Ramsey Clothing Journey

Discussion in 'JonBenet Ramsey' started by UKGuy, Sep 23, 2008.

  1. UKGuy

    UKGuy Active Member

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    JonBenet was discovered wearing size-12 underwear which nobody in the media talks much about, even John prefers to emphasise how Patsy carried some suit around in case a suspect was ever caught. Why should this be, what is John trying to say, or is this an unoticed aspect of this case, that has not had much attention to date e.g. the extent to which clothing plays a large part in the staging of JonBenet's crime-scene and that of the parents immediately after the 911 call. So what follows are some, so far, unrelated references to clothing.

    Steve Thomas was analysing the photographs taken at the White's when he noticed something that caught his eye. Patsy was wearing a Red Turtleneck and Black Pants to the White's dinner party. Officer French stated that he was met at the door by a dark-haired woman in black pants and a red sweater. He noted that although it was still before dawn , her hair was neatly done and her makeup was in place. Not normally given much attention, Officer French also stated that they were joined at the door by man in a long-sleeved blue and white striped shirt and khaki slacks.

    So John in the period to the 911 call had changed into that shirt and slacks, somehow I've never visualised John as a khaki slacks guy, its like he was going golfing that morning? No israel cotton shirt for John then.

    At Press events etc, Patsy usually wore a black suit and diamond angel pin. On Thursday, May 1st 1997, Patsy and John gave a media interview. Patsy wore a diamond angel pin fixed to the lapel of her conservative blue suit which sparkled when she moved. Steve Thomas is said to have remarked Patsy's choice of suit, since allegedly she wore the same suit at another press conference?

    Patsy admits the photographs that John said never existed, are beautiful pictures!
    A blue bath robe was found on the floor in the den on the first floor of the Ramsey house.
    Somebody, Patsy or John, probably wore it that morning?

    DOI p:342

    Excerpted from: http://cbs4denver.com/local/Jonbenet.Ramsey.Forgives.2.814405.html
    The Navy Blue Suit
    So John changes his clothes but Patsy does not, and years later he is still obliquely referring to it, this must mean it is a big red flag, because if Patsy's dress choice was merely arbitrary it would have been lost in case details somewhere. Not unless John is playing games?
     
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  3. JMO8778

    JMO8778 ..at the beach!

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    good points,good questions...it appears that Patsy wearing BLUE,ie-he is trying to say she wears that color a lot,or perhaps,rather..that she wore that same outfit twice b/c she just really likes the color *blue? (and that it had nothing to do w the fact she'd worn it before?).
    somehow Patsy not changing clothes that night is trying to be downplayed by JR? ie-she wears outfits more than once,and she just really likes BLUE ones? how silly.
     
  4. SuperDave

    SuperDave New Member

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    Speaking of clothing:

    JonBenet's body was discovered dressed in white: white top, white bottoms. They were clean.

    Are we really to believe that this girl, wearing white, struggled for her life in a filthy basement without getting considerably dirty? When I was six-years-old, I ALWAYS got dirty, and by doing a lot LESS than what we are asked to believe happened.
     
  5. UKGuy

    UKGuy Active Member

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    JMO8778,
    Whatever he is trying to say is suspect, since Patsy wore many outfits but he seems to be concentrating on this one?

    Also I never commented much on who may have showered, so the blue bath robe that was found on the floor in the den on the first floor of the Ramsey house. may have been discarded after a shower either the night before or the morning of the 911 call? I reckon both John and Patsy showered, they would have been stupid not to, particularly if they contaminated with forensic evidence.

    That John changed clothes but Patsy never seems deliberate to me, its just possible she took a chance on the basis she was the last person to be in contact with JonBenet. John would have showered and changed into a clean shirt and slacks, removing any trace evidence.
     
  6. azwriter

    azwriter Sister Mary Wanna

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    Interesting points UK. Clothing does play a part in Patsy's life.
    I think she wore the blue suit two days in a row as a way to counter the cops observation that she was wearing the same outfit on Dec. 26 as she did the night before at Fleet's gathering. Her statement - see, I often wear the same clothes two days in a row. Another cover-up, I betya.
    However, there's more. I noticed many of the pageant costumes JonBenet wore were identical as to ones Patsy wore during her pageant days. One that comes to mind is a black and white full-length gown Patsy wore. Her daughter had one similiar in black and white with the large feather like head piece. I wish I had the photos I saw to post here.
    Patsy and her mother were reliving the pageant events through JonBenet.
    jmo
     
  7. UKGuy

    UKGuy Active Member

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    SuperDave,
    Sure I agree, just some bloodstains and post-mortem urine release. I reckon John redressed JonBenet in those longjohns and size-12's, not Patsy, then she choked JonBenet death.

    I wonder if the Barbie nightgown had been removed and replaced with her white gap top so to make the parents version of events more credible e.g. placed sleeping to bed? Could this be why her arms are slightly upraised?

    That Barbie nightgown may have salacious connotations if JonBenet was initially assaulted down in the basement? I just wonder if there are any photos of JonBenet wearing the Barbie nightgown in that collection of photographs discovered in the basement?

    Yes clothing might be a linking theme in your book, since it runs like an invisible thread throughout the whole case. Without the size-12's we would not have Patsy's lies on tape, without JonBenet's pageant outfits the case might just be another death in Colorado. Without Patsy's disregard for wearing already used clothing, presentation the morning of the 911 call, may have gone unreported. Then we have the size-12's returning back to base, with Patsy carrying around her blue suit for media appearances, and indirectly there is the MyTwinn Doll episode with its potential use as replacement clothing for one already purchased.


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  8. JMO8778

    JMO8778 ..at the beach!

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    good point,so if Patsy took a shower,but yet still put the same clothes back on...not to mention,she deliberately threw herself on top of the body..she knew there might be some fiber evidence on JB she needed to account for.
    John,OTOH,tried to distance himself from it all,even though evidence is found that he was there as well.he also threw the blanket on top of JB bf Patsy walked in...
     
  9. UKGuy

    UKGuy Active Member

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    azwriter,
    Yes I agree, Patsy and Nedra were living their lives through JonBenet. Those pageant costumes were a bit much for a six-year old. Don't forget D Paugh too, he liked Shirley Temple, mmm I wonder why, seems he either passed this preference onto Patsy since Shirley Temple movies were a staple diet for JonBenet. So the pageants and their clothing are yet another visual clue in this case.

    .
     
  10. UKGuy

    UKGuy Active Member

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    JMO8778,
    I reckon she wore the same outfit to account for any fibers, since she can claim to have been the last person to touch JonBenet prior to her death. Its possible she always intended to throw herself onto JonBenet?


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  11. JMO8778

    JMO8778 ..at the beach!

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    sure,but do you think John was trying to make a statement when he covered JB w the blanket,or was it just something he inadvertently did?
     
  12. rashomon

    rashomon New Member

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    Imo the green garland pieces found on the victim's body (wasn't it in the hair?) contradict a "she was first assaulted in the basement" theory. For the garland was from the spiral stairs, so the body was most likely carried down those stairs when already in a coma from the head blow.
     
  13. UKGuy

    UKGuy Active Member

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    JMO8778,
    Thats difficult to work out. I would go it being a continuation of his prior obscuring behaviour. If nobody can see JonBenet's corpse then no suspicions may be raised? Then again he simply be shrouding the dead, but was it inadvertent, no John rarely does inadvertent stuff.
     
  14. UKGuy

    UKGuy Active Member

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    rashomon,
    Probably, but I posit a prior staging in her bedroom utilising the flashlight and Barbie Nightgown.

    So it could be a PDI with John amending the staging to incorporate a sexual assault to obscure prior abuse, telling Patsy she has to be garroted?



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  15. SuperDave

    SuperDave New Member

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    Maybe.
     
  16. JMO8778

    JMO8778 ..at the beach!

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    for sure,that makes me think of the RN;mostly every line was an excuse for something,inc. being seen outside the house early,IMO.
     
  17. JMO8778

    JMO8778 ..at the beach!

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    ..what significance could the overalls hold,the red ones that Patsy said she washed a spot out of that morning? is it the overalls themselves,or was she trying to account for her presence, or something else in that area outside Jb's room,at or near the sink? any thoughts?
     
  18. angelwngs

    angelwngs New Member

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    It would be interesting to know when JB last wore those overalls. I wonder if JB previously soiled them and stuffed them under her bed and Patsy didn't find them until that night, a smelly mess, wadded up mess under her bed ...
     
  19. angelwngs

    angelwngs New Member

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    Thomas states that if the R's had awakened at the time they said they did on the 26th, that they could never have made their scheduled flight time.

    If that was true, I need at ask you guys again, what is the minimum time that you feel the murder and all the staging would have taken to have completed?

    Could JB have been dressed by Patsy, very early that morning in the red jumpsuit, JB accidently soiled it, and JB gotten into a throw down with Patsy over the soiling and over whatever PR wanted to change her into after the jumpsuit is no longer a possibility? Maybe this 2nd outfit included the red turtleneck that had already stemmed an argument the day before?
     
  20. angelwngs

    angelwngs New Member

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    And another thing...

    The R's said over and over again that they OFTEN just picked the children up asleep in whatever they wore to bed and took them to the plane where they could fall back asleep during the flight...

    Why was it necessary for them to point this out so pointedly???? Was it to cover-up for the time they SAID that they woke up not adding up in te timeframe of how long in reality, it should have taken them to get ready to walk out the door to catch the flight???
     
  21. Chrishope

    Chrishope New Member

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    I know UK Guy has pointed this out many times, but- the most important connection with clothing is the redressing of JBR. There just isn't much reason for an intruder to have redressed her in anything - size 6s, size 12s, whatever. There was no reason to redress her in white. No reason to wrap her in a blanket and hide her body in the wine cellar. An intruder would have concentrated on getting out of the house.
     

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