Discussion in 'Sheri, Garrett and Gavin Coleman' started by Patty G, Jul 21, 2009.
Hi everyone! Thanks so much Tricia and moderators for the forum!! :clap:
My apologies! ****** mentioned in the Billings thread that the general discussion thread was no longer needed and I got mixed up again. I've been bouncing around too much today :crazy: I can see why it is more necessary in the Billings thread since there is a baseball team full of perps on that case. <whew!>
Thanks so much, Patty G, for all your help here!!! This is a fascinating case with a lot of great sleuthers. Hope you enjoy being our mod
Documents in Coleman case to be turned over to lawyers
More than 400 pages of Joyce Meyer Ministries documents filed in a wrongful death lawsuit against former employee Christopher Coleman will be released Thursday to plaintiff's lawyers, but not to the public.
The documents were at the Monroe County Circuit Clerk's office Tuesday being copied. They will be placed under seal until 2 p.m. Thursday, when they are set to be released to Jack Carey, the attorney who represents murder victim Sheri Coleman's mother and brother in the wrongful death lawsuit filed against Christopher Coleman.
"Discovery is no longer filed with the court," Carey explained Tuesday. "The court files just became too voluminous to handle all those documents. The documents are only entered into the court record if there's a dispute."
Carey and Enrico Mirabelli, Sheri Coleman's cousin and Carey's co-counsel, said Monday they would not have a "wholesale distribution" of the documents.
Coleman, the former personal bodyguard of televangelist Joyce Meyer, faces three counts of first-degree murder in the ligature strangulations of his 31-year-old wife and their sons, Gavin, 9, and Garrett, 11. They were found dead May 5 in their beds at their Columbia home.
Joyce Meyer Ministries was named as a "respondent in discovery" which means the ministry isn't a party to the lawsuit, but must provide the information Carey and Mirabelli need to investigate their claim against Coleman.
Michael James King, the ministries' lawyer, argued unsuccessfully Monday against release of those documents without a protective order that would bar Mirabelli and Carey from making the information public.
more at http://www.bnd.com/breaking_news/story/852884.html
I'm just getting used to this case having a forum and discovered there's a thread for the lawsuit ~ my apologies for posting the article here if it doesn't belong.
I think we are all just getting used to it! I'm trying to post in the topic threads so it will be easier for us to locate once the two cases (criminal and civil) go to trial and we are trying to pull up old info. AND for the newbies, of course, who are the MAIN reason! :blowkiss:
It is great to post it here with a link so we can go discuss it on that thread.
ETA: I went back and moved my confused question there, too! LOL
Okee dokee! I think we've got the new forum all pretty now! Can't wait for the gang to arrive!!!
I put the article over where it belongs too ~ so it's in both places.
You guys have done an AWESOME job of setting up the forum - I am in awe \o/
Like they say...if you build it...they will come. LOL So where are "they"?!
TOOT TOOTIE! Present and accounted for. Trying to find everything.
Good to see ya'll!
Good to see you, too..Wrinkles! How is your man?
Hey there m'dear SeriouslySearching,
OT: My man is doing FAR better! Thanks for asking. He had a slow roll getting up to speed after this lil rendezvous with surgery. This was a replacement of his heart device (a defibrillator). This time they had to do some plundering of his chest muscles to get the device seated better (the device had looked like it was going to pop out of his skin, you could actually see the top of the device and the wires, right through and under his very thin skin). So there was muscular pain, then the aftermath of the anesthetics and general fatigue and weakness in recuperating (they have to shock the heart a few times during testing ), AND then his heart kept doing this weird speeding up thing whenever he would take a few steps. That was scary because a speedy heart can mean a 700 volt whammo blammo. We figured it was a setting on the new device, appears we were right, that was fixed yesterday. SO, he is a far happier camper AND so am I. Took the steri strips off tonight, doc was a real pro with his incision and stitching. Got his first shower in 10 days YAHOO! I'm just very very glad that his heart started right back up during testing -- yes I was scared, sick to pieces scared. I'm okay now that he is
Back on thread...
Took some notes from the search warrants here:
Noticed this on page 5:
>>During the interview with Christopher, he told investigators he left the residence around 0545 hours. He used his cellular phone to call Sheri's cellular phone, described as a T-Mobile cellular phone bearing phone number 314-359-995. Sheri did not answer the phone. He tried to call Sheri a few more times. Sheri did not answer the phone. He left a message on her cellular phone. He sent her three instant messages at 0623 hours. He sent her two instant messages at 0627 hours. He became worried and called Sergeant Barlow.
A subpoena was sent to AT&T requesting for the call record regarding Christopher's Blackberry phone. The call records show that Christopher made calls to Sheri's cellular phone on 5/5/09 at 0544 hours, 0634 hours, 0642 hours, and 0653 hours.<<
Well we know the neighbors surveillance camera saw him leave at 5:43, so CC called immediately after leaving -- go figure, you just leave your wife and call to wake her up? Then he calls again at 6:34. Let's see, that means he called 50 minutes later. Wow, he must have been adamant about seeing that she got up at 5:44, eh? (Scuse me, you call every few minutes if you want to see to it that someone is getting up at say 5:45 or so, not 50 minutes later.) Problem is, IF he would have called her earlier, the cell towers might have caught him at the location next to where he dumped the glove maybe?
So...you figure, it took 15 minutes to get to the gym, 15 minutes to get home from the gym. Seems we heard he arrived home at 6:51, must have been a touch later. Say he arrived home just after that 6:53 call. Then he was "where" when that 6:34 call was made? Just out of a scrub at the gym bathroom (do they have showers in the bathrooms there?)
Okay locals...someone help me... Does the location of the glove indicate he threw it out on the way TO the gym or the the way FROM the gym?
And speaking of that glove...
And about that glove... Check out p. 46 SW May 7th dated, May 13th filed.
>>Investigators from the Major Case Squad conducted a search of the area from 2854 Robert Drive, Columbia, Illinois, to the Jefferson Barracks Bridge. During the search, an investigator found a latex glove lying on the side of the highway near Mile Marker 5. The latex glove had what appeared to be red spray paint on it.
Investigators went to Christopher's place of employment at the Joyce Meyer's Ministry at 700 Grace Parkway, Fenton, Missouri. A box of gloves was located that were similar to the glove found on the side of the highway in the Security Office Manager's office belonging to Mike Cole. Christopher has a Great Grand Master (GGM) key to that particular office.<<
Hmmm are those right handed or left handed or unihanded gloves? Was that glove found on the 5th? (p. 46, top of page, "Investigators from the Major Case Squad of Greater St. Louis were activated.") I think that was the first day...so wonder if the glove was found that day.
Looking at page 44:
>>they saw red spray paint sprayed all over the walls on the first story.<<
Looking at page 45:
>>They saw more red spray paint on the wall, going up the stairs.<<
Whole lotta painting going on for it to say "all over" -- hmmm...
Looking at page 48:
>>..., I did on May 9th, 2009, seize and take possession of the following instruments, articles, or things:
Joint finger prints, and all palm images, including full palm with fingers, partial palm, and writer's palm prints belonging to Christopher E. Coleman.<<
Hmmm... joint finger prints? Inside a glove at the joints of the fingers? Hmmm... the writer's palm prints?
Check this print page out, page 2
Also, check this abstract...
>>Identification of individual by signature examination could be improved by the lateral palm print examination. By the use of new technique discussed by the author in this paper, the forensic expert can find out very useful information about the writer of writings even without going into the depth of questioned document/signature examination and without the formal or informal handwriting exemplars. The document expert with little more knowledge of the palm print can identify whether the signature is done by hand/leg/anything else, whether the author is right handed or left handed, the approximate age of the author, whether the signature is genuine or forged. Such information of author would be very much useful in elimination of the list of suspects of anonymous letters. In order to fix the authorship, standard and disputed lateral palm prints can be examined either with photographic superimposition technique or with the statistical study of the outline of the lateral palm print or with the standard method as implied in fingerprint examination. The evidential value of such lateral palm print can be placed at par with the finger prints in the court of law and could be placed right on the top of all other scientific evidences.<<
Do you think the writer's palm print was to help on identifying if CC or someone else signed the Quit Claim?
And while we're braining and putting some things out there to remember...
Let's head back to this document, SW filed May 14, 2009:
>>On November 18, 2008 the Columbia Police Department received a complaint from Christopher Coleman about a threatening letter he received via his work email email@example.com from the Gmail account firstname.lastname@example.org. The letter read "Tell Joyce to stop preaching the bull**** or Chris's family will die. If I can't get to Joyce then I will get to someone close to her and if I can't get to him then I will kill his wife and kids. I know Joyce's schedule so then I know Chris's schedule. If Joyce doesn't quit preaching the bull**** then they will die. During the Houston conference I will them all as they sleep. If I don't hit there then I will kill them during the booktour or the trip to India. I know where he lives and I know they are alone. F[xxx] them all and they will die soon!"<<
[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3968623&postcount=1124"]Panthera responded:[/ame] :blowkiss:
>>First of all, since the e-mail was sent back in November, how do we spell PREMEDITATION????? Who was CC really in the grand scheme of her ministry that his wife and children would be a target of someone seeking revenge against JM? It doesn't make sense. And another thing, if the threats were that serious, why would he still live in the same house and leave it unsecured? MOO <<
Yes MAM Panthera SOOOO good of you to notice that overt premeditation of "when" Chris planned to kill his family i.e. "as they sleep." I got short circuited the day I typed up [ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=3968495&postcount=1123"]that original message suggesting that we play with the above SW text.[/ame] I had wanted to get some points out then...I'll get them out now.
A. "threatening letter he received via his work email email@example.com" -- Chris Coleman was in security, who would have any clue that he picked up webmaster mail at JMM UNLESS the person writing the threatening email was Chris? Did he pick up all webmaster mail or was that his day to pick it up?
B. There could be any number of people reading "webmaster" mail at a large org -- so why would someone send that to webmaster Chris C receive it. CC probably had his own firstname.lastname@example.org email address so why did that go to the webmaster instead of CC's personal address?
C. "Chris's" family will die. Scuse me, how many "Chris's" work at JMM? Which "Chris's" family will die? Would any old webmaster know which "Chris" was being referred to in this threatening email?
D. "If I can't get to Joyce then I will get to someone close to her" -- how many "Chris" named people might have been close to JM? Did she have any secretaries or helpers known as Chris? Oh...but this person now mentions the Chris' "wife and kids." So this is a guy Chris. Was there only one guy named Chris at JMM that had a wife and kids?
E. DING DING DING DING DING -- LOOK AT THIS QUOTE THEN ITEM F
"and if I can't get to him then I will kill his wife and kids."
F. "I know Joyce's schedule so then I know Chris's schedule." Oh, well, enter that this threat is starting to refer to someone that travelled with JM (later references in the threat combined.) So...they are so all knowing that they know that CC is "always" with JM. Hmmm this person doesn't assume that CC doesn't take sick leave or vacation time?
BUT WAIT A MINUTE! This person KNOWS CC's schedule and wrote "and if I can't get to him." HELLO... if you wanted "him" then "him" was right there at the house where you killed the wife and kids -- so how is it that you couldn't get to him when he openly walked out to his car to go to the gym? After all, you knew his schedule. Further, if CC didn't know the neighbor had a surveillance camera pinned on his residence, then how could you? Really, how hard was it to get to "him" since you knew his schedule?
G. "On November 18, 2008 the Columbia Police Department received a complaint from Christopher Coleman about a threatening letter he received via his work email email@example.com from the Gmail account firstname.lastname@example.org." and "...I will them all as they sleep."
DING DING DING DING DING! Panthera, you are so right! The killing of this family was planned by someone who COULD get to Chris Coleman but that was never their intention because they WERE Chris Coleman. Way back in Nov 2008, Chris planned to kill his family as they sleep.
You can almost bet that CC was one of very few that knew who actually received and read email@example.com email (was that in his job description?) The person who wrote that threat, if they knew CC's schedule, they knew when they could get to JM or CC and just how easy that would really be. Additionally, any security minded person who read that email should have known that the intention wasn't to get to JM or CC -- the intention was to get to Sheri and the children.
CC knew the capabilities, or lack of them, of the Columbia Police Dept. due to a threat of this nature. He knew what to do to protect his wife and children as they slept - but he would never protect them from him, CC, who premeditated their murder as they slept.
Next note... How might this "Fans of Joyce Meyers Bodyguard" Facebook group play in to all of this? Who removed it after the murders? Whose site was it? What was that all about?
From this article:
>>Mary E. Davis, a staffer at Joyce Meyer Ministries told an Illinois investigator, "That a Facebook group account titled something to the effect of Fans of Joyce Meyer Bodyguard," was available on the Internet until the site was removed after the murders. Davis said that on Sept. 19, 2008, she had a record of an a "Natalie Johnson," an apparent fan, asking about Coleman.
"Does anyone know Chris' e-mail address? I'd like to send him a note," Johnson e-mailed, according to the search warrant.<<
Also see this SW document page 54.
Sept 19, 2008 request to have Chris' email address. Nov 18, 2008 threat sent to webmaster's email address. "Does ya'll think" this request for an email address was a part of the setup? "Does ya'll think" someone said, "you can write Chris at firstname.lastname@example.org? Might this fan of Chris' have been another one of his party girls?
What's with this "Fans of Joyce Meyers Bodyguard" -- just seems really really strange to me.
I think it was completely set up by Chris as part of his "psycho ninja killers were threatening me and my job at Joyce Meyer Ministries" plan. The only other plausible idea is that Chris had some JMM staffer, or some other female, dopey over him and gushingly sympathetic to the idea that this poor poor good-looking Christian guy who's so nice to her (who never gets any male attention) is getting threats on his life and needs all the prayers and support he can get from everyone! So let's make up a website, Chris! I'll do it! For you, manly bodyguard, for you.
But I think it's way more likely that Chris set up the site himself. A few innocents, like Natalie Johnson, might get sucked in.
Sorry--I do NOT KNOW that "Natalie" is named "Natalie Johnson." That was a MISTAKE based on an email I was sent privately with some speculation. Let the rumor die that the Natalie of the FOJMB is named Johnson. I DO NOT KNOW THAT.
How eerie this was to me:
This morning as I was going through my email, I found one from our local Freecycle group. Someone was offering up "a 4-tape series entitled "Get a Grip and Stop Running" by Bible teacher Joyce Meyer."
If only Chris had "gotten a grip" we wouldn't be sitting here discussing these tragic and senseless murders.
Separate names with a comma.