Poll: Was Shannan Gilbert Murdered?

Discussion in 'LISK CLOSED General Discussion Threads' started by PreciousDust, Jul 24, 2012.

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Was Shannan Gilbert Murdered?

  1. Yes, and I have a POI in mind (and he's among those who can be talked about at WS)

    33 vote(s)
    14.3%
  2. Yes, and I have a POI in mind (though he's not presently among those who can be talked about here)

    15 vote(s)
    6.5%
  3. Yes, I think she was, and I have some theories, but no specific person in mind.

    59 vote(s)
    25.5%
  4. If I had to guess, I'd guess that "yes", she was murdered.

    65 vote(s)
    28.1%
  5. If I had to guess, I'd guess that "no", she was not murdered.

    32 vote(s)
    13.9%
  6. No, I firmly believe (think) Shannan Gilbert was not murdered.

    27 vote(s)
    11.7%
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  1. PreciousDust

    PreciousDust Active Member

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  2. mcme

    mcme Driven away

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    While I do not think SG was murdered, I'm not close minded to any other reasonable explanation that is supported by the things we know as fact.
     
  3. WI1987

    WI1987 Member

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    Im not sure, I am on the fence with this one ... I switch back and forth as I think about the case.

    Right now I lean towards no, she was probably not murdered but like Mcme I wouldent be all that surprised if she was.
     
  4. Justiceforever

    Justiceforever New Member

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    Thats how I feel too!
     
  5. hawkshaw

    hawkshaw Well-Known Member

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    You tend to lean to she wasn't murdered. As a person that is reported to be a retired/active escort your opinions carry a lot of weight with me.
     
  6. Justiceforever

    Justiceforever New Member

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    Well now Im not so sure thats true. Before I can make up my mind though I need at least these questions answered. 1. Did she or didnt she have her purse when GC saw her?
    2. Did he or didnt he let her inside his house? 3. When her driver said he never saw her again did he mean after she bolted out of JBs house or after she bolted out from behind the boat.
     
  7. Justiceforever

    Justiceforever New Member

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    I ve heard conflicting answers to these ??? Thats what has me on the fence. Anybody know difinitively?
     
  8. fieldnotes

    fieldnotes Member

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    I asked Gus that at the Dec 2011 vigil and he said he didn't remember seeing it but couldn't say for sure because it may have been under her jacket which was slung over her shoulder. It's a very good question.
     
  9. Justiceforever

    Justiceforever New Member

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    I want to elaborate and I will in another day or two when Im in a hotel room on my laptop..yping on this phone in a moving truck sucks! ps retired for five years
     
  10. Justiceforever

    Justiceforever New Member

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    Thank u...I had read that he said she didnt have it. Sure wish he knew for sure
     
  11. Just K

    Just K New Member

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    As of this moment 28 of 34 members believe that SG was murdered. That is just over 82%.
     
  12. woodstick

    woodstick New Member

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    I would add a pocketbook content to these questions. What info did LE get from it? Any phone numbers, names, anything?
    Any cross examinations with known written notes of GB4?
     
  13. Peter Brendt

    Peter Brendt New Member

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    Well, there are some thousand other WS members, who didn't even vote. And even if, what does it say to us? It means, 28 are followers of the "foul play" theory, the same group, that refuses since a year or longer to explain the obvious problems with their theory. Maybe I should put up another question list and watch how they wriggle around?
     
  14. twocuriouscats

    twocuriouscats Searching for Killer Owls

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    Hi JK,
    That's a really good point IMO about Blue...how could he have missed her???
    One other point I wonder about - didn't ANY of those well to do Oak Beach residences have video cameras? I'm pretty sure that's how LE identified Sierra Lamar's alledged abductor - from cameras in the neighborhood.
     
  15. twocuriouscats

    twocuriouscats Searching for Killer Owls

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    Go for it.
     
  16. Peter Brendt

    Peter Brendt New Member

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    Naah, that would be the same list as the last two times and we know, there were no answers to those the last two times. I mean, how can you defend a theory with reasonable arguments if it needs a time warp in the first place to explain how any of their suspects could find SG, abduct or kill her from inside the marsh and still be back when the patrol car arrived. So, we also know, there are no reasonable answers to make that "foul play" theory credible.
    The sad part is, with all this, the chance to get one of the suspects at least for negligent manslaughter goes slimmer and slimmer by the day.
     
  17. Sillybilly

    Sillybilly Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    <bbm>

    IIRC, MP had left Oak Beach before LE arrived.

    I'm certainly not convinced that SG was in the marsh when LE first responded, and IMO, there are equally as many questions unanswered that have the potential to support the foul play theories as there are related to an unfortunate misadventure.
     
  18. Sillybilly

    Sillybilly Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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  19. Peter Brendt

    Peter Brendt New Member

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    So MP left before LE arrived and was interviewed later? That makes him still a witness. And Coletti's statement places him near Coletti's house just minutes after Coletti saw SG hiding behind the boat and then running off. So, either, he was searching after that still for SG or he left Oak Beach. If he left Oak Beach, he had no time to find her and kill her. Which excludes MP.
    JB was at the house when the police arrived. Nothing indicates, he was even searching for her. But if he was, he had about 20 minutes to find her, kill her (hide her body in his basement, spray some lime on her to prevent her from smelling), wash the clothes, he had on, dry them, put them on before the police arrived. And this, without knowing where SG was hiding in the first place, so technically unable to find her quickly in the first place. So that excludes JB. That leaves us with the drifter. He would have about the same time and same conditions to find and kill her, so by all means, without time warp, no way.

    Okay, but you asked for it. So here comes my list of questions and I aks you to deliver for each of them an at least possible explanation, including all known facts. You can post your list as well and I will do my best to do the same (tomorrow probably, since I will go out next time).

    1.) Why on Earth would someone who plans to kill a person, let the would-be victim talk 22 minutes to the police without interfering? Why would said wannabe-killer let his victim then escape if not because he would have postponed the whole operation? Because during this 9/11 for at least 18 minutes (this was the time, the original articles reported) NOBODY actually tried to kill her.

    2.) How would someone in the time frame between the moment Coletti saw SG running off from that boat to the time, police arrived, be able to find her and clean himself from all traces of running through the marsh which would have pulled the officer's attention.

    3.) Since she wore her pants when Coletti saw her, the pants only could have come off AFTER she went into the marsh. So you have to add the time a rape would take to the anyway too narrow time frame. How do you explain that?

    4.) It is simply impossible to move skeletal remains to another site without moving the one or the other bone and without twisting the then pretty brittle tendons in a typical way. Also the ground under the body would show in the chemical analysis, nothing of human size decomposed there. The ME would have noticed such signs and they would have raised red flags. So how do you explain why nothing of this was in the reports to the media instead of that rather embarrassing but credible "undetermined COD"? And please, without a conspiracy theory that involves all LE and the ME's office because that is not what I would consider reasonable.

    5.) SG's behavior was confused and paranoid. She wasn't during the 9/11 not only unable to give them an address (which would still be explainable), but also unable to give the name of the man who owned the house, unable to give any hint where she was in fact (that indicates, she didn't even know at this time, she was in Oak Beach, she was near the ocean, she was in a gated community). How do you explain that?

    6.) After she "escaped" from the house, she ran pass some houses and ended up at Coletti's place. Coletti called the police. She, instead of going into the house, ran off again, first hiding behind the boat and when Pak and his SUV appeared, running off into the marsh. So, why did she hide behind the boat instead of going in? Was that in any way reasonable? Or was it paranoid panic?

    7.) Mari Gilbert once told, her daughter hated water and swimming and so on. So SG wouldn't have gone even near the water in her normal mindset. Still, she flees into a marsh of which she had to assume, it would only lead her down to the water. So something made her unable to follow her normal behavioral patterns. If not drugs, or a symptom of her untreated bipolar disorder, or both at once, what is your explanation?

    8.) If you look, where Coletti's place is, where her belongings were found and where her body was found, you can see, she wasn't able to hold a straight direction anymore. We know, daylight had set in. So she could see where she was going. What, if not utter confusion and paranoid panic could have caused her to run the way she ran?

    I think, I will limit it to that. But feel free to make a longer list, that way we get this stuff off the table.
     
  20. Just K

    Just K New Member

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    (BBM and Red Font BM: ITA, there is no public data to support SG having been in the brush for 18 months...none what-so-ever.)
    First of all, we don't know if she was taken away by Pak, Brewer or some do-gooder or taken in by a neighbor. We also don't know if she died in May, June, or even December 2010.

    If there is a serial killer and she somehow was killed by the same dude, then he could have held her for any amount of time. He had six and a half months to dump her remains before Blue found the first four. Whoever killed her had a total of 18 months to dump her 100 ft off the side of the road. Maybe her killer had her remains in a container or bag and decided to make it look as if she was just another victim of a serial killer. For all we know, she was kept in a large freezer and dumped months later. Thus allowing her remains to decompose in one place.

    ETA: We cannot assume she died on May 1st, 2nd, 3rd...whatever...we have no idea when she actually died.
     
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