Released Sketches & Photos in Gilgo Beach Case

DS said the killer called ALC a few weeks before she went missing. He wanted her to meet him at the Holiday Inn. She said no. I wonder how many times the killer called her before she agreed to meet him?
 
I'm not familiar with any of the other cases save for the Atlantic city group however I will say this, I don't find it all that coincidental that most of these victims are sex workers. It's one of the oldest and most risky "professions" in the world. Many killers target them. Police in the LISK case even discuss it and it was discussed in Lost Girls book. They're an easy target for many reasons. One being that they're all strung out on drugs and most likely living a nomadic lifestyle and estranged from family or friends. 2) they're involved in a lot of illegal activity and pimps and "co-workers" don't like to notify police because it brings attention to them (perfect example is Amber Costello). 3) they are easily accessible, especially since the advent of the Internet. To get regular woman requires work. Prostitutes will do their job regardless of whether you have a good personality or are deemed unattractive by society. its also too risky to take a regular girl in public (as Ted Bundy did) because there are too many security cameras, etc nowadays.

Off the top of my head I can think of killers who targeted this specific group like John Bittrolf, the Criagslist killer, Phillip Markoff, Joel Rifkin, Robert Yates and the Green River killer, Gary Ridgeway. The list goes on.

I agree the sex workers are easy targets for predators. While I am haunted by the deaths of all the GB4, Amber is the one that bothers me the most because she was from my neck of the woods, Wilmington, NC. Her sister KO said in an interview that she and Amber were hired for a bachelor party at Beau Rivage Plantation and Country Club and that's how Amber got started in the escort business, IIRC. I've been to luncheons, wedding receptions, weddings, fundraisers, fishing club holiday parties, heck my kids went to cotillion classes there! KO spoke with a distinct Carolina accent and I assume Amber did also. The time out doll placed at her cross had stuffing coming out it's mouth. I've wondered the symbolism of this....was it because of her southern accent or was she being mouthy or what? I don't think those dolls were left by a good intentioned individual. JMO

Do you know if Surfcaster procures or uses either street drugs or prescription opiates with which he could lure these women? KO seemed to think the common denominator with the 4 was drugs...coke, IIRC. But we know Amber also used heroin. I can't remember about Maureen, Melissa and Megan.
 
Why wouldn't Amber tell dave who the john was and my understanding is that she was using his phone and deleted the number before she returned it. This sounds strange...is it true? If so sounds like the John knew Dave Schaller. There is no other reason for Amber not telling Dave who he was. Sounds like one of his fishing pals or someone he knew from the Marina?
 
Why wouldn't Amber tell dave who the john was and my understanding is that she was using his phone and deleted the number before she returned it. This sounds strange...is it true? If so sounds like the John knew Dave Schaller. There is no other reason for Amber not telling Dave who he was. Sounds like one of his fishing pals or someone he knew from the Marina?

The john could have been someone well-known or someone that Amber believed was well-known. Or perhaps someone with a reputation to protect -- a cop, a DA, etc.
 
Yes but there would be no reason at all for Amber not to tell Dave the john's identity unless he was an acquaintance of Dave's. If the john was a well known person or a cop she would be like "holy **** dave guess who i'm going on a date with, James Burke lol" or some ****. There's no reason for Amber to keep a secret for this John, even if she promised to she's going to tell Dave. Unless it's one of Dave friends who tells her he is embarrassed that dave will make fun of him for hiring her.
 
I agree the sex workers are easy targets for predators. While I am haunted by the deaths of all the GB4, Amber is the one that bothers me the most because she was from my neck of the woods, Wilmington, NC. Her sister KO said in an interview that she and Amber were hired for a bachelor party at Beau Rivage Plantation and Country Club and that's how Amber got started in the escort business, IIRC. I've been to luncheons, wedding receptions, weddings, fundraisers, fishing club holiday parties, heck my kids went to cotillion classes there! KO spoke with a distinct Carolina accent and I assume Amber did also. The time out doll placed at her cross had stuffing coming out it's mouth. I've wondered the symbolism of this....was it because of her southern accent or was she being mouthy or what? I don't think those dolls were left by a good intentioned individual. JMO

Do you know if Surfcaster procures or uses either street drugs or prescription opiates with which he could lure these women? KO seemed to think the common denominator with the 4 was drugs...coke, IIRC. But we know Amber also used heroin. I can't remember about Maureen, Melissa and Megan.

Interesting stuff! All of what you wrote! I'm haunted by this in the same way you are seeing that Surfcaster was living in the same town as Amber. Amber and Melissa are the two who bother me the most. Amber for many of the same reasons you mention and Melissa because her little sister was contacted by the killer and because 2 days before her disappearance, she was out on Long Island, at a hotel in Massapequa (which is a short drive from Babylon where Amber lived).

As for the timeout dolls, totally creepy. I get chills thinking of it. My husband actually saw the dolls in person as he used to use the Ocean Parkway to travel to work everyday. I agree that they were placed there for a reason and most likely, it wasn't one with good intent. I think Amber and Melissa got to this guy in a way that the other girls did not.

I do know that Surfcaster used to use prescription drugs, recreationally but I can't speak for if he was taking them during that time. I do know he has a drinking problem and oddly enough I read an interview with Melissa's boyfriend the other day where he says he too received disturbing, taunting calls and the caller sounded drunk. Drugs absolutely could've been a common theme. In the book Lost Girls, I believe I read that each of the girls dabbled in drugs at one time or another. Others had worse problems, like Amber. I think drugs kind of goes with the territory and I believe KO about that.

I believe ALL the girls kept this guy secret from those around them, not just Amber. Melissa too didn't reveal his identity. With that said, maybe the killer manipulated them into believing he was a "somebody" without actually being one. Maybe he was impersonating LE or some other type of public figure. We know he was very calculating and was able to manipulate these women into letting down their guards.

I have my own theories. I think he took the time to build up a rapport with each of the women. That's why we see so much time between killings. Perhaps in his mind, he was cultivating a "relationship" that went beyond the call girl/Jon and when the relationship didn't exceed his expectations, he killed. These girls all trusted him for some reason which leads me to believe there was a familiarity with him. For Amber to leave her home in such casual clothing that day, shows that maybe she wasn't "going to work". Maybe that was a lie he told them to tell anyone who asked. Maybe she thought she was going to hang out with a friend and maybe she lied to Dave because she felt stupid that she was making friends with one of her clients. There are so many possibilities. I may be way off base but I'm just trying to think outside the box.

Going back to Melissa Barthélemy for a second, we know that the killer had her phone and used it to call her sister. In an A&E special on the case, her step father claims that he too received calls. Her boyfriend "Blaze" also claimed to receive those same calls. Their calls were traced back to a prepaid phone registered to "Mickey Mouse". How did the killer know to pick these specific people? I don't think it was ANY coincidence that he specifically chose people who were were closest to her. This means he knew her on a more intimate level and she of all the girls got to him in a very bad way.
 
Oh her just had access to her phone. you can find out a lot about someone by looking thru their phone I bet. I still can't believe it's a coincidence that Melissa was friends with Rita Tangredi's daughter Amanda. That is too coincidental for me, especially when Bittrolff's address is so close to Kim Raffo's. I can't get past that.
 
Notorious and LindsayLohan6, I can't wait to respond to your thoughtful posts because I have thoughts to add but it will have to wait 'til tomorrow. We've had water spouts and and a confirmed tornado inland today. it's been blowing a gale and my fairy garden blew over and I have to go clean up the deck now that the sun came out. It is a new moon and the astronomical tides are high and have flooded our road and water is coming over the bulkhead so I've gotta get downstairs and move things so they don't float away. There I go preaching the weather and moon phases again, haha! See yall tomorrow. wm
 
Notorius, does your POI have any connections to the Bronx? Work, friends, ect?
 
Oh her just had access to her phone. you can find out a lot about someone by looking thru their phone I bet. I still can't believe it's a coincidence that Melissa was friends with Rita Tangredi's daughter Amanda. That is too coincidental for me, especially when Bittrolff's address is so close to Kim Raffo's. I can't get past that.

No way!!! I never heard this! You are soooo right! supposedly, they cleared him of any involvement but who knows for sure. I strongly believed it was him when I first heard his story based on the fact that the women were found out in Manorville. God it makes you wonder what this guy did for 20+ years. He lived in the area and mostly likely passed the dump site countless amounts of times with his family in the car and knew that he was the person behind it. Same with LISK. They must get some type of high off of it!
 
Notorius, does your POI have any connections to the Bronx? Work, friends, ect?

Funny you should ask this because it's something that just hit me last night. I went through his Facebook with a fine toothed comb to do some sleuthing and on July 12th 2009 (the day Melissa went missing) he states that he went to Pennsylvania to go quadding. A few days later he posts a video of him and some friends quadding. It says in the video, 2008-2009 quad riding. It all looked like one day to me. Anyway, I googled directions from his home at the time, on Long Island to the place he went quadding in PA. The route he had to take would bring him right through the Bronx and right past her home. I mean her apartment is right off the interstate. Maybe a mile or so.


***edited to add.... I tried uploading a picture of the map, his route and its proximity to her apartment but for whatever reason. I cannot do it.
 
Oh her just had access to her phone. you can find out a lot about someone by looking thru their phone I bet. I still can't believe it's a coincidence that Melissa was friends with Rita Tangredi's daughter Amanda. That is too coincidental for me, especially when Bittrolff's address is so close to Kim Raffo's. I can't get past that.

I agree that he prolly learned alot by just looking thru Melissa's phone. Lindsay, did you post at one time about receiving some suspicious phone calls or am I misremembering? The reason I ask is because back around 2012 we were discussing phone spoofing and the Lisk playing on the phone and my phone was spoofed. I received calls that appeared to be from all over the country. People asking if I just called them when I hadn't. Well I stopped answering the calls and began logging them and the only call from a land line was from BAbylon, NY. I ended up gettin a new number and carrier. I took a break from the case for awhile after that.
 
Even thought the Barthelemy's layer said the killer sounded late 20's to late 30's, I think he's older. Bittrolff's age, or the drifter's age which was 48 in 2010. Mickey Mouse and the term Half-breed. Bittrolff grew up right by the Mastic Indian Rez. I just see this murders as the work of an older individual but I could be wrong
 
Even thought the Barthelemy's layer said the killer sounded late 20's to late 30's, I think he's older. Bittrolff's age, or the drifter's age which was 48 in 2010. Mickey Mouse and the term Half-breed. Bittrolff grew up right by the Mastic Indian Rez. I just see this murders as the work of an older individual but I could be wrong

I do, too. It's easy for an older man to sound younger, especially nowadays when smoking is less common.

I'm also leaning towards LISK having a more direct connection to law enforcement than I thought previously. It's not because LE seems to be dragging their feet so much on this case and I don't think LISK is literally a cop. Maybe related to one? I dunno. It's just a feeling.
 
I do, too. It's easy for an older man to sound younger, especially nowadays when smoking is less common.

I'm also leaning towards LISK having a more direct connection to law enforcement than I thought previously. It's not because LE seems to be dragging their feet so much on this case and I don't think LISK is literally a cop. Maybe related to one? I dunno. It's just a feeling.

I also think that LISK has an LE connection of some sort, even if it's just that he hangs around the edges of cop culture.

I say this because the only place I have ever seen the term "half-breed" being used, and used *a lot* is on the NYPD "theerant" message boards. So that slur is obviously thrown around by at least a non-neglible part of police force in the region. I guess it's also just possible that LISK read those boards for a while before his spree.
 
I also think that LISK has an LE connection of some sort, even if it's just that he hangs around the edges of cop culture.

I say this because the only place I have ever seen the term "half-breed" being used, and used *a lot* is on the NYPD "theerant" message boards. So that slur is obviously thrown around by at least a non-neglible part of police force in the region. I guess it's also just possible that LISK read those boards for a while before his spree.

Interesting! The last time I heard the term before this case was probably like an old Western movie or something. Yuck.
 
Interesting! The last time I heard the term before this case was probably like an old Western movie or something. Yuck.

I heard this term in the 70's. Cher had a hit song titled "half breed". I think the LISK is approx. 50 or over.
 
I also think that LISK has an LE connection of some sort, even if it's just that he hangs around the edges of cop culture.

I say this because the only place I have ever seen the term "half-breed" being used, and used *a lot* is on the NYPD "theerant" message boards. So that slur is obviously thrown around by at least a non-neglible part of police force in the region. I guess it's also just possible that LISK read those boards for a while before his spree.


Same type of person who would say "half-breed" would say "home for wayward girls"..maybe someone who was in jail for a long time or someone ranting on "the rant"
 
It is strange but look how much Vision Ministries sounds like a home for wayward girls. And Bittrolff is from Mastic by the Indian Reservation. Is there a missing link between Hackett, OB and Bittrolff? Who else is involved with Vision ministries
 

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