a weird relationship this is. I mean... men buy women cars all the time, I'm sure, but they don't buy a woman a car that is really for them. Ray is just the most maddening person. lolz mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

So you are basing a suicide conclusion on where he parked the car that day? Why was he so persnickety about a car he gave to PF? I don't get it. What a weird relationship this is. I mean... men buy women cars all the time, I'm sure, but they don't buy a woman a car that is really for them. Ray is just the most maddening person. lolz mOO

PEF almost never drove it; she had her own car.

Where do you idea that that I concluded suicide? It is evidence that RFG was doing something voluntary? Yes, if he was the final person to drive the car. That doesn't rule out homicide.

 

[minazoe]

So Ray bought this car ( that he was persnickety about) and then transferred the title to PEF? how did this go down and when? strange. By the way I knew this but forgot...mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

So Ray bought this car ( that he was persnickety about) and then transferred the title to PEF? how did this go down and when? strange. mOO

No transfer; when RFG bought the car, he put it in PEF's name.

 

[minazoe]

do you think it was a security measure? there was no financing involved..well now this gives me more thoughts. Do you know if the Mini was brand new when purchased?

this makes me think of Ray as someone who likes sock away cash, maybe hide money.
wonder the terms of Ray's divorce.
when a certain relative of mine had a scandal divorce with teenage children and affairs, he lost his retirement plan. ( in the divorce his retirement cash out will go directly to his ex wife). I know Rays daughter is the recipient of his retirement correct?

Ray is someone with secrets.
Ray would rather die than pay his ex wife anything and hides his assets anyway he can.
Ray would rather die than pay taxes to the government and carefully plans so as to pay the very least.
Ray likes to look like a nobody on paper.
Ray has money hidden.
Ray put on a show of domestic happiness for his career
Ray never married PF
Ray was very complicated and duplicitous
Ray was a ladies man? ( ladies men are often men who cannot control themselves and love the drama).
Ray is the type of man who can walk away and disappear.
Ray left very small paltry estate...very basic belongings etc, unimpressive house, low key cars, small savings.
did we ever look to see if any women went missing around the time Ray did?

where is all Ray's money????? he can pay cash for a car but has little saved according to his worth at death. he didn't withdraw a large amount prior to vanishing. Surely as the DA he was making 6 figures. Or close, I know it's awhile back.

his office and life seem neat an organized so surely he was not throwing money around.

I think he was hoarding money . maybe he had an escape plan in case something were to blow up. Could have been he was secretly planning this for long, long time.

Just knowing he might have to bail. wether for emotional reasons or something else.

mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

It was not a security measure. He parked the Mini in the space reserved for the DA at the courthouse. My understanding is that PEF and his daughter each got half. The money, however, was basically a payout from his pension.

 

[minazoe]

I can see some reasons why he might have constructed an escape hatch.

Also his best friend thinking Ray walked has weight... thing is sometimes this can be denial on the part of the friend. However these are grown men and I'm sure they know a bit about each other.

most of my questions revolve around the reliability of witnesses and the suppressive feeling
around details of his actual life as something feels as though it's missing.

if there is no chance that the car was contaminated by LE. the cigarette ash is a clue .
the moving of the car. ( possible effort to buy time by hiding it from the street). so the question is why if he had hours and hours before anyone could possibly think he might be missing...why would he need to buy more time if this was a suicide? it seems so odd.

so the cigarette ash still remains the biggest clue.

and the opinion of a best friend.

and his scarce finances...

mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Zero chance that the ash was contamination from LE. The smelled the smoke when they opened the car.

There is a lot of circumstantial evidence pointing to walk away, even more to something voluntary, i.e. walk away or suicide. There is still a strong chance that it could be foul play, of some type.

 

[minazoe]

yeah the ash is a total mystery and a clue. mOO

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Tomorrow is the 15th anniversary of RFG's disappearance. Coronavirus coverage will probably bump most, if any, stories on the case.

 

[J. J. in Phila]

I have heard about a media story coming out.

 

[swanniee11]

www.pennlive.com has a new article but I am not subscribed to it so I couldn't open it. Is there anyone here that is a member?

 

[J. J. in Phila]

It was good.

It looked at a number of theories and the reporter looked at "mine shaft guy" again; the reporter talked to Buehner's contact. On that, the detail changed that the mine shaft was supposedly in state game land and under water. Neither detail matches the original story that he gave Buehner. However, both details were discussed here at the time. Further, as far as I can tell, both details were discussed here at the time. (I suspect he was reading this site.)

McKnight's witness was identified as accountant Donald Houser, who had apparently met RFG.

Tony Gricar now says that he didn't think the laptop could have been tossed from the driver's side of the Mini.

Buehner, when confronted with the financials, said, “You would have thought he would have more money in his bank accounts, things like that. But he apparently didn’t.”

Public defender Deborah Lux mentioned that RGF had an, in the words of the reporter, "an almost boyish sense of humor."

 

[SeekingJana]

Remembering Ray Gricar today, whether he's in this world or in heaven, he deserves to be remembered for being a loving dad, a nice man ( I always thought he had a twinkling 'mischievous fun' look in his eyes in candid photos), and a respected District Attorney.
Likely, he had many more positive attributes that the public is not privy to, as well.

Godspeed, Ray!

 

[sammyed]

Thinking of Ray today on anniversary of him going missing. One unanswered is this, I couldn't find answer to if DNA was determined
Human remains still unidentified as investigation broadens

 

[J. J. in Phila]

Thinking of Ray today on anniversary of him going missing. One unanswered is this, I couldn't find answer to if DNA was determined
Human remains still unidentified as investigation broadens

He was identified. A man who had been treated at the local hospital.

I think he was basically wander/vagabond.

Authorities identify remains of man found in Bedford County