Shelf Issue

Discussion in 'Travis Alexander Trial - The State vs. Jodi Arias' started by SK174, Apr 8, 2013.

  1. SK174

    SK174 New Member

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  3. nursebeeme

    nursebeeme Registered User

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    this is a huge issue and will be one on rebuttal. The defense has already tried to block the state on even carrying out tests on shelving. This thread is OPEN FOR DISCUSSION
     
  4. wasnt_me

    wasnt_me New Member

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    Does anyone live in Travis' house? Seems like they should be able to just go there and have JW stand on it (since nurmi used JW in the jammed finger experiment).
     
  5. ladonna

    ladonna New Member

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    I believe Flores went to the home on March 14 and tested the shelves. This is the info that the state is attempting to present to the jury.
     
  6. Buttered Fly

    Buttered Fly New Member

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    Yes, someone lives in the house. Katiecoolady posted awhile back that the Alexander family actually met the homeowners and were invited in. That was the first time one of the sisters was ever in the home. I believe I have that information correct. If I don't someone please correct me and if I can find the post I will link it here.
     
  7. MeeBee

    MeeBee New Member

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    I think once the state presents this it is all over. Done. If any juror is feeling sympathetic and trying to believe her story of woe, this will make it clear her version of events did not happen and be forced to concede she is a liar and her story from that could not have happened, which means...no self defense.
     
  8. tlcya

    tlcya Administrator Staff Member Administrator

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    First of all, :welcome5: SK174
     
  9. IHAVENOCLUE

    IHAVENOCLUE Active Member

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    Do we know when the court will rule whether the testing of the shelves in the closet will be admitted or not?

    I do not understand exactly what precedence could be used to deny the use of the testing of the shelves...

    In the court docs posted above there is a case sited as precedence... But I have to admit I did not read the details...

    sorry if my legal lingo is incorrect... I am no expert.... Evidently... :giggle:

    JMO


    TIA:seeya:
     
  10. MeeBee

    MeeBee New Member

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    This would be a good question for the legal thread but one of the lawyers said something about Juan needing to prove these are the same shelves from June 4 and that they are in the same condition.

    But hey, if they are the same shelves then they should get to use them! (That was me :) )
     
  11. IHAVENOCLUE

    IHAVENOCLUE Active Member

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    Thanks, MeeBee!

    I would think using the same type of shelves... Obtained from pics/Det. Flores investigation/etc. would be sufficient for use in testing...

    for instance... If testing the results of a baseball swing to someone's head... And the exact baseball bat had been lost... Wouldn't a similar bat of same weight, length, make, and model be admitted as evidence?

    Kind of seems like Legal Testing of Evidence 101 to me....

    But, again, I am no expert.... :dunno:

    In other words... It seems like the DT is really stretching to prevent this evidence in court... Since it would pretty well break the case for them...

    JMO
     
  12. 2Hip2BSquare

    2Hip2BSquare Former Member

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    "Any testimony regarding the weight capacity of the shelves that currently stand in the Master Bedroom Closet at 11428 E Queensborough Ave, Mesa, Arizona 85212, and/or the reaction these shelves would have to her weight should be precluded as irrelevant and inadmissible pursuant to Rules 401 and 402 Arizona Rules of Evidence."


    Haha! I think she had the gun in the pocket of her robe that she put on after sex/while taking pics of Travis.
     
  13. 2Hip2BSquare

    2Hip2BSquare Former Member

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    P.s. anyone ever get the urge to call the defense "Bert'n'ernie" like me. Love yalls.

    But anyhow, thank you and your post IS relevant and so so important. Thank you and please share anything else you feel is important! Great eye!
     
  14. miscalling

    miscalling New Member

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    #1464
    Today, 01:33 PM

    Kamille
    Registered User

    Join Date: May 2009
    Posts: 5,713
    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MrsPC
    couldn't sleep last night thinking about this case but was wondering about the timeline for Arias clean-up of the crime scene & subsequent drive to W Jordan UT to see Burns.

    5:33pm the photo of the bloody baseboards is accidentally shot

    Travis is killed, then Arias drags his body to the shower.

    Arias deletes photos from the camera.

    Arias washes & dries all the bedding. Arias washes another load of clothing, towels, the camera, etc.

    Arias pours water in the bathroom floor & along the hall & possibly turns on the shower to wash away evidence there.

    Arias moves some furniture around downstairs, a new floor cleaning machine is left sitting out, she puts up the dog gate so Napoleon can't go upstairs & she locks Travis bedroom door.

    Supposedly per her testimony her luggage & stuff had already been loaded into the car earlier in the day.

    At 10:30pm she calls Burns to tell him she got lost & will be in UT the next morning.

    Near the AZ/NV Hoover dam checkpoint Arias supposedly pulls over on the side of the road and changes her bloody clothes & washes her hands.

    At 11:37pm, 11:48pm & 11:53pm phone records reflect she called Travis phone. Records show she was between Kingman, AZ and the NV border when the calls were made. This area is about 206 miles or 3.5 hrs from Travis home. And, this area is still 75 miles away from the Hoover Dam border area where Arias claims she pulled over & changed her bloody clothes.

    Considering the 5:33pm photo of the bloody baseboards & the 11:37 pm call to Travis phone from an area only 3.5 hours away from his home -- means Arias had about 2.5 hours (because of the time of the calls to Travis phone -11:37pm) to clean up the crime scene at Travis home, do the laundry, dispose of the rope (if there really was a rope,) dispose of the gun, the knife and her bloody clothes -- all IN Arizona.

    here's a map - A is Travis home, B is the area where Arias calls to Travis phone were made, & C is Hoover Dam checkpoint area where Arias claims she pulled over and D is where Burns resided

    http://goo.gl/maps/mF4te

    Arias arrived at W Jordan UT between 10 & 11:00am per Burns (per google maps it's about 11 hr trip from Mesa)
    I'm sceptical about the laundry issue because I tend to think that the bedding may have been put in the washer after the sex but prior to the killing. Either JA in her "helpful cleaning lady way" or TA because he was a bit OCD about cleanliness apparently. So if that's the case, all she had to do in the clean up was transfer the bed linens from washer to dryer (where they were found) and drop in the new washer load and turn it on before leaving.

    MOO

    She did testify that they put the sheets in the washer after sex but before shower pics.
     
  15. Bernina

    Bernina Active Member

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    I don't see why the Prosecution can't just bring in the actual shelves. I can't remember who built those homes (it was a some what well known developer who does "tract" homes) but the closet shelving might have been part of the amenities package..........which would mean the developer would contact the contractor who would know who the shelving was built and installed by. Bring in a 5'6, 120-125 lbs gal and let her do a demonstration. I mean, JA really got into detail how she popped up to the top shelf and reached back to get the gun while only having her toes on the edge of the shelf....either the 2nd or 3rd.
    Major fail, folks, I have several well made shelving units like that, you put more weight at the front edge that what is on the actual shelve and the whole shelf flips towards you, to say nothing about the weight rating. Mine have a load max of 20-30 lbs, depending on the length of the shelf. At 5'1 and 105 lbs, I'm sure not going to climb them!
    :floorlaugh:
     
  16. IHAVENOCLUE

    IHAVENOCLUE Active Member

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    I so agree that it seems to be fairly easy to track down the original shelves (if they have been removed since 2008), or create workable demos...

    Again... It sounds like DT is throwing up a smokescreen...

    and if the Prosecution CAN'T use demos... Then I want to know why... And in detail!

    JMO
     
  17. GoAskAllie

    GoAskAllie New Member

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    During one of the interrogation tapes--the one in which Jodi finally admits to being in Travis's home on June 4--Detective Flores asks her if the roommates were home when she arrived. She's rambling and throwing up her usual diversion tactics with all sorts of nonsense--including that the walls were thin and the builder was KB Homes. JA said one of the roommate's bedroom shared a common wall with Travis's masters suite and how loud or quiet they could be depended on whether the roommates were home. Blah, blah, blah.
     
  18. Dr. Nick

    Dr. Nick New Member

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    Maybe I'm overconfident about the trial so far, but there's a part of me that really doesn't want to see a shelf demonstration.

    Even if the prosecution gets to show that a 120 pound woman will tip or break the shelf under most circumstances, the defense will be allowed to try to counter that assertion. They'll find a way for a 120 pound gymnast to perform a toe-balancing, leaping grab and make it look like Jodi could have accomplished the same thing. Even if it messes with the nice, orderly shelves they'll claim that Foggy Jodi straightened up.

    They have enough for premeditation in my opinion, and after that the rest doesn't matter. I hope JA builds his rebuttal around the stolen gun, the gas cans, the witnesses who "misspoke" and then recanted about her destination, and her inconsistent story about where it happened. Even their expert psychologist doesn't have to do much more than spend an hour testifying about how sloppy both defense experts were.

    Leave the closet issue alone. Once you prove that the planning and the lies started before June 4th and that, by Jodi's own admission, Travis didn't have a gun, the rest is moot.
     
  19. Ammonitida

    Ammonitida New Member

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    A small correction. The phone calls were made north-west of Kingman, not in Kingman itself (which is 206 miles away from Mesa). The cell tower that was hit was located 47 miles north-west of Kingman, around 28 miles from Hoover Dam. Here's a more accurate map of where the three calls were made
    http://goo.gl/maps/YMdWb
     
  20. Ammonitida

    Ammonitida New Member

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    And here's an illustration of her cell phone alibi -- where it was first turned off and where it was turned back on.

    http://goo.gl/maps/YNYpg

    Jodi supporters think this is just pure coincidence.
     
  21. Madeleine74

    Madeleine74 Of course it's my opinion; who else's would it be?

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    While it would be very entertaining and I personally would like to see such a demo with shelves, I sure don't want anything to derail the trial or cause an issue that could result in an appealable appellate issue. They've already proven premeditation 3 times over so don't need it for a conviction. But yes, I'd still like to see it for my own selfish reasons.
     

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