SBTC and the Zodiac Killer

[Ames]

Hi, I'm a newbie here, so please forgive me if this "SBTC" possibility has been mentioned before.

I was reading Delmar England's ransom note analysis on a candy rose and thought it was interesting how things in the note were connected to things the RN writer was thinking/worried about. Like, that the next day will be exhausting, and the RN writer was worried about proper burial. I started wondering if there was anything with the initials SBTC that PR, if hypothetically she were the RN writer, might be worried about, and I came up with one possibility.

If PR (with or without JR) was staging an elaborate crime scene and writing the note, she'd be aware that everything had to be done and ready in time for her to 'wake up' and find the note, thus putting off their flight to Michigan. I think the pressure to meet that deadline was considerable, since people knew they were planning to go, JR's other kids were meeting them there, etc. What if subconsciously PR was thinking, over and over, about that flight they wouldn't now be taking, and how she needed to be finished long before the now-impossible seven a.m. takeoff time, and when she came to sign the note, she wrote SBTC, maybe not even realizing herself that it was the time and direction of the intended flight: Seven a.m., Boulder to Charlevoix?

Again, if this has been suggested a million times please excuse me, as I'm still getting caught up.

WHOA....thats the first time that I have ever seen that on ANY JB board. Good thinking!!!!

 

[Nuisanceposter]

That is pretty good thinking, but I'm sure she knew that flight was off (and therefore no longer needed to be on her mind.) I have the feeling that Patsy, in her obsessive need to turn to religion for answers (as seen throughout DOI), was referring to Saved By The Cross with SBTC. She was going to have to rely on her belief of Jesus dying on the cross to save man from their sins to save her from hers. I think it was a final affirmation in her mind that everything would be okay once she was forgiven by God, and she would find her victory over adversity with her devotion to her faith.

 

[Eagle1]

It's great to have some creative thinkers aboard. I'm also in agreement with NP's quote below, though we're not usually on the same side. I call myself neutral, an FS, fence sitter, but IF PR wrote the note at all, I think NP's hit the nail on the head about Saved By the Cross. Makes sense. There were actually at least 3 people we know of whose handwriting tended to match, PR, Karr, and the Barnhills' boarder Glen Meyer. His was looked at more than once. Even if PR didn't write the note, any believer could have the same thoughts about Saved By the Cross. All of us believers have been taught to look to our religion as the ultimate wisdom. That's certainly not unique to PR.

That is pretty good thinking, but I'm sure she knew that flight was off (and therefore no longer needed to be on her mind.) I have the feeling that Patsy, in her obsessive need to turn to religion for answers (as seen throughout DOI), was referring to Saved By The Cross with SBTC. She was going to have to rely on her belief of Jesus dying on the cross to save man from their sins to save her from hers. I think it was a final affirmation in her mind that everything would be okay once she was forgiven by God, and she would find her victory over adversity with her devotion to her faith.

 

[UKGuy]

I reckon analysing the ransom note is like the medieval poser, how many angels can fit onto the head of a pin?

Since the ransom note is fake, and that the paper its written on, along with the pen used, was sourced from inside the Ramsay house, also add in the initial drafts or practise versions found, along with the fact that there is no evidence of an intruder.

Then the most important deduction that follows from the latter is that an occupant of the Ramsey household authored it.

Given the context of the ransom note, why SBTC should mean Saved By The Cross beats me, not unless the alleged foreign faction were intended to have a christian background?

Were John and Patsy people of faith, or was their church-going simply a conservative habit?

If Patsy authored that ransom note why construct it to be largely ambiguous but sign off with a contradictory christian phrase?

The purpose of the ransom note is to deceive you, so like any staged crime-scene evidence you cannot use it to speculate about prior events.

But there is one feature worth considering, that is, which information did the Ramsey's want you to beleive?

Well foremost for me is this extract:

I will call you between 8 and 10 am tomorrow to instruct you on delivery.

This along with JonBenet's tombstone inscription is probably intended to give you the false impression that after returning from the White's, JonBenet was killed later that night?


JonBenet may have been killed later into the morning than most people assume!




.

 

[coloradokares]

It's great to have some creative thinkers aboard. I'm also in agreement with NP's quote below, though we're not usually on the same side. I call myself neutral, an FS, fence sitter, but IF PR wrote the note at all, I think NP's hit the nail on the head about Saved By the Cross. Makes sense. There were actually at least 3 people we know of whose handwriting tended to match, PR, Karr, and the Barnhills' boarder Glen Meyer. His was looked at more than once. Even if PR didn't write the note, any believer could have the same thoughts about Saved By the Cross. All of us believers have been taught to look to our religion as the ultimate wisdom. That's certainly not unique to PR.

Yes they required 2 samples from Glen Meyer however that is a far cry from saying they matched or tended to match. Which is exactly what they claimed with Patsy Ramsey. I know some Johnny come lately tried to make JMK sound like it matched back in all the hype last year. Quickly that was proved wrong when they cannot get him placed in Boulder. But I digresss..... I have not ever seen it said that Glen Meyers was even a potential match as you suggest. Can you provide a link or page number that suggests this was the case with Glen Meyer. It would be pertinent info if so. I have never seen that information prior to this. If so that would be interesting information. I always as a local believed that Glen Meyer was fairly quickly cleared, I know that many IDI's feel no one was ever cleared if it was DNA alone that cleared them. However that would play just as valid with the Ramseys then would it not? They are not cleared DNA wise as Lou Smit and team Ramsey claims either. Perhaps as NP suggests this is not a case for DNA. I just want to understand how it is that people who have been considered to be not under suspicion at all are suddenly under the wheels of the bus yet again, I am rather confused by this as this is not the prevailing opinion at least locally in Boulder. Even our mayor at the time said there is no murderer roaming the streets of Boulder. Now it seems most of its residents are still cast in a suspicious light. Thats puzzling to me. If it were someone from Boulder don't you think they'd have been under investigation by the Grand Jury by now?

 

[JMO8778]

of course Patsy wrote the ransom note--did you not see all the similarities from the site acandyrose.com? If not I suggest you get over there pronto--Anyway, I knew Patsy wrote the ransom the very first time I read it over 10 years ago--It is the most amateurish,insipid,overlong ransom note ever written....and I know ransom notes since I have read over 700 true crime books---I won't go into all the details abou the note since it has already been discussed ad infinutum--and remember that the FBI determined that a 40 year old southern woman wrote it---and of course there was no evidence of any intruder(remember the unbroken spider web by the broken window?)

ditto for me,that stupid note did it for me 10 yrs ago..i also thought it odd they weren't angry....combine it w/ all the other evidence,and there's no way they aren't guilty.
Look at what the note actually says,not just the handwriting.Karr wouldn't have said 'use that good southern common sense of yours' and all the other nonsense ..and who would have? only an R,I believe.

 

[JMO8778]

That is pretty good thinking, but I'm sure she knew that flight was off (and therefore no longer needed to be on her mind.) I have the feeling that Patsy, in her obsessive need to turn to religion for answers (as seen throughout DOI), was referring to Saved By The Cross with SBTC. She was going to have to rely on her belief of Jesus dying on the cross to save man from their sins to save her from hers. I think it was a final affirmation in her mind that everything would be okay once she was forgiven by God, and she would find her victory over adversity with her devotion to her faith.

yes,reminds me of her saying 'help me Jesus' repeatedly at the end of the 911 call.

 

[JMO8778]

I reckon analysing the ransom note is like the medieval poser, how many angels can fit onto the head of a pin?

Since the ransom note is fake, and that the paper its written on, along with the pen used, was sourced from inside the Ramsay house, also add in the initial drafts or practise versions found, along with the fact that there is no evidence of an intruder.

Then the most important deduction that follows from the latter is that an occupant of the Ramsey household authored it.

Given the context of the ransom note, why SBTC should mean Saved By The Cross beats me, not unless the alleged foreign faction were intended to have a christian background?

Were John and Patsy people of faith, or was their church-going simply a conservative habit?

If Patsy authored that ransom note why construct it to be largely ambiguous but sign off with a contradictory christian phrase?

The purpose of the ransom note is to deceive you, so like any staged crime-scene evidence you cannot use it to speculate about prior events.

But there is one feature worth considering, that is, which information did the Ramsey's want you to beleive?

Well foremost for me is this extract:



This along with JonBenet's tombstone inscription is probably intended to give you the false impression that after returning from the White's, JonBenet was killed later that night?


JonBenet may have been killed later into the morning than most people assume!




.

true,the headstone says the 25th tho.

 

[BBB167893]

When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.

 

[Eagle1]

yes,reminds me of her saying 'help me Jesus' repeatedly at the end of the 911 call.

Yes, and that reminds me of one of our recent Cold Cases, where someone claiming to be dirt poor but very religious for the first five pages or so wanted our encouragement or something, to get her millionaire brother's suicide or murder pinned on his pharmacist widow. One guy also told her she'd told us too many times how much she's suffered but no information that would allow us to help, so it's not just me. Now that the thread is closed, a second time, I keep wondering about the religious and suffering act. And her claiming the widow committed frauds about finances. Now how could she know that?

Not saying this makes anyone definitely guilty or not guilty, but it does make you wonder about motive.

 

[K777angel]

I will say again what I said when I started this thread long ago.
I think it is silly to waste time trying to figure out what S.B.T.C. means in the note when EVERYTHING ELSE in the note was fake and made up! Purposely so! What is the note writer going to do - at the very end of the note decide to add a little TRUTH?
No way.
You cannot separate the whole purpose of writing that note from the S.B.T.C. sign off. Namely - to DECEIVE!

It would not fit with the whole context of the note to suggest that the SBTC is somehow meaningful to the writer and that it stands for something REAL.

Nothing in that note is real.
It was all designed, as the FBI stated - to deflect suspicion AWAY from the perps (Ramseys). Not cryptically point them back to themselves in such a conscious way!

Don't waste your time trying to figure this one out. It's as fake as the "foreign faction."

~Angel~

 

[Ames]

When you eliminate the impossible, whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth.

SuperDave...that is REALLY profound...and SO true!

eliminate the impossible + whatever remains + truth = Guilty Ramseys

IMO

 

[BBB167893]

I can't take credit for that one, Ames. Due must be given to Sir Arthue Conan-Doyle.

 

[cami]

I will say again what I said when I started this thread long ago.
I think it is silly to waste time trying to figure out what S.B.T.C. means in the note when EVERYTHING ELSE in the note was fake and made up! Purposely so! What is the note writer going to do - at the very end of the note decide to add a little TRUTH?
No way.
You cannot separate the whole purpose of writing that note from the S.B.T.C. sign off. Namely - to DECEIVE!

It would not fit with the whole context of the note to suggest that the SBTC is somehow meaningful to the writer and that it stands for something REAL.

~Angel~

What if it does though? I made an observation (not here) at the time of Patsy's death. There was an article in a newspaper quoting her sister Pam. Pam said "she achieved her VICTORY at 3:30 am this morning (the time Patsy died). I started to think that if her sister refers to death as a victory, maybe Patsy did as well and I started to look at SBTC in the context of the word Victory with it.

"She's gone," Pam says. "She got her victory at 3 o'clock in the morning on Saturday."

Link to Article

Just a thought...

 

[UKGuy]

true,the headstone says the 25th tho.

This will be part of the staging, its intended to make her death late that evening consistent with their staging and version of events. ino JonBenet was likely killed later than this?



.

 

[Eagle1]

What if it does though? I made an observation (not here) at the time of Patsy's death. There was an article in a newspaper quoting her sister Pam. Pam said "she achieved her VICTORY at 3:30 am this morning (the time Patsy died). I started to think that if her sister refers to death as a victory, maybe Patsy did as well and I started to look at SBTC in the context of the word Victory with it.

"She's gone," Pam says. "She got her victory at 3 o'clock in the morning on Saturday."

Link to Article

Just a thought...

I know you're also thinking, as I am, that Pam was just referring to the case when she said Patsy got her victory, and trying to minize the "loser" aspect, that she didn't really get her answer as to who killed JonBenet before she passed on. Maybe she knows now, or, maybe the dead forget all that so that they can be happy in heaven, a new beginning???????

 

[JMO8778]

Yes, and that reminds me of one of our recent Cold Cases, where someone claiming to be dirt poor but very religious for the first five pages or so wanted our encouragement or something, to get her millionaire brother's suicide or murder pinned on his pharmacist widow. One guy also told her she'd told us too many times how much she's suffered but no information that would allow us to help, so it's not just me. Now that the thread is closed, a second time, I keep wondering about the religious and suffering act. And her claiming the widow committed frauds about finances. Now how could she know that?

Not saying this makes anyone definitely guilty or not guilty, but it does make you wonder about motive.

it sure does !!!

 

[JMO8778]

This will be part of the staging, its intended to make her death late that evening consistent with their staging and version of events. ino JonBenet was likely killed later than this?



.

could be,I think the coroner said most likely 'at or b/f 1AM?'

 

[cami]

I know you're also thinking, as I am, that Pam was just referring to the case when she said Patsy got her victory, and trying to minize the "loser" aspect, that she didn't really get her answer as to who killed JonBenet before she passed on. Maybe she knows now, or, maybe the dead forget all that so that they can be happy in heaven, a new beginning???????

Actually no I didn't think she was referring to the case. I don't think the comment was made in that context. I thought it was made in the context of their religion..whatever it is...and her death.

No matter, it was just a thought.

 

[rashomon]

I will say again what I said when I started this thread long ago.
I think it is silly to waste time trying to figure out what S.B.T.C. means in the note when EVERYTHING ELSE in the note was fake and made up! Purposely so! What is the note writer going to do - at the very end of the note decide to add a little TRUTH?
No way.
You cannot separate the whole purpose of writing that note from the S.B.T.C. sign off. Namely - to DECEIVE!

It would not fit with the whole context of the note to suggest that the SBTC is somehow meaningful to the writer and that it stands for something REAL.

Nothing in that note is real.
It was all designed, as the FBI stated - to deflect suspicion AWAY from the perps (Ramseys). Not cryptically point them back to themselves in such a conscious way!

Don't waste your time trying to figure this one out. It's as fake as the "foreign faction."

~Angel~

My thoughts exactly.
Imo the dots between the letters are far more interesting than the acronym itself, for didn't Patsy have a habit of using those dots in the acronyms she was so fond of using in her letters?