Possible Victim: Shannan Gilbert #2

Sallyla

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I am impressed with the fact that so many people on this site can determine from listening to an audio recording, that SG was either in a drug induced breakdown, and or a psychotic state, or having a mental episode. Most medical practitioners take many hours to diagnose what is really going on with a patient.

Agreed a lot of what she said does not make sense.

I have to believe, someone at the SCPD heard something on the call that they did not want the public to hear. Could it be 'they are trying to kill me'?

All I know for sure Shannan said that someone was trying to kill her, and she ended up dead.
I think it was her saying to Michael Pak ‘You’ve been in on this since the start’ which implies an organised, pre-arranged plan to kill her for which she was brought to Gilgo.

People seem to be overlooking that and it’s strange given that there were women deliberately brought to the same area when there was a pre-arranged plan to kill them.
 

3Patriots

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Same. It is just so hard to trust him at all when I see him together with Bellone. And he had been endorsed by Bellone. Other than that, I have heard good things about him. My prediction is they are going to choose one man that is involved and have him take the fall for the whole thing. For some sort of payoff. I'm thinking that CPH is possibly in bad health and they are going to peg him for the whole thing...as we see being set up by John Ray, Frank Mackay, Joe Brewer, and Scalise all along. I think they can't let the truth come out because too many power players are involved and it can never come to light b/c the depth of it all...and how high up it goes. I think Hackett's family is going to get some sort of payoff for him taking the fall. Just my best guess at this point.
This is probably very close to the truth
 

goathairjones

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MP sounds very calculated and deliberate in the 911 call. Idk, I’m not buying it.
Shannan screaming sounds pretty distressed to me, I don’t know how anyone could make the assessment that she ‘was not distressed’.
I cleared MP in my head a long time ago. But after hearing the 911 call, I think he is prime suspect #1 now. He was part of the snuff crew.
 

JazzCPK

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After hearing that 911 call, I can't help but think of the Elisa Lam disappearance. Both SG and EL had bipolar disorder and both were known to stop taking their medicine for it. Both seemingly had a paranoid episode. Both women's bodies were found after that supposed episode, with high suspicion of foul play, but no conclusive evidence of it. I also think of the elevator video of EL that was released and dissected by the public for clues about her supposed killer. Just a thought that crossed my mind.
 

EpiVox444

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Why did it take this long to release this 911 call ? I don't understand. All this rumor and speculation about Brewer and Pak could have been put to bed years ago . It's infuriating.

Has anyone posted a transcript of this yet ?
As you can see from this thread and other forums/reddit, it hasn't stopped the crazy speculation one bit. The conspiracy side have only deepened their positions.. I lean toward her death is just what the SCPD claimed all along, 'death by misadventure'. Sad, but just not related directly to the actual
LISK case.
 
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3Patriots

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Given the now available calls, here's my theory on Shannan:

For starters, I did/do believe that her case IS related to GB4. I also did/do NOT believe she died at the hand of another.

I believe her evening began like the others, serving as the entertainment for a group of folks - several of them being OB residents, the rest being a select group of individuals who may be of local significance. I also believe her evening would have gone on like the others, with her ending up the victim of a homicide. Instead, I believe she did frantically scramble from THAT potential situation into the marsh, already in a VERY physiologically excited state, under the influence of some substance, and collapsed and eventually expired from a medical emergency. Could be exhaustion, heart attack, overdose, stroke, or a combination. Her belongings being found elsewhere suggest to me that she may have fallen into the marsh for a minute. If you don't know what this is like, think quicksand. Beyond difficult to pull yourself out of, and would actually be likely to slide out of your pants to get free. Her location 130 feet from a roadway, especially when compared to the others, leads me to the conclusion of her traversing the marsh until she becomes trapped a second time and/or collapses.

My theory is she arrives at the house and begins to party. I do believe there are others there and this has a "party" atmosphere. I believe there is an OB resident who is responsible for the presence of mood-altering substances, whether or not he himself was actually present. I believe there is another OB resident of some prominence present. And I believe there may be a few others there as well also of some local significance. As they party, Shannan begins to succumb to the effects of something in her drink. Her voice on the phone sounds like benzodiazepines, barbiturates, or both. Maybe an opioid, but I don't think so. As she falls further under influence, I think the group there gets a little more aggressive in what they try with her and, whether directly or indirectly, she becomes aware that the risk of something grave is very real.

My guess is that as those who have a REAL interest in NOT being identified hear/see her calling police, they get out of there. That alone would explain Shannan's fear, especially in an altered mental status, of ALSO leaving - going outside where a group of her attackers just went. It would also explain why she runs from Pak, who otherwise should be her security and why she blames him for being in on it. In her head, he's trying to bring her outside where her attackers are.

I can qualify the hell out of this even more, but that's the crux of it.
 

Mountain_Kat

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As you can see from this thread and other forums/reddit, it hasn't stopped the crazy speculation one bit. The conspiracy side have only deepened their positions.. I lean toward her death is just what the SCPD claimed all along, 'death by misadventure'. Sad, but just not related directly to the actual
LISK case.

One thing I have done from the start of this case is to separate Shannan ( and other victims ) from Melissa, Maureen, Megan and Amber. Not that I could say that they all definitely weren't the work of one serial killer, but simply because there are very obvious commonalities between the Gilgo 4 that I don't see among any of the other victims. For me, hearing this 911 call cements the wisdom of doing that.
 

WINDSOR

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Making an official diagnosis and realizing that someone is off are two different things. You don't need to be a psychiatrist to know that she wasn't making much sense.
Agreed, but two things I want to emphasize, people are not saying 'something is off' they are using diagnostic terms, secondly context is everything. I think any of us would sound 'off' if were felt we were facing eminent death.
 

hafom8840

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Before the call was released I once considered the possibility that SG was being stalked by the LISK outside of JB's house but the two men were completely oblivious to this
 

kdsmith21

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can anyone that lives in Suffolk County NY or is a paying member of their Clerk of Court website obtain the copy of the arrest report of June 23 2009? I would love to see what was in the arrest and booking report for Shannan. I know locally ours are free and you get all the details of what evidence prompted the warrant and how the arrest went down . Names might be redacted but you get a lot of information. I tried to find a free copy online and only saw where you can call or write the Suffolk Court house. I may actually call them this week if no one knows how to get a copy and see if I can get it emailed to me
 

kdsmith21

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Given the now available calls, here's my theory on Shannan:

For starters, I did/do believe that her case IS related to GB4. I also did/do NOT believe she died at the hand of another.

I believe her evening began like the others, serving as the entertainment for a group of folks - several of them being OB residents, the rest being a select group of individuals who may be of local significance. I also believe her evening would have gone on like the others, with her ending up the victim of a homicide. Instead, I believe she did frantically scramble from THAT potential situation into the marsh, already in a VERY physiologically excited state, under the influence of some substance, and collapsed and eventually expired from a medical emergency. Could be exhaustion, heart attack, overdose, stroke, or a combination. Her belongings being found elsewhere suggest to me that she may have fallen into the marsh for a minute. If you don't know what this is like, think quicksand. Beyond difficult to pull yourself out of, and would actually be likely to slide out of your pants to get free. Her location 130 feet from a roadway, especially when compared to the others, leads me to the conclusion of her traversing the marsh until she becomes trapped a second time and/or collapses.

My theory is she arrives at the house and begins to party. I do believe there are others there and this has a "party" atmosphere. I believe there is an OB resident who is responsible for the presence of mood-altering substances, whether or not he himself was actually present. I believe there is another OB resident of some prominence present. And I believe there may be a few others there as well also of some local significance. As they party, Shannan begins to succumb to the effects of something in her drink. Her voice on the phone sounds like benzodiazepines, barbiturates, or both. Maybe an opioid, but I don't think so. As she falls further under influence, I think the group there gets a little more aggressive in what they try with her and, whether directly or indirectly, she becomes aware that the risk of something grave is very real.

My guess is that as those who have a REAL interest in NOT being identified hear/see her calling police, they get out of there. That alone would explain Shannan's fear, especially in an altered mental status, of ALSO leaving - going outside where a group of her attackers just went. It would also explain why she runs from Pak, who otherwise should be her security and why she blames him for being in on it. In her head, he's trying to bring her outside where her attackers are.

I can qualify the hell out of this even more, but that's the crux of it.
agree 1000%
 

kdsmith21

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My goodness. Listening to the call is unsettling. IMO something was a catalyst for her reaction to the situation. At times she sounded coherent and others not so much. Whatever that trigger was it likely caused her death. When looking at the map of where she was running, it is still hard to tell why and how she ended in the marsh area. It was pitch dark. Correct me if I am wrong but didn't she remove most of her clothing along the way? Something else I can't fully wrap my head around. Maybe it is just me but I am still not sure why the 911 calls needed to be held in secrecy for so long.
certain drugs, Meth for example, can cause serious delusions (my ex bf was an addict and I have seen the crazy stuff he believed and did).. and also makes you very very hot. he would be in shorts in the winter, turn off the heat inthe house and open ALL the windows and put box fans (more than 1 fan) blowing from outside the house (winter air) blowing inside the house. I would wake up freezing. And he would be almost sweating. Just for an idea of how hot meth can make you. Maybe other drugs also have the same affect?

So, we will never know what for sure, but it definitely fits meth. And Molly MDMA in crystal form could be meth instead, they look very similar. If someone wanted to trick her or whoever sold it gave someone meth instead of MDMA for whatever reason. Drug dealers aren't exactly scrupulous.
 

kdsmith21

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I have never been more convinced that the SCPD has provided accurate information about this case since day one. There is also, in my opinion, absolutely no evidence on this audio that JB/MP were trying to harm her or threatened her, etc. As a matter of fact, they both sounded at times, truly confused as to why she's acting this way (MP can clearly be heard saying "you're freaking me out" at one point).

With this said, the real interesting thing about this call is more with respect to attorney John Ray. He has stated for years that the SCPD synopsis of this phone call was 'outrageously false'. But, I have to be honest, I think the SCPD summary of this call was absolutely spot on. Shannan did not sound frantic at all. Disturbed, sure. But she is alarmingly calm for someone who is in danger. She sounds like someone on a bad psychedelic trip, or perhaps having a true psychotic break. Nevertheless, really unbelievable that we finally can hear this audio, after over a decade.
agreed. What really strikes me is she begs Pak to get her out of there and then screams when he tries to make her leave, she goes banging on doors and then runs from the help of Gus. These things to me seem like paranoia. Induced by more than just paranoia fear. Either a substance (alcohol or drugs) or a mental break or both.

Her inability to answer simple questions with a reasonable answer at all. Not even her phone number. Her answers are not relating to the 911 operators questions. I did think its odd that the 911 operator keeps asking her questions and never asks if it is safe for her to even talk? like maybe she didn't want the people in the house to hear her?
 

DrQ

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I know for a fact that Shannan did not die in that marsh! She was placed there! The reason I say this is because the place where she was found was searched multiple times by police, canines, police cadets and the FBI Blackhawk helicopter. As a matter of fact, I have a picture of the FBI Blackhawk helicopter directly over the spot where her body was found. If her body was there on the day the Blackhawk helicopter was over that spot, it would have been picked up by the hyperspectral camera onboard! And if her body was there the entire time, it would have been found by the multiple police, canines and police cadets that searched that location on several different occasions! Her body was dumped there, 20 feet off the Ocean Parkway at a later date.
I am not familiar with LI and have only seen pictures. Can you please clarify some things? Please correct me if I am wrong.
1. Given my limited understanding of the area, in early reports it indicated that SG was found in a marsh area about 500 yards from the deck of the strange doctor's house in Oak Beach. The pictures of the area released with the 911 call didn't look close to a highway. There was a marsh with a stream.
2. Again, sorry for my lack of knowledge of the area. Isn't Ocean Parkway where the GB4 were found? I thought SG was found in the Oak Beach area.

Are these the same locations or is there some distance between GB4 and SG? I've watched the documentaries and googled but it is an unfamiliar to me.
thanks!
 

DrQ

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certain drugs, Meth for example, can cause serious delusions (my ex bf was an addict and I have seen the crazy stuff he believed and did).. and also makes you very very hot. he would be in shorts in the winter, turn off the heat inthe house and open ALL the windows and put box fans (more than 1 fan) blowing from outside the house (winter air) blowing inside the house. I would wake up freezing. And he would be almost sweating. Just for an idea of how hot meth can make you. Maybe other drugs also have the same affect?

So, we will never know what for sure, but it definitely fits meth. And Molly MDMA in crystal form could be meth instead, they look very similar. If someone wanted to trick her or whoever sold it gave someone meth instead of MDMA for whatever reason. Drug dealers aren't exactly scrupulous.
Whatever was going on with at that time definitely was not good. Sad
 

kdsmith21

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can anyone that lives in Suffolk County NY or is a paying member of their Clerk of Court website obtain the copy of the arrest report of June 23 2009? I would love to see what was in the arrest and booking report for Shannan. I know locally ours are free and you get all the details of what evidence prompted the warrant and how the arrest went down . Names might be redacted but you get a lot of information. I tried to find a free copy online and only saw where you can call or write the Suffolk Court house. I may actually call them this week if no one knows how to get a copy and see if I can get it emailed to me
I meant HOBOKEN NJ... the report of June 23 2009. I think I figured out how to request the report from the county. I will update when I find out more. I submitted a request for the arrest report today. Apparently its not available online
 

3Patriots

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I am not familiar with LI and have only seen pictures. Can you please clarify some things? Please correct me if I am wrong.
1. Given my limited understanding of the area, in early reports it indicated that SG was found in a marsh area about 500 yards from the deck of the strange doctor's house in Oak Beach. The pictures of the area released with the 911 call didn't look close to a highway. There was a marsh with a stream.
2. Again, sorry for my lack of knowledge of the area. Isn't Ocean Parkway where the GB4 were found? I thought SG was found in the Oak Beach area.

Are these the same locations or is there some distance between GB4 and SG? I've watched the documentaries and googled but it is an unfamiliar to me.
thanks!
Her remains were located approximately 500 yards from that location, yes. That location is also only 150-175 feet from eastbound Ocean Parkway.
Her approximate location was
40.6400290, -73.2713135
GB4 were approximately
40.6243159, -73.3767588
 
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