Sentencing and beyond- JA General Discussion #7

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Hope4More

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Who is Kyle Kimball ans what is he famous for?

What was Searcy up to with S (abbreviation needed 'cos my ipad is developing wear spots)? TA thinks it was sex?

I'll bet she researched RB the way she researched TA.

What exactly was this party?

I knew you were going to say the route they came back from OKC on foreshadowed her post-murder drive.... I'm sure you're right: after all, she's an interstate kind of gal...


TA brought up Kimball on May 26. The mentioned him in her journal as someone she suddenly looked down and (in essence) was going to avoid. IIRC, Kimball was a PPL'er she did some serious hitting on, and who had pursued her at some point. TA seems to have believed the same thing was going on with Searcy (remember too that the had just spent days alone with Gus in his Las Vegas trailer, at the end of February).

The party was an off-site convention to-do for PPL high earners, hosted by folks TA didn't approve of, which often seems to have been because they were drinkers.
 

Hope4More

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I'm not invested in this scenario, but here it is.

The and TA didn't have sex that day. She snuck in, but TA wasn't at all OK with her being there and she retreated to her car around the corner, pretending to leave. She was even more furious than when she arrived. She uploaded old sex photos onto her own laptop, using TA's camera, which she had already stolen and meant to keep as her own.

She intended to sneak back in earlier than she did, but Zach's return delayed her. When she tried to get back in, she discovered that Travis had locked all the doors, including the front door. She lurked until she saw TA leave his office to go upstairs to take a shower. She broke into his study, removing the screen.

Travis didn't know she was taking photos of him until he turned around to face her after she ambushed him, gun in hand.

She brought up the previous shaving thing because she thought it proved TA was ok, really, with being photographed doing intimate things. Like showering. And because she knew she could prove she had discussed a redo with TA.

She stumbled through a contradictory story about CD's to account for the time not spent there, the 4 hour gap, and thought the CD story checked off other boxes as well. She thought of that story because she saw the CD's out from TA working on Flickr the night before.

She intended to post the sex photos on her new YouTube channel, to smear TA after the fact, but then thought better of it and deleted the photos.

She meant to take TA's camera, but it was drenched in his blood and hers from her cut hand, and she had second thoughts about having it in her possession. She thought deleting and bleaching would erase all the evidence on it.

The timestamps on the shower photos are correct.
 

Wing Ding

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Originally Posted by Val1
Add in that she was allegedly (see below) living with MM in August 2006, just after her enhancement surgery and just before the whole PPL got rolling...

I had come across a long post I'd saved from a jad way back in Feb 2013 on that calls for justice site, at first it had seemed to be more of a rant about some group that specialized in "flirty fishing" but dang a lot of the info in it seems to be pretty accurate. Anyway, if anyone wants more info about it just let me know, I think I cleared enough room for any notifications.

Here's just a snippet of it:
"Matt McCartney, who she was living with, was her sexual partner who had (years before) lived in a tent with her on the premises of the Ventana Inn and Spa, where her boss, Darryl Brewer, was a man (twice her age) who would become another sexual partner. In the summer of 2007, she was living at the Ventana Inn and Spa again, except this time she was living with Matt McCartney in a red house on the property."

Wasn't she still with DB in summer of 2006? She was already doing PPL and had her mind set on a wealthy mormon husband. She was on her celibacy kick. H4M did an exploration of the timeline for starting PPL and setting her sights on a mormon marriage. She had met Abe by this time. This was well before TA came into the picture (I still think she stalked him at that convention).

Well not only was JA with DB in the summer of 2006, they were living in sin together -- I mean co-habitating -- in Palm Desert, which is approx. 450 miles south of Monterey (where they were previously living in sin together -- I mean co-habitating).

But anyways... I thought JA went on her celibacy kick after meeting TA in Sept., 2006, which is where she first learned about his religious beliefs. Didn't she have her "sit-down" with DB about their future living conditions sometime after she got back from the Las Vegas convention? And then soon afterwards (probably with TA making the arrangements) she began having local Mormons visit her at her house during the day when DB was at work (probably so they wouldn't see she was shacking up with someone of the opposite sex)?

I know she met Abe at a PPL event before she ever met TA, but I don't get where she was chasing Mormon PPL'ers before she ever met Travis. Can someone please bring me up to speed? Thanks.
 

Hope4More

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About CD's , from 's letter to TA's family, July 28, 2008:

"We went to sleep as the sun was rising. We slept until about 1. When we woke up, among other things, we tried to look at 3 CD's of church trips I HAD MADE A YEAR PRIOR, but they were BADLY SCRATCHED, not to mention Travis had recently contracted a virus on his laptop and the disc drive was difficult to bring up. "


"He had Quaker oatmeal for lunch. I remember him a clear as daylight (sic), sitting in his office chair, feet kicked up, in his pajamas eating oatmeal, waiting for his computer to accomplish a simple task but having no luck."

I sat on the floor near him, petting Napoleon, (saw a poem I wrote on his board in February that he hadn't erased..) " Anyway, when we realized we weren't getting anywhere with the pictures we went back upstairs.

I took photos of Travis in the shower, but they were tasteful pictures."



From the manifesto : We went to sleep around 5 and woke up at 1. We hung out, among other things. I surprised him with the handwritten chapter of his book (long explanation why she had it).

"We also tried to look at cd's with pictures from our various church trips, but his computer had a virus and we were having a difficult time bringing up the disc drive. After a while we gave up, and went back upstairs.

With T's permission, I took tasteful photos of him in the shower....."
 

RickshawFan

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The wrote in her journal (number #4) on February 8, 2008, that she thought she was going to have to send her external hard drive to a "data extraction center," and added- " no bueno" and a little frownie face.


Several things are a little curious about that entry (besides the fact she'd just been fired from Mimi's and was broke, especially since she'd been forced to lend TA her every last dollar). One is that the beginning of the entry for that day is in entirely different handwriting and ink, and is completely unrelated to what follows (some shallow meditation thing she had read in a PD book or some such).

The entry part about the HD also begins with her saying she needed to write up what had happened the "past few days, " even though she was tired. Thing is, she had written entries, and long ones, the day before and the day before that.

She could have stuck that HD entry in later on, or....she did have an external HD, and she couldn't in fact access photos on it, at least in February 2008.

Do we have any corroborating evidence that the drive even existed? She said it was in storage, right? LE would have been able to find the physical drive. Heck, her DT could have waved it around.

It seems ludicrous that she had a hard drive, and we only hear about it for early 2008? We only hear about this expensive piece of equipment after it breaks?
 

RickshawFan

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I'm not invested in this scenario, but here it is.

The and TA didn't have sex that day. She snuck in, but TA wasn't at all OK with her being there and she retreated to her car around the corner, pretending to leave. She was even more furious than when she arrived. She uploaded old sex photos onto her own laptop, using TA's camera, which she had already stolen and meant to keep as her own.

She intended to sneak back in earlier than she did, but Zach's return delayed her. When she tried to get back in, she discovered that Travis had locked all the doors, including the front door. She lurked until she saw TA leave his office to go upstairs to take a shower. She broke into his study, removing the screen.

Travis didn't know she was taking photos of him until he turned around to face her after she ambushed him, gun in hand.

She brought up the previous shaving thing because she thought it proved TA was ok, really, with being photographed doing intimate things. Like showering. And because she knew she could prove she had discussed a redo with TA.

She stumbled through a contradictory story about CD's to account for the time not spent there, the 4 hour gap, and thought the CD story checked off other boxes as well. She thought of that story because she saw the CD's out from TA working on Flickr the night before.

She intended to post the sex photos on her new YouTube channel, to smear TA after the fact, but then thought better of it and deleted the photos.

She meant to take TA's camera, but it was drenched in his blood and hers from her cut hand, and she had second thoughts about having it in her possession. She thought deleting and bleaching would erase all the evidence on it.

The timestamps on the shower photos are correct.

I'm betting much of this is true, especially insofar as it can be made to square with your scenario upthread.

S had to tell Flores all about the sex and the CD's and stuff, not only because it showed coziness with TA, but because she had to conceal the truth about the whole situation, namely--with whatever method--TA had prevented her from getting in the house.

Spending a few hours in his car in the garage might have been her extreme attempt to thumb her nose at TA's wish that she not be in the house.

Was the shower above the garage?
 

Hope4More

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Originally Posted by Val1
Add in that she was allegedly (see below) living with MM in August 2006, just after her enhancement surgery and just before the whole PPL got rolling...

I had come across a long post I'd saved from a jad way back in Feb 2013 on that calls for justice site, at first it had seemed to be more of a rant about some group that specialized in "flirty fishing" but dang a lot of the info in it seems to be pretty accurate. Anyway, if anyone wants more info about it just let me know, I think I cleared enough room for any notifications.

Here's just a snippet of it:
"Matt McCartney, who she was living with, was her sexual partner who had (years before) lived in a tent with her on the premises of the Ventana Inn and Spa, where her boss, Darryl Brewer, was a man (twice her age) who would become another sexual partner. In the summer of 2007, she was living at the Ventana Inn and Spa again, except this time she was living with Matt McCartney in a red house on the property."



Well not only was JA with DB in the summer of 2006, they were living in sin together -- I mean co-habitating -- in Palm Desert, which is approx. 450 miles south of Monterey (where they were previously living in sin together -- I mean co-habitating).

But anyways... I thought JA went on her celibacy kick after meeting TA in Sept., 2006, which is where she first learned about his religious beliefs. Didn't she have her "sit-down" with DB about their future living conditions sometime after she got back from the Las Vegas convention? And then soon afterwards (probably with TA making the arrangements) she began having local Mormons visit her at her house during the day when DB was at work (probably so they wouldn't see she was shacking up with someone of the opposite sex)?

I know she met Abe at a PPL event before she ever met TA, but I don't get where she was chasing Mormon PPL'ers before she ever met Travis. Can someone please bring me up to speed? Thanks.


Brewer's testimony blew up all those lies. She had her boob job, told Brewer no more sex because she was saving herself for marriage, stopped paying the bills, and had Mormon missionaries stopping by, all BEFORE she met Travis in September.

She met Abe that summer (2006) after crashing the high earners sectioned -off area of a PPL event , and sitting down as if she belonged there. Thing is....Abe wasn't Mormon. She let Abe put his hands down her pants later on, but Abe wasn't her target.

Her sights were set on snagging a high earner PPL Mormon when she went to LV in September and met Travis. Who she says she told upfront, being the chaste good honest Mormon girl she was, that she already had a BF.

Yep, that would be the exiled DB who, BTW, testified he moved out of their house in September to return to Monterey, to be closer to his son.
 

RickshawFan

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Originally Posted by Val1
Add in that she was allegedly (see below) living with MM in August 2006, just after her enhancement surgery and just before the whole PPL got rolling...

I had come across a long post I'd saved from a jad way back in Feb 2013 on that calls for justice site, at first it had seemed to be more of a rant about some group that specialized in "flirty fishing" but dang a lot of the info in it seems to be pretty accurate. Anyway, if anyone wants more info about it just let me know, I think I cleared enough room for any notifications.

Here's just a snippet of it:
"Matt McCartney, who she was living with, was her sexual partner who had (years before) lived in a tent with her on the premises of the Ventana Inn and Spa, where her boss, Darryl Brewer, was a man (twice her age) who would become another sexual partner. In the summer of 2007, she was living at the Ventana Inn and Spa again, except this time she was living with Matt McCartney in a red house on the property."



Well not only was JA with DB in the summer of 2006, they were living in sin together -- I mean co-habitating -- in Palm Desert, which is approx. 450 miles south of Monterey (where they were previously living in sin together -- I mean co-habitating).

But anyways... I thought JA went on her celibacy kick after meeting TA in Sept., 2006, which is where she first learned about his religious beliefs. Didn't she have her "sit-down" with DB about their future living conditions sometime after she got back from the Las Vegas convention? And then soon afterwards (probably with TA making the arrangements) she began having local Mormons visit her at her house during the day when DB was at work (probably so they wouldn't see she was shacking up with someone of the opposite sex)?

I know she met Abe at a PPL event before she ever met TA, but I don't get where she was chasing Mormon PPL'ers before she ever met Travis. Can someone please bring me up to speed? Thanks.


Check in with H4M about the chronology of the PPL and mormon stuff. H4M, IIRC established that had zero-ed in on PPL and mormon marriage several months before she met TA. I believe she also met Abe at some executive PPL shindig before she met TA.
 

Hope4More

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I'm still digging through stuff about the photos, but here's a clue. TA posted one of the Albuquerque balloon photos on his MySpace account with the caption (in Spanish) "sunbathing." Just of him, no in the photo.

The balloon photos were taken on the same October 2007 trip as their 4 hour train ride to Colorado and back, the photos of that trip were on the CD laying on TA's desk.
 

pocketaccent

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I'm not invested in this scenario, but here it is.

The and TA didn't have sex that day. She snuck in, but TA wasn't at all OK with her being there and she retreated to her car around the corner, pretending to leave. She was even more furious than when she arrived. She uploaded old sex photos onto her own laptop, using TA's camera, which she had already stolen and meant to keep as her own.

She intended to sneak back in earlier than she did, but Zach's return delayed her. When she tried to get back in, she discovered that Travis had locked all the doors, including the front door. She lurked until she saw TA leave his office to go upstairs to take a shower. She broke into his study, removing the screen.

Travis didn't know she was taking photos of him until he turned around to face her after she ambushed him, gun in hand.

She brought up the previous shaving thing because she thought it proved TA was ok, really, with being photographed doing intimate things. Like showering. And because she knew she could prove she had discussed a redo with TA.

She stumbled through a contradictory story about CD's to account for the time not spent there, the 4 hour gap, and thought the CD story checked off other boxes as well. She thought of that story because she saw the CD's out from TA working on Flickr the night before.

She intended to post the sex photos on her new YouTube channel, to smear TA after the fact, but then thought better of it and deleted the photos.

She meant to take TA's camera, but it was drenched in his blood and hers from her cut hand, and she had second thoughts about having it in her possession. She thought deleting and bleaching would erase all the evidence on it.

The timestamps on the shower photos are correct.

Yay for Hope's kaleidoscope!!!!!
Some constructive criticism ( I know you are not invested in the scenario)
- She is leaving Travis out of her sight for too long.
- Too hot in Mesa during the day to be out for so long.
- I love the idea of youtube thing, she always wanted to be famous.


Sisters, please offer criticism on mine, good or bad.

Why would she plant the sex photos if she did?

June 4th - She plants old sex photos in Ts camera. I like FinallyRegistered's idea of simply taking photos from her laptop screen.
Why? because she was thinking of the situation below.

Many days later LE discovers a witness who saw getting in T's house on June 4.

LE wants an interview.

LE: What were you doing there?

: Yes I was there. We had sex. We took pictures. I have them. When I left Travis was alive
.
This is better than having no sex pictures in the camera. At least she is able to say she was there for sex.
Without them, she has to admit she was there and can't prove why she was there.

Important: Assume taking the shower photos was never in her plan. She was only planning to plant the nudes in T's camera.
----------------------------------------------------------------
She plants 6:30 am-ish (she is alone in the office until T wakes up)
Travis, after waking up, deletes nudes 10 am-ish
Shower photos 10:20 am-ish

or

She plants 1:30 pm-ish (she was in the office from early morning then moved to Enrique's room when Travis woke up)
Travis deletes 5 pm-ish (She does spend time with Travis in the afternoon)
Shower photos 5:20 pm ish
 

Hope4More

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Yay for Hope's kaleidoscope!!!!!
Some constructive criticism ( I know you are not invested in the scenario)
- She is leaving Travis out of her sight for too long.
- Too hot in Mesa during the day to be out for so long.
- I love the idea of youtube thing, she always wanted to be famous.


Sisters, please offer criticism on mine, good or bad.

Why would she plant the sex photos if she did?

June 4th - She plants old sex photos in Ts camera. I like FinallyRegistered's idea of simply taking photos from her laptop screen.
Why? because she was thinking of the situation below.

Many days later LE discovers a witness who saw getting in T's house on June 4.

LE wants an interview.

LE: What were you doing there?

: Yes I was there. We had sex. We took pictures. I have them. When I left Travis was alive
.
This is better than having no sex pictures in the camera. At least she is able to say she was there for sex.
Without them, she has to admit she was there and can't prove why she was there.

Important: Assume taking the shower photos was never in her plan. She was only planning to plant the nudes in T's camera.
----------------------------------------------------------------
She plants 6:30 am-ish (she is alone in the office until T wakes up)
Travis, after waking up, deletes nudes 10 am-ish
Shower photos 10:20 am-ish

or

She plants 1:30 pm-ish (she was in the office from early morning then moved to Enrique's room when Travis woke up)
Travis deletes 5 pm-ish (She does spend time with Travis in the afternoon)
Shower photos 5:20 pm ish


The primary problem I have with your sex photos as alibi idea is that IMO the was entirely confident she could prove she wasn't there. Not just because she thought her going under the radar scheme was foolproof, but specific to your scenario, because she thought she couldn't be identified at the scene because she had dyed her hair.

She addressed that point in her manifesto (clearly remembering Flores had told her a neighbor had seen her and recognized her). She said she'd heard that a witness had seen a blonde woman that day, and maybe that witness was even correct, but it couldn't be her because her hair was brown (smug, smug, smug), and besides, the neighbors had never met her and had rarely even seen her, because she stayed inside when visiting Travis.
 

Hope4More

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About her different versions of the CD's, and the few consistencies.


She said at various times she brought 2 CDs...or 3. Only in her letter does she mention when she made the CD's, 3 in that version-- a year before. Or.... conveniently BEFORE the time she told Flores she couldn't retrieve photos from her external hard drive (Christmas 2007).

The two things she was always consistent about, including in interrogation, is that the photos were from church trips, and that TA's laptop had a virus, and very specifically, that the virus prevented the disc drive from working properly.

The whopper about " church trips," btw, is laughable. They never took a "church trip." On several occasions they took side trips to see church related sights, but that sight seeing was always secondary to the reason for the trips, which was PPL business related.

The Sacred Grove, and church places in OKC, both in the 1st half of 2007. I think that is the entire list of churchy sites, photos of which would interest TA not at all on June 4th, and I'm willing to bet, not least because he already photos of those trips.

----
The other consistency is her claim that the photos of TA in the shower were to be tasteful. How in the world did she expect anyone to believe that tasteful meant anything to her after seeing the photos she says she took of TA a few hours earlier, and that she "allowed " him to take of her?
 

pocketaccent

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The primary problem I have with your sex photos as alibi idea is that IMO the was entirely confident she could prove she wasn't there. Not just because she thought her going under the radar scheme was foolproof, but specific to your scenario, because she thought she couldn't be identified at the scene because she had dyed her hair.

She addressed that point in her manifesto (clearly remembering Flores had told her a neighbor had seen her and recognized her). She said she'd heard that a witness had seen a blonde woman that day, and maybe that witness was even correct, but it couldn't be her because her hair was brown (smug, smug, smug), and besides, the neighbors had never met her and had rarely even seen her, because she stayed inside when visiting Travis.

She was concerned about the roommates hearing her that day but DF assured her no roommate did. She of course didn't know if DF was lying or not, but she was concerned.
 

Hope4More

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She was concerned about the roommates hearing her that day but DF assured her no roommate did. She of course didn't know if DF was lying or not, but she was concerned.


She may have been concerned, but not overly, IMO, and it's possible she asked not out of concern, but simply because she wanted to know what lies she needed to incorporate into the ninja story she was about to launch.

Even if she couldn't be positive neither roommate heard her at any point (which is an interesting thing, if she knew that was possible), IMO she knew she had no real reason to worry because neither SAW her, and so neither could identify her as that theoretical noise-maker.
 

Hope4More

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Geevee...FYI.

The Mesa PD turned over (copies?) of the sex and shower photos to Beth Karas after the guilt phase trial ended (along with all other crime scene and autopsy photos). She has some of these photos on her site.

-----

The search warrant for Pine Street indicates LE found "hard drives " (plural) in her safe (with all but one of her journals), and a Dell laptop on the floor of her bedroom.

----

LE was able to retrieve some evidence from her "hard drive," (singular) including those penis photos deliberately flashed at trial, even though the HD was considered destroyed.
-----

BTW, the said the photo of the 4 year old boy Travis was chasing, etc. (that said was on her HD (singular) )was taken one year before she "walked in on TA.". In other words, she went out of her way to imply the little boy was Sky and Chris Hughes' son, because that's about when she stayed with the Hughes for a few days to blow up their friendship with TA.
 

ILikeToBendPages

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IIRC Darryl left Jodi in December 2006, and she stayed on in the house? Now in Jodi's letter to the Alexanders she says that she left and moved to Big Sur and stayed with Matt M. in Big Sur when she and Travis broke up, and she then moved to Mesa because of Travis begged her to.
 

RickshawFan

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I'm still digging through stuff about the photos, but here's a clue. TA posted one of the Albuquerque balloon photos on his MySpace account with the caption (in Spanish) "sunbathing." Just of him, no in the photo.

The balloon photos were taken on the same October 2007 trip as their 4 hour train ride to Colorado and back, the photos of that trip were on the CD laying on TA's desk.

The plot grows thicker....
 

RickshawFan

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Yay for Hope's kaleidoscope!!!!!
Some constructive criticism ( I know you are not invested in the scenario)
- She is leaving Travis out of her sight for too long.
- Too hot in Mesa during the day to be out for so long.
- I love the idea of youtube thing, she always wanted to be famous.


Sisters, please offer criticism on mine, good or bad.

Why would she plant the sex photos if she did?

June 4th - She plants old sex photos in Ts camera. I like FinallyRegistered's idea of simply taking photos from her laptop screen.
Why? because she was thinking of the situation below.

Many days later LE discovers a witness who saw getting in T's house on June 4.

LE wants an interview.

LE: What were you doing there?

: Yes I was there. We had sex. We took pictures. I have them. When I left Travis was alive
.
This is better than having no sex pictures in the camera. At least she is able to say she was there for sex.
Without them, she has to admit she was there and can't prove why she was there.

Important: Assume taking the shower photos was never in her plan. She was only planning to plant the nudes in T's camera.
----------------------------------------------------------------
She plants 6:30 am-ish (she is alone in the office until T wakes up)
Travis, after waking up, deletes nudes 10 am-ish
Shower photos 10:20 am-ish

or

She plants 1:30 pm-ish (she was in the office from early morning then moved to Enrique's room when Travis woke up)
Travis deletes 5 pm-ish (She does spend time with Travis in the afternoon)
Shower photos 5:20 pm ish

Regarding it being too hot at that time of day: she hung out in TA's car reading his journal (or on her laptop), maybe even with the AC running. This was a big FU for being made unwelcome in the house.

She could have stolen his camera (why wouldn't she? theft is right up her alley, especially when it irks TA); and messed with the photos in the car with her laptop. She later changed her mind (overthinking again.). It was easier to say they had sex that day than to confess to Flores that she had framed TA with sex photos on his own camera.

She doesn't seem to know what TA was doing most of the afternoon. I think she wasn't in the house: she was sitting in his car.
 

RickshawFan

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About her different versions of the CD's, and the few consistencies.


She said at various times she brought 2 CDs...or 3. Only in her letter does she mention when she made the CD's, 3 in that version-- a year before. Or.... conveniently BEFORE the time she told Flores she couldn't retrieve photos from her external hard drive (Christmas 2007).

The two things she was always consistent about, including in interrogation, is that the photos were from church trips, and that TA's laptop had a virus, and very specifically, that the virus prevented the disc drive from working properly.

The whopper about " church trips," btw, is laughable. They never took a "church trip." On several occasions they took side trips to see church related sights, but that sight seeing was always secondary to the reason for the trips, which was PPL business related.

The Sacred Grove, and church places in OKC, both in the 1st half of 2007. I think that is the entire list of churchy sites, photos of which would interest TA not at all on June 4th, and I'm willing to bet, not least because he already photos of those trips.

----
The other consistency is her claim that the photos of TA in the shower were to be tasteful. How in the world did she expect anyone to believe that tasteful meant anything to her after seeing the photos she says she took of TA a few hours earlier, and that she "allowed " him to take of her?

TA might not have wanted her photos of those churchy sites because she had draped herself all over him when he had expressly asked her not to be romantically inappropriate.

The whole thing with the CD's is ludicrous, 'cos anyone else would have emailed them.

I wonder if LE found photos in her email account.
 

RickshawFan

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IIRC Darryl left Jodi in December 2006, and she stayed on in the house? Now in Jodi's letter to the Alexanders she says that she left and moved to Big Sur and stayed with Matt M. in Big Sur when she and Travis broke up, and she then moved to Mesa because of Travis begged her to.


I'm thinking DB broke up with her earlier. The "no sex" stuff started before TA was in the picture.
 
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