Post verdict discussion of evidence

Discussion in 'Nancy Cooper' started by sunshine05, May 7, 2011.

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  1. sunshine05

    sunshine05 New Member

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    Moderators - is it okay if I start a new thread to discuss some remaining questions regarding this case? ( If you need to delete this I will understand.)

    Since the alleged spoofed call was such an important part of his alibi....he knew he would be videotaped, he knew his receipts would be checked...why buy green juice? IF he was doing the HT trips only to provide proof that he was out and received that 6:40 call from NC, why not really make it believable and pick up apple juice for the kids? Remember, IF he is the murderer, the entire purpose of these trips was ALIBI.

    Cummings pointed out that he picked up the green juice because he was thirsty, but that makes no sense. He just murdered someone and this trip is his alibi story. He can't get it wrong, he knew he would be on camera.

    That's another thing that points to innocence, imo. He wouldn't have bought green juice for himself if he was doing this for "show". Why go to all that trouble to spoof a call and make a mistake of buying something for himself when NC just called to tell him to get juice for the kids?

    And I'm not even suggesting that B didn't drink green juice, just why not make it really convincing by picking up kid-typical juice? He was acting natural because he didn't commit the crime.
     
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  3. lib's mom

    lib's mom New Member

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    Good idea for a thread! I can't seem to let this thing go yet. Know what I can't get past? Nancy's cell phone. Not only the awesome wiping job done on it, but the fact that they tossed the cell phone of a missing/murdered person in a desk and didn't bother with it for what, 10 days? This makes sense?
     
  4. sunshine05

    sunshine05 New Member

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    I know. And the interview with HP, Dismukes says "we got what we needed from that phone". What did that mean???

    I believe Raleigh PD would have been on that phone on 7/12 to see if it may help find her. It is so unbelievable to just let it sit there!
     
  5. ncsu95

    ncsu95 New Member

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    I didn't realize until today that they didn't have a search warrant for his network equipment until October. Same for the "missing shoes". Why did they wait so long?
     
  6. nctekguy

    nctekguy New Member

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    The post verdict reaction (by the Cary police and town officials) was a big disappointment. It looks to me like they took away precisely the wrong lesson from this case :waitasec:.
     
  7. MrsWendy

    MrsWendy New Member

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    In every trial it's easy to play monday morning quarterback and analyze the manner in which the police handled the investigation. It's not unusual to be able to find one or two things that the police should have done differently. But the number of things that the Cary police did wrong in this case is absolutely shocking.

    What is really bad is that the town of Cary and the head of the town police seem to think that the verdict completely vindicated them and showed that they did an excellent job. But it didn't.
     
  8. sunshine05

    sunshine05 New Member

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    Listening to Det. Daniels testimony. 15 people called in and said they saw someone who they thought could be Nancy. 15!!!!
     
  9. Madflava

    Madflava New Member

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    Not only that but the stomach contents dont match the timeline. When I bring this up to people the answer is "Well maybe she threw up." There's no evidence she threw up. Maybe aliens came and pumped her stomach too.

    You can explain away all the evidence with "Well maybe this happened..." but its not the jury's job to formulate their own theory. The prosecution also threw out tons of speculation and just hoped some of it stuck which it apparently did.

    So......

    1 - Spoofed call no one can prove was spoofed or even how he could have spoofed it for that long of a duration.

    2 - Stomach contents which line up with the call being real and her going running. "Maybe she threw up".. okay, where and why did no one find a trace of physical evidence to support that?

    3 - Multiple people thought they saw her.

    I still think she got jumped while running either by someone she knew or the van occupants and just because there havent been any more incidents in Cary means nothing, if it was a random act. If I killed someone and someone else was taking the fall for it, I sure wouldnt be out killing someone else to pull the suspicion away from whoever is on trial for it.

    Its just hard to believe this guy planned the perfect crime and then completely botched it in the 11th hour but managed to cover himself forensically in every manner possible.

    Thats pretty hard to get around.
     
  10. LyndyLoo

    LyndyLoo Active Member

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    I have mentioned this many times throughout the Trial, but for some reason people keep relying on the stomach contents of Nancy to suggest she MUST have been alive at 7AM to go jogging...However, It is understood that the stomach digests and empties between 4-6 hours of eating...and since Nancy was at this dinner party (which she took ribs) about 630PM July 11th, She no doubt had her meal fairly early in the evening....so do the math I guess.. Food is one thing, however fluid or beverages consumed is entirely another as she was seen drinking up and until close to going home...

    Heres the link to Stomach Contents and utilizing it to TOD~~
    http://myweb.dal.ca/jvandomm/forensicbotany/plantanatomy.html

    Time since death can be approximated by the state of digestion of the stomach contents. It normally takes at least a couple of hours for food to pass from the stomach to the small intestine; a meal still largely in the stomach implies death shortly after eating, while an empty or nearly-empty stomach suggests a longer time period between eating and death (Batten, 1995). However, there are numerous mitigating factors to take into account: the extent to which the food had been chewed, the amount of fat and protein present, physical activity undertaken by the victim prior to death, mood of the victim, physiological variation from person to person. All these factors affect the rate at which food passes through the digestive tract. Pathologists are generally hesitant to base a precise time of death on the evidence of stomach contents alone.
     
  11. zenreaper

    zenreaper New Member

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    Throwing up certainly does not lower ones BAC either.
     
  12. oenophile

    oenophile New Member

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    As many know, I firmly believe the evidence shows that an innocent man was convicted of murder here. Regardless of that, there are several things I still want to know:

    1. What were the details of NC being seen by the four year old? Who did she say that to? Did she provide any specifics?
    2. What did happen to that missing router? Was it really missing?
    3. Based on the interview with Kurtz afterwards, its clear that BC claimed that he did not do that google search on that day. (He may have several days later). What are the real details of the claims of tampering? What capabilities would be required to do such a tampering? This still isn't really clear. The only thing that has been shown is that there is evidence of tampering.
     
  13. sunshine05

    sunshine05 New Member

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    1) The 4 yo child (B) was staying with Clea Morwick that afternoon. CM told police that B told her she saw her mom that morning in black shorts and a white t-shirt. Nothing more ever came of this. Police apparently did not question the child about this or if they did, they never shared the info. with defense.

    2) I don't think we know. This is just my opinion, but if BC needed a specific type of router just to spoof a call, he would have just taken one from the recycled/used area at Cisco and used it and then threw it away. It makes no sense that he would have used the 3825 that he ordered. There is information indicating that another team had possession of it. It is really unclear. But the router in question is for commercial applications, not home.

    3) The details of tampering were invalid time stamps, static files, a deleted watermark and a deleted cookie related to the search were not from 7/11. As far as how the tampering could have occurred, if you go back and watch JW's testimony, he shows ways it could have been done, fairly easily. That's about all I know about it. GM's testimony provided quite a bit of detail about what he suspects was tampering too. (that is the Proof testimony from 4/28 I think).
     
  14. BrownRice

    BrownRice Well-Known Member

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    But NONE of the callers were the woman anybody saw out there running? She (or they) has/have never surfaced.

    I can't get this trial out of my mind. I am just unsettled.
     
  15. sunshine05

    sunshine05 New Member

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    Another thing that bothers me about this case is how much attention was made about BC's affair, as if that indicated motive. It *could* if the suspect were still involved in the affair and wanted to off the spouse to be with the person they are having an affair with, but that doesn't apply in this case. The affair had nothing at all to do with this case, except that it was the reason for the divorce. I guess I'm just puzzled that the state made this such a large part of the case when it wouldn't have had anything to do with motive. I still fail to see what the motive was.
     
  16. azwildcat

    azwildcat New Member

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    Among other things I'd like to know the importance of the ducks and decorative sticks. Why were they mentioned as often as they were?
     
  17. Bottle Cap

    Bottle Cap New Member

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    Yikes, this thread looks like a big old BII festival.

    Nobody knew BC. Nobody hand a handle on what sort of man he is, he seemed to be devoid of the sort of personality characteristics that usually distinguish a person. IMO, that's what's drawn so many supporters to him. He's like a blank slate, a movie screen upon which all sorts of things can be projected. Want to see an innocent martyr? There's your blank slate. Want to see a victim of injustice? There's your blank slate.

    Want to see a murderer? Look at the circumstantial evidence and use common sense. Wonder where the shoes are, and wonder why NC slept with the bedroom door locked. Imagine the blank slate stalking his previous girlfriend. The blankness takes on a far more sinister quality, in light of how he has dealt with women who want to leave him.
     
  18. Rigby

    Rigby New Member

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    While I'm still not sure how to process everything, if I was going to go to the trouble of tampering with BC's computer to make him look guilty, I'd do better than planting a 41 second Google search. I'd search for something obvious, like "strangulation." Plus, if BC did that search AFTER NC's body was found instead of before, why didn't he mention that when asked about Fielding in the depo?

    We didn't get to see the FBI testimony, which IMHO helped sway the jury.

    Realizing there are no winners, even with this case over (for now).
     
  19. huck22

    huck22 New Member

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    As a quiet, introverted man, this quote scares the hell out of me. I've always followed the Twain mindset that it's better to be thought a fool than to open your mouth and remove all doubt. Gossip queens are far worse because they inject their opinions into the minds of others, who often accept those words as fact.
     
  20. Danielle59

    Danielle59 New Member

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    Her friends said she was eating throughout the evening.
     
  21. momto3kids

    momto3kids New Member

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    Being a BDI, I won’t deny the defense put up a good fight, at times placed doubt with me. I feel the pros/LE dropped the ball at times.
    Not here to argue or say anyone is wrong for their conclusion, but I have my reason like every individual on WS has.

    1-I believe the “lay of the land,” is an important factor for the Cooper home, HT’s, Fielding Drive, Lochmere, Triangle Academy, etc.
    a) Different routes to each location can be taken, but not all were identified, because he didn't identify them as his route, but a possibility. Ex: New Waverly Place is a short cut to HT which misses a stop light, also has dumpsters.
    b) Cary Pkwy ends approx. 1 mile from BC home where it meets HS Rd. Different LE jurisdictions. CPD is Cary Pwky and HS Rd is WCSD.
    c) Cell tower sits within sight of the intersection of Cary Pkwy and HS Rd, this is not Cary land, but Wake Co. Was there a ping off that tower, because I admit I don’t know.
    d) as funny as it sounds, Lochmere has a large volume of yard sales in sSat mornings in the summer. Over 1600 homes causes much confusion for non-area seekers and slowing of traffic. Could be a reason he changed direction to HT. BC stating that is like telling LE he was in a rush.

    2- (1b) brings me to the license tag. Many ask why would he drive around to attract attention with no tag? This is one of my biggest RED flags which I only wish had been investigated further.
    a)It was safer going to Fielding than getting the 24/7 traffic cam to catch the tag and ID it. Tag off, tag on...with the exception of 1 bolt. Haste makes waste.
    b)CPD just doesn’t sit on the city limit line and WCSD has nowhere to sit unless on Cary Pkwy which isn’t their jurisdiction. A safe place to travel IMO.
    c)DD stated in his testimony a screw gun was located in the pantry/mud room. Just random to have one in a room right after exiting the garage? I don’t buy random at all.

    3-KL testified 2x and did a deposition about BC behavior.
    a)It certainly shows arguments, treatment to NC and the emotional roller coaster he had NC on. How many of us would think of our husband going behind us on a fresh painted wall and putting spackle on it not as controlling?
    b)He refused to buy her samples of paint and wanted only gallons before she tested colors? The list goes on in her affidavit.
    c)They couldn’t put items in BC trunk for the B-Day party. Full already and not B-Day items. Spotless after NC disappears? IMO, who’d rather have a spotless trunk and not spotless car.

    4-Dr Hilkey a forensic psychologist states BC is narcissistic and arrogant with anxiety and anger issues. IMO, BC is a classic case.

    5- Tire tracks and foot prints.
    a)Did anyone think of the portable light source brought in almost immediately? (yes, pros dropped the ball on this). There is a photo of it and appears to fit the width being discussed as many stated, golf cart size.
    b)Foot print couldn’t be done because of mud and distortion. EMS was 1st to go to body and covered it up. IMO, rain on the 14th distorted any previous footprint before NC was located.

    6- IMHO it is someone bigger, stronger, taller than NC. Who fits that bill? 3 minutes is a long time to conclude the job. From what it appears no struggle, NC didn’t have a fighting chance!


    All the debate over IT, google map, BC’s office equipment, etc wasn’t asked to be reviewed by the jury. It appears they used a simple strategy KISS.
    BC had Means Motive and Opportunity.
     
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