Reserved for LCSODETECTIVES and MMARTY

Discussion in 'Sand Canyon John Doe' started by lcsodetectives, Jun 13, 2014.

  1. lcsodetectives

    lcsodetectives Verified law enforcement

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    Hello everyone,
    Thank you to everyone who has posted so far. We are currently working a couple of angles on this case. The ideas posted earlier in this thread will be looked into.
     
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  3. lcsodetectives

    lcsodetectives Verified law enforcement

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    Update....

    The good news is we now have a DNA profile entered into CODIS for our John Doe, which is a huge step in the right direction! Unfortunately, we do not have any "hits" on the profile at this time.

    We need your help. Attached is a photograph of a piece of a T-shirt. We believe the T-shirt was originally white. We need your help with identifying the design. Does anyone recognize it? Thank you in advance for your time and efforts!
     

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  4. Tricia

    Tricia Owner Websleuths.com Staff Member Administrator

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    Hi Websleuths Members,

    We are very fortunate to have mmarty with us. Mmarty is a verified member of a Nevada Law Enforcement Agency.

    Mmarty has come to Websleuths to seek our help with this case.

    Please treat mmarty with the utmost respect and remember as a verified member of law enforcement he doesn't need to back up anything he says with a link.

    Mmarty, thank you for coming to Websleuths and asking for our help. You will find the members here to be top notch sleuths and willing to help you any way possible.

    Take Care,
    Tricia
     
  5. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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    Thanks Tricia,

    My partner (identified as lcsodetectives on this forum) and I are preparing a time-line of facts for all of you. We appreciate any help you can give us. We do have good dental records and good DNA, all of which have been entered into the system. We would ask you to keep in mind that some of the information already discussed in this thread has been vetted and proved to be no related to our case. Some of that information has also proved to be, in fact, relevant. Our time-line and update will have all of the factual information that we have on our subject and this case. The link to our subject in NAMUS is here https://identifyus.org/en/cases/7582

    We should have an update for you on this site within 24 hours.

    Thanks in advance for your help.
     
  6. lcsodetectives

    lcsodetectives Verified law enforcement

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    In an effort to clarify some of the facts and timeline of this case...

    On March 12, 1992 a male caller reports that he found a skeleton in Sand Canyon and provides detailed directions to the location. The caller refuses to identify himself. Law enforcement locates the remains the next day.

    The body was nearly completely skeletonized. The victim was aged between 35 and 50 and stood between 6’0” and 6’3”. He had reddish/brown hair.

    The victim had dental work done, to include a root canal. The victim was missing several teeth prior to his death. The victim had been stabbed. The body was missing both hands and feet.

    The body was clad only in what remains of a T-shirt. The shirt has a partial design of what appears to be a bird with outstretched wings with an orange circle (likely a stylized sun) in the background.

    A pair of Levi Strauss 517 pants in relatively good condition was found inside of a moving blanket that was covered in white paint. The moving blanket and pants were found nearby. The pants are 32W by 36L. Men’s brief-type underwear were found nearby as well as a black Heavenly Lake Tahoe hat. The clothing was scattered over a broad area.

    A pair of black Stadia shoes was located about a half mile away from the remains. There is evidence the shoes were too small for whoever wore them. There is also evidence the shoes had been repaired in somewhat of a unique manner. It is unknown at this time if the shoes actually have anything to do with this case.

    At the time the body was located, a deputy sheriff on scene recalled handling an abandoned vehicle in October of 1991 (7 months prior to body discovery). An anonymous caller called this particular abandoned vehicle into the Mono County Sheriff’s Office. The vehicle, a 1979 Pontiac Grand Prix, with Oklahoma plates, was found along Highway 338, about two miles from where the remains were found. The vehicle was found in a manner that suggested whoever put it there was trying to conceal it. The registered owner was ultimately located and interviewed, but nothing conclusive came out of the interview. The vehicle may or may not have anything to do with this case.

    In 1999 this investigation was reactivated and a press release was put out. As a result, a woman who lives nearby reported she started seeing a dog come around her property about 9 months prior to the discovery of the body. The dog would leave in the direction where the body would later be found. The woman took a picture of the dog.

    There was a dog collar located in the area of the remains however it is unknown how close the collar was located to the body. This photo was taken to area veterinarians, but no identifications were made. This dog may or may not have belonged to the victim. Nothing definitive to prove it either way was ever found.

    In 2014, the case is reassigned again. Utilizing modern technology, a DNA profile of the victim was developed and entered into CODIS.

    The clothing evidence will be re-processed utilizing modern technology in the near future. At that time, hopefully there will be conclusive proof as to whether or not any of the clothing and shoes belonged to the victim. Additionally, an isotope analysis of the victim’s hair will be done in the near future which could reveal clues regarding where the victim had been prior to his death.

    A consultation was done with Texas State University regarding the condition of the remains in hopes of narrowing the time of death. Based on this report, we believe the victim probably died sometime between 4 and 14 months prior to discovery.

    Previous investigators had the subject’s skull sent to a facial reconstruction artist. Those pictures are one artist’s rendition of what they believed our subject might have looked like. Detectives are sending the skull out to be reconstructed again for another perspective on what our subject may have looked like.

    Other investigative leads have been developed as a result of the fresh look at this case, however these will not be publicly discussed at this time.

    Further photos will be posted at a later time.

    Please contact via private message lcsodetectives or mmarty with any leads on this case. Please keep in mind that while we can't always comment on certain aspects of the investigation, we do read these posts and we appreciate any and all ideas!
     
  7. lcsodetectives

    lcsodetectives Verified law enforcement

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    Correction...
    The abandoned car was found 5 months prior to the body discovery, not 7 months as stated in my previous post.

    Some excellent questions have been raised, some of which we can not publicly discuss, but here are answers to some that we can:

    We can't provide the identity of the owner, but we will look into what details we can provide about the car that may or may not help with identifying the victim. We will follow up with a later post on this.

    The dog doesn't appear to be wearing a collar in the photo. Here is the photo:

    View attachment 72363

    As of right now, no. The remains were almost completely skeletonized. However, DNA technology may be able to help us answer that question at some point. I know there are advances being made as far as using DNA to identify characteristics of an individual.

    Interesting question. Please PM me with your thoughts on this and what leads you ask.

    The Doe Network page indicates the photo on the far right is a photo of Spencer in December 1991. His hair is far too gray in that photo to be our UID. We are looking to post an appropriate photo of the actual hair found at the scene. We will follow up with this in a later post.

    As for the questions we can't discuss, they are still helpful to us! The smallest thing could lead to the next clue. My partner and I feel this is a very solvable case. The answer is out there.

    Here is something else to think about as you look at missing persons cases...
    As we have searched databases, my partner and I have found a striking number of cases that weren't reported until many years later. Remember that the date last seen is often a date which the reporting person provides, which could be inaccurate (sometimes intentionally), especially as the years go by. Due to this, don't be afraid to post possible matches just because they were alleged to have been seen after the discovery of John Doe.
     

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  8. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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    Once the pic of the hair is posted, you will see just how red it is. There is no doubt his hair was mainly reddish brown. I am curious as to why you ask about New Mexico and Texas. The dog was not wearing a collar in the photo, nor did the witness see the dog wearing a collar at any time. The local vet in the area did rule out ever seeing that particular dog in the area. My partner and I thank all of you for taking a look at this for us and helping out.

    Thanks again!
     
  9. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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    This "Campsite" was not a campsite at all. It was originally described as such, but it doesn't appear from what was recovered that it was actually a campsite at all. It is our theory that what was once thought to be a campsite might possibly be a blanket that was used to carry/conceal/wrap our subject in and other "typical desert trash" that is common in the area.
     
  10. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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  11. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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  12. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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    The hair looks like it has not been color treated.
     
  13. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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    All,

    We greatly appreciate your help on this case. It has helped us more than you will ever know. That being said, please, if you have a lead or a tip and think it needs checking or vetting, forward it to either LCSODETECTIVES or MMARTY and my partner and I will take care of it. I am posting this because this is something very important. All of this information is public. The killer, for all we know, could be reading this forum as we post. My partner and I are trained professionals who take the risk that comes along with this job. We can not authorize any of you to "take police action" on our behalf, nor do we condone that. Much like we can not share all of the information with you, there are reasons we must be the ones to contact people in this case. Web searches are fine, talking to experts is fine, but contacting victims, witnesses, people of interest or otherwise are not actions that we can condone.

    Thank you all again for your help in this and understanding. Don't stop the good work of research you all are doing. Stay the course. We will solve this case.
     
  14. mmarty

    mmarty Verified Law Enforcement Nevada

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    Ok, I sent the new list off and it should be posted here soon. We are down to 48 names (approximately) on the list that we started that had around 3,000 I believe matching our John Doe. As far as tasks go, I can only think of checking these names against the circumstances and facts I have told you and see if there is a fit.

    The isotope testing results are as follows:

    (1) The individual was traveling within a month prior to his death; and

    (2) Approximately 1 to 1.5 months (4-6 weeks) prior to death, the individual resided
    in a region (“Iso-Region 1”) consistent with the Intermountain West, including
    portions of Lyon County, Nevada; and

    (3) Approximately 1.5 to 2 months (6-9 weeks) prior to death, the individual moved
    to “Iso-Region 1” from a region characterized by a cooler climate (“Iso-Region
    2”); and

    (4) Approximately 2 to 3 months (9-13 weeks) prior to death, the individual had
    moved or traveled through “Iso-Region 2”, an area consistent with more northern
    and higher elevation regions of the Intermountain West, including some isolated
    high elevation portions of Nevada.

    Again, any help on this case is greatly appreciated. Without citizens like you all on this forum this job would be insurmountable. This case is not only a "whodunit" but also a "whoisit".
     

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