Psychological Markers

The SK in both GB4 and AC4 killings is an Organized Killer. You're absolutely right. He's methodical, but all SK's choose either feeble, weak victims, or victims that are easy pickings, such as prostitutes. In the AC4, it appears that he likely accelerated his cravings to more difficult targets than prostitutes. They were all mothers of small children.

I agree completely with the religious aspect, also. Again, the majority of SK's/psychopaths intertwine scripture &/or biblical tenets into their twisted thinking. That's probably why the GB4 victims were all "wrapped very carefully in burlap", while burlap is considered "sackcloth" indicating the religious ignominy of "sackcloth & ashes". This is a Mission Killer, just the Florida Profiler and you have suggested. They were NOT placed in burlap sacks, btw. I was a little disappointed that Josh & Rachel looked only at burlap bags and stated there was no place to get them. They just weren't aware that burlap is sold everywhere in the U.S. in large rolls called "bolts". The detectives commented that the SK had "large amounts of burlap available". He didn't sew bags together, and they weren't "stuffed" in burlap bags.

docrocker's quote has been edited for content.

I can't help thinking about "wolf in sheeps clothing", and this religious aspect. I'm suspecting that this SK is more than just a religious person, but an actual member of the clergy.

It would explain, why safety precautions were not adhered to in many cases. It would explain the positions of the bodies and the placements of the faces toward the east. It would explain the ritualistic number 4.
It would explain why there has been such radio silence from the police, especially if we're talking about a powerful religous organization. If this person was involved relationship, it could explain the thought of more than one person involved. If this person had money either siphoned from his church coffers or inherited, it would explain the offer of good money for the night.

Sorry if this has already been addressed before.
 
Theres probably more than one degenerate perv on backpage trying to lure/demean/beat/rape/kill working girls on Long Island. And probably more than a few in the New York metro area. LISK would likely seem like a well mannered, well off, generally nice guy, compared to the other scum these girls see daily. I dont think he would show his true intentions until he has complete control over the girl and the situation. Pretty working girls like the GB4, probably have one or two nice older gentleman, who do treat them well and throw money at them on a regular basis. Or they have at least came across similar men before. I imagine this is the persona LISK is trying to portray while luring women. Also girls probably appreciate men like that, and might try to go the extra mile to make the John happy, thinking they will be rewarded for it. Either LISK is the smoothest talker ever , or he has met these girls prior and put them at ease.

You would be surprised. I have known working girls. And after doing it awhile, it becomes their norm. So to you, selling strange men sex may seem very dangerous, but to them its just another day at work. And like i said before, all the men these girls encounter are not jerks, some are probably just lonely older men who do treat them well and don't mind spending big bucks for a pretty girls time. This is who LISK is trying to camouflage himself as. My opinion. He is not going to be the obvious predator, he will be a wolf in sheep's clothes.

And yes of course money is the deciding factor of whether she sees him or not. But these girls arent going to spend time with anyone who doesn't have the money. One of their big fears is being robbed, and they probably encounter that a lot more than serial killers, and risk of being robbed goes down as the age of the john goes up, also his job factors in to this as well. Some men probably have to pay more because they have some sort of handicap or deformity that girls find repulsive. That could be part of the reason he hates women so much, if he grosses women out and can only be with a woman for a price, it might make him hate them for not wanting him without the money involved. If that makes sense. And a handicap might make a girl feel safer also. Also older men tend to make working girls feel safer, its the younger more aggressive ones they worry about. Peter Hackett has a missing leg and access to strong opiates. So in the girls mind, here's an older man, a doctor (which means he has money), and hes missing a limb. To them that's pretty low risk. Little do they know he has a severe hatred of women and syringe ready to drug them. Just an example of someone who would fit that profile. Not saying he is LISK. But I'm not saying hes not LISK either.

What makes you think there haven't been more murders? He operated for almost 2 decades undetected. I'm willing to bet he is alive and well, either on a hiatus or stocking a new private graveyard as we speak. The bodies on Ocean Parkway are just the ones we know about. What if he already had one or more other dumping grounds. He is very methodical. And I think when he wasn't discovered after these poor victims were found, that it inflated his ego and emboldened him to see what else he could get away with. He could have moved to another area, but if that's the case, I'm willing to bet he still visits Long Island periodically, he has an attachment to the island. He could be dead, I'm not saying his not, he could be in prison, but I highly doubt both those scenarios. He is hiding behind the persona of a highly cunning upstanding citizen somewhere. He could live next door to you. Lol. I know its not funny, but Its true. He is masking his narcissism under the noses of many who think "hes a swell guy".

​jjust my opinion
 
A lot of these men who contact these girls online or by phone, are probably obvious predators. I imagine LISK is very skilled in making these girls feel safe initially.

I don't know why people have such a hard time believing its one killer responsible for all the bodies on Ocean Parkway? Everyone makes the comparison to Joel Rifkin, and he too started out dismembering victims and progressed to dumping whole bodies. It is the killer evolving. At first he dismembers because he thinks it will help him not be caught, its easier to move a body in pieces, or a young killer's morbid curiosity. I think LISK started dismembering bodies to evade capture and as he became more comfortable killing, he realized the cops weren't on to him and it inflated his ego and he started dumping whole bodies. Like Rifkin. I think after the pieces of the victims were found in Manorville and not on Ocean Parkway, that he became very comfortable with that dumping ground because nothing was being found there and it was easy for him to pull off the road and throw them away. I think he might have got some pleasure of driving by the bodies, but that the bodies were not his trophies. He probably has trophies that he can easily access and play with to relive his kills/fantasies. Phones, jewelry, clothing, photos ect. I think he might have been a young man on Long Island when Rifkin was caught, having disturbing thoughts, and related to or idolized Rifkin. Lets look at the similarities. Both from Long Island, both kill sex workers, preferred method is strangulation, started dismembering, progressed to dumping victims whole, both into gardening/landscaping? I see almost complete carbon copies. LISK is more tech savvy, but that's to be expected as the times have changed. The only real differences I see is LISK in my opinion has a better paying job or was born into some money, just from the location, but maybe not? LISK became comfortable with a dumping ground and so did Rifkin. Rifkin liked to leave his victims in rivers. If Rifkin hadn't become cocky and careless he would have gotten away with it for a lot longer, if he would have been caught at all. The cops had no idea his victims were related, let alone a suspect. I imagine LISK was angry and maybe a little afraid when his graveyard was found, but after he hadn't been caught, it inflated his ego. He either has a new dumping ground or is on a hiatus. A lot of men lose sex drive with age, but I don't think he will ever completely stop, unless he is caught.

Also I think Shannon Gilbert is related to the bodies on Ocean Parkway. Its just to much for it to be a coincidence. I think either someone in that gated community is Lisk or he was visiting someone there and picked her up. I don't think he is far from Oak Beach. Maybe he is married with children and his family vacations or visits relatives in the summer months, and he has to stay behind for "work"? Or maybe he has a house or apt nobody else knows about, or has complete control over his family and they dare not ask him about his business, he might work late hours. But then again i might be wrong. We won't know until he is caught and brought to justice. And as far as Shannon Gilbert goes, maybe its common place for ladies of the night to turn up dead in Oak beach, idk never been there? Maybe LISK is a group of men all covering for each other? But when the cops say Shannon said "they're trying to kill me", I tend to believe her. I don't think a little coke would make her that hysterical, being in her profession in sure she had done it more than a few times. I think either the John tried to drug her and she realized it want coke, or he said something that made her fear for her life. Maybe her driver procured women for LISK or group of LISKS. All these theories i find more convincing than two competing serial killers in the same location at the same time. Maybe its just me? It just seems so obvious.

​j​just my insight into the mind of a killer. Hope its of value. I thought it was relevant to the thread.
 
I am wondering if these killings could also be linked to the vanishing women in Ohio. Six women have disappeared or have been found murdered since 2014. I believe the killer is a truck driver.
 
FindHG, Sorry it took so long to reply. I don't think it's a group, talking about the 10 women found, it's 1 guy. As to a group I mean Generally! My Dad use to say about a show called " Dragnet " that they shouldn't show this **** on TV, it gives people ideas! That was the 60s and they didn't hardly show anything, he was right, but they showed enough for anyone watching to learn what not to do during whatever crime the show was about. As to a group, I can see how you took what I said the way you did, the group would be all of these serial killers that have been spawned upon us.
I myself don't see a likelihood of a group recruiting but I would have to say that would be a possibility. That being said, their intent as a group, would be a new kind of Evil but simple. From TV's C.S.I. to the movie Se7en and everything in between we as a society "reflect" what we are or are becoming by not learning from our mistakes. Sometimes you need to draw a line just because you can as opposed to "You don't draw lines just because you can". Wisdom is not always used for the better!!!!
Thanks for your words, they were of encouragement.from within your hope, got any ideas?
 
I did go "deep". There's psychology and methodology being applied. Either way, Thank you for your feedback. It's appreciated.
LMC
 
Serial Killers unlike the Hollywood version usually end up being blue collar or out of work characters. We have not had many Ted Bundy's targeting non escorts or street walkers.

What reason do all LISK profiles give for them predicting he is wealthy and well educated? They have not given publicly any details to make an, ugh huh moment, that may lead to a tip of I know who the killer is.

I do not think LISK is associated with AC. I cannot see a well off and educated man walking in a crime ridden area full of seedy characters hanging out on the streets and apartments run by gang members. He would have a high likelihood of being killed himself.

I also read two profiles done by authorities that said he would drive a very expensive car.
 
I knew a family that made custom play structures from redwood. They kept the turnings and small pieces in burlap sacks for art projects if people asked.
Also, fisherman use burlap sacks for the days haul.
 
It's called Monoamine oxidase A or shorter MAO-A or more popular, the "warrior gene". However, that is in public misunderstood (Jerry Bruckheimer's shows did a lot of work to promote the misunderstanding). Technically, there are a number of variants of this genom and in Caucasians are two of the most common. The studies, at first limited to Caucasians, seemed to indicate, that some other variants result in some kind of preposition for becoming an SK. In the meantime, they found out, that other ethnic groups have other variants revalent and thus, now everything goes slow because nobody wants to be the one saying by accident, that maybe people with a certain skin color have a higher probability. And in fact, this would be bull anyway. A lot of the trouble comes from the way. specialized scientists work today:

The neurobiologist: x% of all serial killers have one of those genetic variants. That is more than my testgroup for the normal population (which originally was all white). THe neurobiologist wouldn't touch a book about social psychology to save his life.
The socialpsychologist: Has no idea what MAO-A technically is. For him, it could be a little green man with fishtail. And he wouldn't touch a book about genetics to save his life. But he knows, that certain social environments (for example abusive parental households) breed more SKs. So he counts out the rare cases in which the SK comes from a nice middle class family just out of his study as exception from the rule.
The mathematician: Scratches his head. How does the neurobiologist make a sample size statistically relevant if the sample is lesss than 0,001 promille of the population and the targeted group makes anyway statistically less than 0.01 promille of the population. Because the mathematician knows, this is mathematically impossible and therefore rubbish, but he wouldn't go down the rabbit hole and talk to a psychologist unless he is just at the right time going through a bad divorce.
And so it goes on and on. Everyone makes his studies about exactly one aspect, nobody looks for the whole picture. And all refuse to talk to each other.
But in fact, things are pretty simple: Certain variants of MAO-A flood the brain during the development with large amounts of serotonin (other substances as well, but the key seems to be serotonin). So, at early age, the result is some kind of immunity to serotonin and it's calming effects (S. is also called the happiness hormone, because it calm's down and gives some kind of happy relaxation, but makes also emotional).
Now, less impact of serotonin makes people less emotional, distanced and in consequence sometimes socially a bit awkward because they tend to be logic in a twisted way when everybody expects them to be emotional. It could be a thing, that makes killing easier - or other activities which are normally emotionally hard - but it doesn't make one a killer. Someone with the warrior gene has a lot of career choices: Politician, business management, cop, artist (especially known in writers and actors), gardeners (lone job not so much bothering with other people), trucker, ... and so on, the list is too long. So what we really talk here is just raising the chances to become a successful killer.


I had been reading this thread and came upon this post. I’m a male and discovered I have the controversial 3 Repeat Warrior Gene. 1 in 3 men have it. I discovered it in my DNA raw data results after testing with commercial DNA testing company 23andMe. I got the single allele call from my Sicilian mother. Females with the MAOA-L variant carry two alleles-The Warrior Gene and one normal allele as they balance each other out. Males only have one allele-I had a 50/50 chance of getting mom’s normal allele or her Warrior Gene, and I got the latter. The best genetic proxy to determine if you have it is SNP RS909525.

Journalist David Pogue did a PBS special on the gene and he was told people with the gene have less grey matter of the brain, and the gene is associated with serial killers, gang activity, high risk taking, and aggressive violence. I’m a family man, very loving, and I have never got into fights or criminal activity. I guess that’s where ‘nature vs nurture’ came into play while growing up.

But, I do have a temper if provoked. Something that surprises a lot people when they see it. And I see my anger is directed more towards social injustice, if I see someone doing something wrong and getting away with it, or hurting others.

Hence, having the Warrior Gene also explains why I gravitate to watching violent movies and TV shows like Dexter, Ray Donovan, Law & Order Criminal Intent, etc. Sometimes doing research on crimes and killers, I tend to naturally start thinking of scenarios or profiles based from their possible thought process and perspective… perhaps a trait kicking in from myself having the Warrior Gene.

Anyway, based on my DNA, and the positive result of SNP RS909525, I got the official MAOA test done through Family Tree DNA as they offer it for sale, for about $60. Their test confirmed I have the Warrior Gene… just as i suspected from the result of RS909525.

See image below:

Warrior Gene Results.jpg
 
I have the Warrior Gene too. Its called Native New Yorker.
 
But, I do have a temper if provoked. Something that surprises a lot people when they see it. And I see my anger is directed more towards social injustice, if I see someone doing something wrong and getting away with it, or hurting others.

Hence, having the Warrior Gene also explains why I gravitate to watching violent movies and TV shows like Dexter, Ray Donovan, Law & Order Criminal Intent, etc. Sometimes doing research on crimes and killers, I tend to naturally start thinking of scenarios or profiles based from their possible thought process and perspective… perhaps a trait kicking in from myself having the Warrior Gene.

Interesting, just stumbling into this thread ... while I can't say the same for myself regarding gene testing, I am female and I have the same tendencies. Very protective towards those closest to me, social injustice is a trigger (can see how minor slights potentially affected victims/demographic while others seem unfazed or unaware by the thoughts/patterns), possess interest and display physical strength somewhat outside the limitations of females my size - desire the strenuous workouts males (especially males) and females don't seem to understand why I do..., am attracted for some strange reason to 'darker'/non-fantasy (though given the lineup of what television ordinarily provides, not sure if darker is the right word) television shows/reading material/studies, (less gore, yet some violence or 'heroic' social dynamic is essential). Always wondered where the hell this all comes from.. *strange*. I noticed my father is the same way (younger male siblings are not), having actually chosen law enforcement for some time (as a second shift apart from his daytime accounting business), and appearing interested in certain media of the same vein.
 
Interesting, just stumbling into this thread ... while I can't say the same for myself regarding gene testing, I am female and I have the same tendencies. Very protective towards those closest to me, social injustice is a trigger (can see how minor slights potentially affected victims/demographic while others seem unfazed or unaware by the thoughts/patterns), possess interest and display physical strength somewhat outside the limitations of females my size - desire the strenuous workouts males (especially males) and females don't seem to understand why I do..., am attracted for some strange reason to 'darker'/non-fantasy (though given the lineup of what television ordinarily provides, not sure if darker is the right word) television shows/reading material/studies, (less gore, yet some violence or 'heroic' social dynamic is essential). Always wondered where the hell this all comes from.. *strange*. I noticed my father is the same way (younger male siblings are not), having actually chosen law enforcement for some time (as a second shift apart from his daytime accounting business), and appearing interested in certain media of the same vein.

Females can carry the 3 Repeat Warrior Gene TWICE since they they have two alleles on the X chromosome––either 2 normal; 1 carrier variant & 1 normal; or 2 carrier variants (the Warrior Gene twice) Men get theirs from their mother from the X chromosome. Never from the father. But females can get one Warrior Gene from their mother and the other from their father from his X chromosome.

My niece has the Warrior Gene twice… she got one from her mother (my sister, who got it from our mother) and the other Warrior Gene she got from her Chinese father.

It also might explain why my mother has a loyal interest in TV shows, Luther and Criminal Minds.
 
Im new here so i get lost easy but I wanted to know if anyone brought these following things out:
Im trying to catch up on all this now that my finals are over. There is so much info I gotta go over but did anyone say anything about the **orehouse comment that the killer made?
1) He is calling the dumpsite his **orehouse.
2) the killer is probably planting trash around containing the DNA of several different people, and he IS COMING BACK to not only to view his "trophies" but to visit the **orehouse & have sex with the bodies.
3) he has driven by & watched while police accessed the scene.
4) he feels dominated by a woman
5) no conscious of course
6) he makes the women feel comfortable probably telling them about his family
7) women who have been with him probably think he has an insatiable sexual appetite
8) can drive by the dumpsite by boat.
9) feels conflicted about bible and spiritual things
10) placed the women whom he calls **ores within the area of Babylon.
now going to go back over the comments and read if I missed something.
** important, if someone were to find a body and place a concealed camera, you will see the person on film coming back, watching his "work" transform and "visiting" the bodies. I would place one at the nearby marina as well.
 
oh forgot:
he is probably not a threatening figure and backs off of confrontation. If its only one guy that has done them all, he probably killed one way and then had a "break" when overworked then went back and started killing in a different way.
 
Im new here so i get lost easy but I wanted to know if anyone brought these following things out:
Im trying to catch up on all this now that my finals are over. There is so much info I gotta go over but did anyone say anything about the **orehouse comment that the killer made?
1) He is calling the dumpsite his **orehouse.
2) the killer is probably planting trash around containing the DNA of several different people, and he IS COMING BACK to not only to view his "trophies" but to visit the **orehouse & have sex with the bodies.
3) he has driven by & watched while police accessed the scene.
4) he feels dominated by a woman
5) no conscious of course
6) he makes the women feel comfortable probably telling them about his family
7) women who have been with him probably think he has an insatiable sexual appetite
8) can drive by the dumpsite by boat.
9) feels conflicted about bible and spiritual things
10) placed the women whom he calls **ores within the area of Babylon.
now going to go back over the comments and read if I missed something.
** important, if someone were to find a body and place a concealed camera, you will see the person on film coming back, watching his "work" transform and "visiting" the bodies. I would place one at the nearby marina as well.

Hi IC, are these facts or questions? I don't recall 1 or 2 ever being discussed otherwise we are going into Kempler territory for example.
 
Sorry i meant to add Bundy to that post too. There are definite parallels to LISK and Bundy, however necraphila hasn't been given as a fact on the GB4 or AC4, or did I miss that?
 
Sorry i meant to add Bundy to that post too. There are definite parallels to LISK and Bundy, however necraphila hasn't been given as a fact on the GB4 or AC4, or did I miss that?

Ridgway was said to be a necrophiliac as well. The LISK case has more parallels to the Green River case than to Bundy, just my opinion. LISK is between the 2 cases as far as intelligence goes. Bundy was brilliant, Ridgway low on the IQ totem pole. Yet he did things to throw off investigators, planting false evidence with his victims and moving some of his victims.

LISK never figured his victims would ever be found. Give the remains a few more years and they would have been possibly reclaimed by the earth and harder to stumble upon.
 
Sorry i meant to add Bundy to that post too. There are definite parallels to LISK and Bundy, however necraphila hasn't been given as a fact on the GB4 or AC4, or did I miss that?

All bones not solved cannot be too many "facts" at this point about what was done with the bodies earlier on.


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