Discussion in 'JonBenet Ramsey' started by madeleine, Nov 4, 2009.
Same writer?Don't analyse,what does your first instinct tell you?
I am staggered that anyone is saying 'no.' Prima facie, they are identical and, ultima facie, they are close enough that you couldn't put a stick of chewing gum between them.
First instinct tells me...
'not enough data to hang anyone'.
Of course that wasn't a poll choice.
One single character of writing is not going to make any handwriting analyst happy. Studying hundreds of characters from two different writers and placing the most similar next to each other will produce a false positive, IMO.
There were handwriting experts complaining that the PR exemplars they had weren't enough and were written in the wrong pen for analysis.
I suggest looking at it from the same POV as the pros. That is, what is the probability that PR could've authored the ENTIRE ransom note (Not just one letter)? That is really the question at hand, BTW.
According to a linguist its nearly zero.
It was a simple question with no trick behind it,
why so defensive about it HOTYH?
So your first instinct told ya you need to defend PR.
OK you'll get no more response from me! I understand.
Of course I won't, that's what you always do,as long as something doesn't fit your IDI theory or someone asks a question you don't like you become very quiet.I understand too!
Enjoying your thread here...Fine, sample to show how PR and the RN as alot of similarties..Just by glance you can see this....
Same person, different pen.
I don't intend to take this to court,it's not MY job.But seems that the ones who should are still sleeping.
I didn't want to start another PR did or didn't write the ransom note thread but since we were talking about prima facie ..........sometimes you don't even have to dig that deep...
A jury might not even have the patience to hear 100 experts arguing re she did or she didn't write the note because this and that..but they might look at these two samples and say "yep,it's the same writer" or "nope,it's not written by the same person"...............
We've seen enough trials when the jury made a decision based on............a planted glove and a bit of racism,didn't we?Why do you think it would be different in this case and jurors would listen for hundreds of hours to boring linguistic testimony?
Last I checked, no one's talking about "hanging" anyone, HOTYH. It was a simple question.
We know that, HOTYH. The thing here is, madeleine only posted one of MANY examples.
At first, certainly.
I couldn't have put it better myself!
I'm glad one of us does, because I sure don't.
You're kidding, right? Colorado is a capital murder state, and this forum is heavily populated by RDI. Those who would like nothing better for possibly innocent person to be convicted of child murder.
Sorry but thats a laugh!
Alex Hunter has hinted that he wanted to take exactly that approach.
I never kid about this case, HOTYH.
The two are not mutually inclusive, HOTYH. Even if we DID want someone to hang, that's up to the courts. Second, establishing guilt is not the same as administering punishment. Third, as madeleine said, this is not an attempt to restart the old "did PR or didn't she" argument. This was an attempt for people, who theoretically might not know who wrote those examples, to say the first thing which came into their minds. Like madeleine, I don't see any reason for your need to reflexively defend PR. Maybe someday you won't rush to ascribe the worst motives to us.
That insult is beneath my consideration.
The only laugh here is your jumping to conclusions about our motives. Neither accurate nor appreciated. Indeed, your defensive manner tells me a fair deal about your motives, but since I'm a gentleman, I won't make anything of that.
EXACTLY.That was my intention.
Yeah,we must be all mentally ill!
You have no idea what I'd like,trust me.But I could guess what you'd like.Actually,what you wanted already happened so why so defensive?Are you afraid someone might flush Lacy's decision down the toilet one day and start a real investigation?
HOTYH: I am sorry but I am just catching up after a few days off. Honestly, tho' but, you aren't seriously suggesting that anyone would have faced the death penalty in Boulder for this crime? Even IDI have to allow for a distinction between Boulder and the rest of Colorado in terms of justice.
Turning the tables on you, though, you talk about RDI wanting nothing better than possibly innocent people to be convicted of child murder. This is frankly risible. Admittedly, your suspect is so remote that you don't expect him ever to be identified, let alone convicted, so no one can accuse you of rushing to hang an innocent person. However, RDI have analysed this case inside out, so it is reprehensible of you to suggest that we are some kind of lynch mob.
WRT the original question asked by Madeleine, she was just asking a simple question that asked only a simple, honest answer. There is absolutely nothing that could convict Patsy in the two samples so I can't quite see why you wouldn't admit of a certain similarity. We admit that the DNA might be that of the killer. You can surely admit of a couple of letters looking similar...
Again, unless a suspect who fits your profile turns up, I think you actually think that the test in this case should be Beyond Any Doubt. Remember, though, that you'll be held to this if ever revolutionary socialist from a monarchy with combat-training and a propensity for wearing women's clothes ever shows up...
I'm not really sure about the women's clothing idea. But the revolutionary socialist from a monarchy with combat training is exactly right. I'll stick by that one.
As far as RDI wanting to convict JR and PR for the murder of their daughter, this is a fact. That they are possibly innocent is also a fact.
The LAST thing RDI should want to do is to convince a jury that JBR was previously abused, that PR lost it and accidentally killed her, covered it up to make it look like a murder by foreign faction, and manipulated LE the day of the murder. Because everything I just typed is in fact mere speculation on
RDI instead should want to rule out an intruder, and that has not been accomplished.
I wouldn't mind doing it.
I looks the same, but with different pen widths. I have never seen an "e" that looks like that, not even from family members who write in block or semi-block letters.
So, is one from the letter and one from Patsy's sample? I have not followed this much.
Who knows? That information wasn't provided. I guess this is supposed to be the 'how can you deny THIS' thread.
Separate names with a comma.